No golf today
 

On 2/23/2016 7:44 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:22:36 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

As for little speakers, I'm just not convinced how well they can defy
the laws of physics, especially in the mid to lower ranges. My father in
law had an array of Bose speakers, professionally installed, and when I
first heard them, I thought they sounded like what you'd hear in the
average four speaker car radio system...but I never told him that, of
course.

===

If you like your speakers you can keep your speakers.

Bose must be doing something right because people like their products.
They've obviously invested a lot of time and talent in making smaller
speakers more effective, and it seems to work.


That has become the primary focus of Bose products. Big sound out of
small packages. The original and unique concept of Dr. Bose was the
idea of a "direct/reflecting" speaker design. That was what the
original 901 speaker was all about.

BTW, Bose makes a "professional" series of speakers, including a 901
type, that are favored by many large sound stage venues and concert halls.

No golf today
 

On 2/23/2016 8:11 PM, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 17:56:04 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:


As some wag once wrote:

No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

With the sub woof, there is plenty of low.



Not long after Bose introduced the 901's they also introduced the
original 501 series. The 501 had a 10" woofer and two small combination
mid-range and tweeter drivers. One of the mid-range/tweeter
drivers was aimed backwards to bounce off a wall. In fact, the early
501's (series III) had a knob on the top that allowed you to adjust the
angle of the back firing driver. I had a set of the original 501's and
later a set of the series III. They had more than enough bass response
for the average living room. Biggest difference was the originals were
4 ohms and the later series (starting with III) were 8 ohms.

No golf today
 

On 2/24/16 12:06 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/23/2016 5:56 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 10:46:05 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 8:24 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 07:44:01 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:58 AM, John H. wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 20:26:17 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2016 21:37:40 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:38:42 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

Ditzy Dan Kruger blathers...
True North wrote:
Oh boy...now I feel really cold.
Local CBC says it's minus 12C but feels like minus 23C due
to wind.
I'd better buy a new outdoor thermometer...or place the
current
one further from the house.
"Sure you can afford one?"

I can afford to buy a new boat, dummy.
Wife and I picked out one yesterday at the local boat show.
So? Come on...tell us more. Pictures?

Here I've spent hours reading and listening to computer sound
systems, and you're
doing something constructive!
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!
I have these. The controller is outstanding!

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/...nion5_graphite

I looked at that in Best Buy. If they'd had one in stock, I may
have brought it home.
Luckily, they were out of them. I came home, moved the
subwoofer to a different spot,
and listened to the Saint-Saëns symphony at a reasonable
volume. Sounded great, so
I'm going to stick with these old Logitech Z2300s for a while
longer.
--



I bought mine from the Bose outlet store. 30% off retail and
they seem
to hold their distributors to retail prices.

Amazon, Best Buy, Bose, etc, all want $399 for the Companion 5s.
Only used, on Ebay,
is there a different price that I saw.

If I were to go with a different set, those would be the
speakers, I think.
--

Interesting that Bose doesn't include frequency response in its
on-line
specs, unless I missed it.

http://dreamandreach.bose.com/en_US/...sychoacoustics

--

Ahh, so the frequency response numbers must be pretty crappy in
comparison to similarly priced speakers from other
manufacturers...enjoy.

I've never been disappointed with any set of Bose speakers. Of
course, unlike you I
don't listen to the frequency response numbers. I listen to the music.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!


As some wag once wrote:


No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

That slogan has been around since the early 1970's, started by either
audio elitists who misunderstood what Bose was marketing and selling in
the 901 series speakers or by one of the competing "high end" speaker
manufacturers of the day. The Bose 901 speaker design was originally
unique in the respect that it employed the "direct/reflecting" concept
in a fairly small enclosure for the standards of the time. You have to
remember that the "high end" speakers of the 1960's (the 901's were
introduced in 1968) were typically large, heavy, (sometimes double
walled and sand filled) monstrosities that contained a large 12" or 15"
woofer, mid-range and various types of tweeter drivers. The 901's were
an attempt to create a sound stage effect by reflecting most of the
sound off the walls behind the speakers.

The big problem is that few people had living rooms that allowed the
901's to be set up properly. They depend on proper spacing away from
hard walls (not curtains or drapes) to sound good. They also shouldn't
be placed symmetrically in a room (meaning both speakers being the same
distance from a side wall). Guys who understood the placement
requirements might have tried but wives usually prevailed in terms of
where they ended up in a room. Been there, done that.

Another bit about the 901's: Without the Bose equalizer they sound
terrible. I've seen vintage 901's set up and being used without the
equalizer because it was either lost or not working. Waste of time.
Try to find a vintage Bose equalizer on eBay or elsewhere. They don't
come up for sale often.

That all said, the 901's *can* sound wonderful if properly set up. I
have had the unique opportunity to compare a fully functional set (with
equalizer) that were made in 1980 to a pair of "high end" (for their
day) four foot high JBL studio monitor monsters. Both speaker sets are
up in a large garage with the 901's having the benefit of hard,
sheetrock walls behind them.

The 901's sound better overall to my ears and to everyone who has
listened to both in a casual "blind" test. The JBL's sound great.
The Bose 901's are clearer though with crisper highs and about the same
level of bass as the JBL's. More importantly is the
sound stage image they project as compared to the JBL's. The Bose
concept works *if* you pay attention to how they are setup.

As for other, contemporary Bose products, they are simply an over-priced
way to get "big" sound out of small enclosures, IMO. The original
direct/reflecting concept has been dropped in favor of things like
waveguides to reinforce bass in a small package. Other audio equipment
manufacturers have adopted similar waveguide designs over the years that
are much less expensive to purchase.

Oh ... one other comment for Harry. Bose has never officially published
the frequency response curves for any of their products.
It's basically meaningless anyway when comparing similar sized speakers.
A set of speakers with a theoretically "perfect", flat
response curve from 20Hz to 20kHz are not going to sound the same
set up in different rooms. The acoustics of the room itself
has a major impact on how they sound. Same is true in your favorite
concert hall. Millions are spent on the design and acoustic treatment
of the hall in order to "equalize" the sound of all the various
instruments in a symphony orchestra.



Thanks. My points of reference these days remain my electrostatics and a
friend's setup with genuine Klipschhorns.

No golf today
 

On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 20:14:15 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:53 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:22:36 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:19 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 17:56:04 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 10:46:05 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 8:24 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 07:44:01 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:58 AM, John H. wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 20:26:17 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2016 21:37:40 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:38:42 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

Ditzy Dan Kruger blathers...
True North wrote:
Oh boy...now I feel really cold.
Local CBC says it's minus 12C but feels like minus 23C due to wind.
I'd better buy a new outdoor thermometer...or place the current
one further from the house.
"Sure you can afford one?"

I can afford to buy a new boat, dummy.
Wife and I picked out one yesterday at the local boat show.
So? Come on...tell us more. Pictures?

Here I've spent hours reading and listening to computer sound systems, and you're
doing something constructive!
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!
I have these. The controller is outstanding!

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/...nion5_graphite
I looked at that in Best Buy. If they'd had one in stock, I may have brought it home.
Luckily, they were out of them. I came home, moved the subwoofer to a different spot,
and listened to the Saint-Saëns symphony at a reasonable volume. Sounded great, so
I'm going to stick with these old Logitech Z2300s for a while longer.
--



I bought mine from the Bose outlet store. 30% off retail and they seem
to hold their distributors to retail prices.

Amazon, Best Buy, Bose, etc, all want $399 for the Companion 5s. Only used, on Ebay,
is there a different price that I saw.

If I were to go with a different set, those would be the speakers, I think.
--

Interesting that Bose doesn't include frequency response in its on-line
specs, unless I missed it.

http://dreamandreach.bose.com/en_US/...sychoacoustics
--

Ahh, so the frequency response numbers must be pretty crappy in
comparison to similarly priced speakers from other manufacturers...enjoy.

I've never been disappointed with any set of Bose speakers. Of course, unlike you I
don't listen to the frequency response numbers. I listen to the music.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!


As some wag once wrote:

No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

Yup. A 'wag'.

You skipped the question.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

No, Johnny, I'm not a racist pig full of hate, as you are.

As for little speakers, I'm just not convinced how well they can defy
the laws of physics, especially in the mid to lower ranges. My father in
law had an array of Bose speakers, professionally installed, and when I
first heard them, I thought they sounded like what you'd hear in the
average four speaker car radio system...but I never told him that, of
course.

Sounds like your father, God rest his soul, did two things wrong - fathered a liar
and didn't match speakers to the requirement. Professional installation of the wrong
speakers doesn't mean ****.

Get over yourself Krause.
--


My father preferred a Hammond B3 with a Leslie speaker. My father in law
was the Bose fan. I'm not sure you are in a position physically to judge
the quality of musical output from speakers.

Krause, I will say it again. Normal people buy speakers that produce sounds they
enjoy. You, obviously, prefer speakers which have suitable (to you) numbers. What
your father preferred has absolutely no bearing on anything, except perhaps to lend
some braggadocio to your arrogant arguments.

You're really stuck on yourself, eh Krause?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!

No golf today
 

On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 19:44:01 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:22:36 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

As for little speakers, I'm just not convinced how well they can defy
the laws of physics, especially in the mid to lower ranges. My father in
law had an array of Bose speakers, professionally installed, and when I
first heard them, I thought they sounded like what you'd hear in the
average four speaker car radio system...but I never told him that, of
course.

===

If you like your speakers you can keep your speakers.

Bose must be doing something right because people like their products.
They've obviously invested a lot of time and talent in making smaller
speakers more effective, and it seems to work.

I think Harry is infatuated with the 'numbers', not the sound reproduced by his
speakers.
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!

No golf today
 

John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 20:14:15 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:53 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:22:36 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:19 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 17:56:04 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 10:46:05 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 8:24 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 07:44:01 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:58 AM, John H. wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 20:26:17 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2016 21:37:40 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:38:42 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

Ditzy Dan Kruger blathers...
True North wrote:
Oh boy...now I feel really cold.
Local CBC says it's minus 12C but feels like minus 23C due to wind.
I'd better buy a new outdoor thermometer...or place the current
one further from the house.
"Sure you can afford one?"

I can afford to buy a new boat, dummy.
Wife and I picked out one yesterday at the local boat show.
So? Come on...tell us more. Pictures?

Here I've spent hours reading and listening to computer sound systems, and
you're
doing something constructive!
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!
I have these. The controller is outstanding!

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/...nion5_graphite
I looked at that in Best Buy. If they'd had one in stock, I
may have brought it home.
Luckily, they were out of them. I came home, moved the
subwoofer to a different spot,
and listened to the Saint-Saëns symphony at a reasonable
volume. Sounded great, so
I'm going to stick with these old Logitech Z2300s for a while longer.
--



I bought mine from the Bose outlet store. 30% off retail and they seem
to hold their distributors to retail prices.

Amazon, Best Buy, Bose, etc, all want $399 for the Companion
5s. Only used, on Ebay,
is there a different price that I saw.

If I were to go with a different set, those would be the speakers, I think.
--

Interesting that Bose doesn't include frequency response in its on-line
specs, unless I missed it.

http://dreamandreach.bose.com/en_US/...sychoacoustics
--

Ahh, so the frequency response numbers must be pretty crappy in
comparison to similarly priced speakers from other manufacturers...enjoy.

I've never been disappointed with any set of Bose speakers. Of course, unlike you I
don't listen to the frequency response numbers. I listen to the music.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!


As some wag once wrote:

No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

Yup. A 'wag'.

You skipped the question.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

No, Johnny, I'm not a racist pig full of hate, as you are.

As for little speakers, I'm just not convinced how well they can defy
the laws of physics, especially in the mid to lower ranges. My father in
law had an array of Bose speakers, professionally installed, and when I
first heard them, I thought they sounded like what you'd hear in the
average four speaker car radio system...but I never told him that, of
course.

Sounds like your father, God rest his soul, did two things wrong - fathered a liar
and didn't match speakers to the requirement. Professional installation of the wrong
speakers doesn't mean ****.

Get over yourself Krause.
--


My father preferred a Hammond B3 with a Leslie speaker. My father in law
was the Bose fan. I'm not sure you are in a position physically to judge
the quality of musical output from speakers.

Krause, I will say it again. Normal people buy speakers that produce sounds they
enjoy. You, obviously, prefer speakers which have suitable (to you) numbers. What
your father preferred has absolutely no bearing on anything, except perhaps to lend
some braggadocio to your arrogant arguments.

You're really stuck on yourself, eh Krause?
--



You brought up my father

--
Sent from my iPhone 6+

No golf today
 

On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 8:36:43 AM UTC-5, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 20:14:15 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:53 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 18:22:36 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:19 PM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 17:56:04 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 10:46:05 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 8:24 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 07:44:01 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:58 AM, John H. wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 20:26:17 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2016 21:37:40 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:38:42 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

Ditzy Dan Kruger blathers...
True North wrote:
Oh boy...now I feel really cold.
Local CBC says it's minus 12C but feels like minus 23C due to wind.
I'd better buy a new outdoor thermometer...or place the current
one further from the house.
"Sure you can afford one?"

I can afford to buy a new boat, dummy.
Wife and I picked out one yesterday at the local boat show.
So? Come on...tell us more. Pictures?

Here I've spent hours reading and listening to computer sound systems, and you're
doing something constructive!
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!
I have these. The controller is outstanding!

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/...nion5_graphite
I looked at that in Best Buy. If they'd had one in stock, I may have brought it home.
Luckily, they were out of them. I came home, moved the subwoofer to a different spot,
and listened to the Saint-Saëns symphony at a reasonable volume. Sounded great, so
I'm going to stick with these old Logitech Z2300s for a while longer.
--



I bought mine from the Bose outlet store. 30% off retail and they seem
to hold their distributors to retail prices.

Amazon, Best Buy, Bose, etc, all want $399 for the Companion 5s. Only used, on Ebay,
is there a different price that I saw.

If I were to go with a different set, those would be the speakers, I think.
--

Interesting that Bose doesn't include frequency response in its on-line
specs, unless I missed it.

http://dreamandreach.bose.com/en_US/...sychoacoustics
--

Ahh, so the frequency response numbers must be pretty crappy in
comparison to similarly priced speakers from other manufacturers....enjoy.

I've never been disappointed with any set of Bose speakers. Of course, unlike you I
don't listen to the frequency response numbers. I listen to the music.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!


As some wag once wrote:

No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

Yup. A 'wag'.

You skipped the question.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

No, Johnny, I'm not a racist pig full of hate, as you are.

As for little speakers, I'm just not convinced how well they can defy
the laws of physics, especially in the mid to lower ranges. My father in
law had an array of Bose speakers, professionally installed, and when I
first heard them, I thought they sounded like what you'd hear in the
average four speaker car radio system...but I never told him that, of
course.

Sounds like your father, God rest his soul, did two things wrong - fathered a liar
and didn't match speakers to the requirement. Professional installation of the wrong
speakers doesn't mean ****.

Get over yourself Krause.
--


My father preferred a Hammond B3 with a Leslie speaker. My father in law
was the Bose fan. I'm not sure you are in a position physically to judge
the quality of musical output from speakers.

Krause, I will say it again. Normal people buy speakers that produce sounds they
enjoy. You, obviously, prefer speakers which have suitable (to you) numbers. What
your father preferred has absolutely no bearing on anything, except perhaps to lend
some braggadocio to your arrogant arguments.

You're really stuck on yourself, eh Krause?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!

Electrostatics can be accurate, but require exacting placement in a dedicated listening room to sound right, as well as the right amplifier to drive them properly. They also have a limited low end. It's doubtful the harry has the room and equipment to setup and drive a pair properly.

The Klipschorn's, while expensive, are impressive sounding but tiresome to listen to. They do very well with bright, loud boomy material, but aren't known for being particularly accurate. Funny that he thinks they are something special, while thinking the kind of music you like (which is exactly what *they* like) is not worth listening to.

He should stick to googling something that he knows a little something about.

No golf today
 

On 2/24/16 9:18 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 23:01:03 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 20:18:59 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:



The price of a 135 hp Yamaha outboard is $14,000+, **** for brains. I
would guess you could buy at least two or maybe three I/O's of that
horsepower for that money.


I am surprised it is not MUCH higher since it would be a custom made
motor.Yamaha does not make a 135
OTOH you can get a 150 for less than 12k
http://www.boats.net/outboard_motor/...0HP/parts.html

Yamaha F150LB Four Stroke In-Line 466 lb

If you can find a 150 I/O with the drive and all of the other stuff
you need for that, buy it. Then we will look at your maintenance costs
over 10 years or so.



Ahh, I meant 150 like the Tammy I had. Merc makes or made a 135.

Merc hasn't made a 135 since the old tower of power days. AFAIK
You can get in a merc 150 for about 11k tho and the 115 I was looking
at was ~8k a couple years ago. I paid less than 7 for my 70 with all
of the rigging hardware. Yamaha usually comes with about $1000
premium. If the 60 was still US made I would have bought one. They
were going for about $6000 dropped in my driveway.

I did read several articles last night about I/O vs outboard and they
all say the I/O is heavier by hundreds of pounds. Most also use re
purposed car or truck motors. Mercruiser is making their own blocks
these days. I did have a hard time finding comparable hulls with
outboard or I/O except a few Tracker pontoon boats so the price thing
is still up in the air but price should include maintenance



I had a Merc 135 made and bought new in this century.

No golf today
 

On 2/24/2016 6:33 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/24/16 12:06 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/23/2016 5:56 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 10:46:05 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/23/16 8:24 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 07:44:01 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/23/16 6:58 AM, John H. wrote:
On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 20:26:17 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Sat, 20 Feb 2016 21:37:40 -0500, Alex wrote:

John H. wrote:
On Fri, 19 Feb 2016 19:38:42 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

Ditzy Dan Kruger blathers...
True North wrote:
Oh boy...now I feel really cold.
Local CBC says it's minus 12C but feels like minus 23C due
to wind.
I'd better buy a new outdoor thermometer...or place the
current
one further from the house.
"Sure you can afford one?"

I can afford to buy a new boat, dummy.
Wife and I picked out one yesterday at the local boat show.
So? Come on...tell us more. Pictures?

Here I've spent hours reading and listening to computer sound
systems, and you're
doing something constructive!
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!
I have these. The controller is outstanding!

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products/...nion5_graphite


I looked at that in Best Buy. If they'd had one in stock, I may
have brought it home.
Luckily, they were out of them. I came home, moved the
subwoofer to a different spot,
and listened to the Saint-Saëns symphony at a reasonable
volume. Sounded great, so
I'm going to stick with these old Logitech Z2300s for a while
longer.
--



I bought mine from the Bose outlet store. 30% off retail and
they seem
to hold their distributors to retail prices.

Amazon, Best Buy, Bose, etc, all want $399 for the Companion 5s.
Only used, on Ebay,
is there a different price that I saw.

If I were to go with a different set, those would be the
speakers, I think.
--

Interesting that Bose doesn't include frequency response in its
on-line
specs, unless I missed it.

http://dreamandreach.bose.com/en_US/...sychoacoustics


--

Ahh, so the frequency response numbers must be pretty crappy in
comparison to similarly priced speakers from other
manufacturers...enjoy.

I've never been disappointed with any set of Bose speakers. Of
course, unlike you I
don't listen to the frequency response numbers. I listen to the music.

Again, don't you ever just get f'ing sick of yourself?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!


As some wag once wrote:


No highs, no lows...must be Bose.

That slogan has been around since the early 1970's, started by either
audio elitists who misunderstood what Bose was marketing and selling in
the 901 series speakers or by one of the competing "high end" speaker
manufacturers of the day. The Bose 901 speaker design was originally
unique in the respect that it employed the "direct/reflecting" concept
in a fairly small enclosure for the standards of the time. You have to
remember that the "high end" speakers of the 1960's (the 901's were
introduced in 1968) were typically large, heavy, (sometimes double
walled and sand filled) monstrosities that contained a large 12" or 15"
woofer, mid-range and various types of tweeter drivers. The 901's were
an attempt to create a sound stage effect by reflecting most of the
sound off the walls behind the speakers.

The big problem is that few people had living rooms that allowed the
901's to be set up properly. They depend on proper spacing away from
hard walls (not curtains or drapes) to sound good. They also shouldn't
be placed symmetrically in a room (meaning both speakers being the same
distance from a side wall). Guys who understood the placement
requirements might have tried but wives usually prevailed in terms of
where they ended up in a room. Been there, done that.

Another bit about the 901's: Without the Bose equalizer they sound
terrible. I've seen vintage 901's set up and being used without the
equalizer because it was either lost or not working. Waste of time.
Try to find a vintage Bose equalizer on eBay or elsewhere. They don't
come up for sale often.

That all said, the 901's *can* sound wonderful if properly set up. I
have had the unique opportunity to compare a fully functional set (with
equalizer) that were made in 1980 to a pair of "high end" (for their
day) four foot high JBL studio monitor monsters. Both speaker sets are
up in a large garage with the 901's having the benefit of hard,
sheetrock walls behind them.

The 901's sound better overall to my ears and to everyone who has
listened to both in a casual "blind" test. The JBL's sound great.
The Bose 901's are clearer though with crisper highs and about the same
level of bass as the JBL's. More importantly is the
sound stage image they project as compared to the JBL's. The Bose
concept works *if* you pay attention to how they are setup.

As for other, contemporary Bose products, they are simply an over-priced
way to get "big" sound out of small enclosures, IMO. The original
direct/reflecting concept has been dropped in favor of things like
waveguides to reinforce bass in a small package. Other audio equipment
manufacturers have adopted similar waveguide designs over the years that
are much less expensive to purchase.

Oh ... one other comment for Harry. Bose has never officially published
the frequency response curves for any of their products.
It's basically meaningless anyway when comparing similar sized speakers.
A set of speakers with a theoretically "perfect", flat
response curve from 20Hz to 20kHz are not going to sound the same
set up in different rooms. The acoustics of the room itself
has a major impact on how they sound. Same is true in your favorite
concert hall. Millions are spent on the design and acoustic treatment
of the hall in order to "equalize" the sound of all the various
instruments in a symphony orchestra.



Thanks. My points of reference these days remain my electrostatics and a
friend's setup with genuine Klipschhorns.


Not to split hairs but Magnepan speakers (I think that's what you said
you have) are not "electrostatic". Maggies have a mylar film that
produces the sound but the mylar has small wires and foil physically
attached to it. Also, the mylar is mounted within a magnetic field that
is produced by strips of permanent magnets. When the conductors on the
mylar are fed the audio signal it causes the mylar to vibrate within the
permanent magnet field.

Electrostatic speakers are similar except there are no conductors
physically attached to the mylar and the mylar film is held within
a *static" field created by a small, high voltage transformer. The
mylar is coated with a extremely thin, transparent, conductive coating
(indium tin oxide) and the audio signal is applied to it.

The only problem with Maggies and electrostatics (like Martin Logan) is
that in order to produce sufficient bass from the mylar, the speakers
have to be huge. However, using a dedicated subwoofer solves that
problem. Martin Logan electrostatics also have a conventional woofer in
the lower section of the enclosure for bass.

The most amazing speakers I have ever heard were a pair of large ribbon
speakers. They were in a very high end audio shop on Long Island and I
had never seen anything like them. They were shaped like the sound
board of a grand piano standing up on end with ribbons going across
varying in length as the enclosure got bigger. They were powered by two
monstrous vacuum tube amps and a vacuum tube pre-amplifer. The cheapest
component in the whole system was a Rotel
CD player that was used as a music source. I've forgotten who made the
speakers or the amps. I stopped in one day and the owner must have
noticed my curiosity (or my salivating) because he asked if I'd like to
hear them. (insert "does a bear **** in the woods?" here")

He played some classical piece that contained soft movements with cellos
being slowly drawn along with soft wind chimes and then explosive
sections with horns and heavy percussion. Blew my mind.
I had never heard anything like them and haven't since.

This was in 1989. The speakers alone were over $100K.

No golf today
 

On 2/24/2016 8:36 AM, John H. wrote:
Krause, I will say it again. Normal people buy speakers that produce sounds they
enjoy. You, obviously, prefer speakers which have suitable (to you) numbers. What
your father preferred has absolutely no bearing on anything, except perhaps to lend
some braggadocio to your arrogant arguments.

You're really stuck on yourself, eh Krause?
--

Ban liars, tax cheats, idiots, and narcissists...not guns!

All true, I'm afraid.