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Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:26:12 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/18/15 8:12 AM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 20:30:45 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/15 7:27 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:00:07 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 6:05 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 16:28:55 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 12:16 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:08:08 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:31 PM, wrote: On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 12:25:26 PM UTC-5, John H. wrote: The big difference between simulators/real airplanes and RC airplanes - in sims or real planes, the nose of the plane is in front of you. With an RC plane, at least part of the time, the nose is pointed at you. That means the left and right controls are reversed. This, I believe, is what causes the most problems, at least for me. Another related difference is that pilots in a real plane has a seat of the pants, first person view. Not so with RC. Something that helps newbies to RC is that when the airplane is flying towards you and the controls are reversed, your can turn your body so the transmitter is faced the same way as the plane, but look back over your shoulder at the plane. That way the stick moves to the right, the plane moves to the right. It's a crutch, but with some more stick time it'll come naturally. I don't think there's much at all in common comparing RC flying and flying a real airplane. Speed scale is totally different. Turns and maneuvers are not anything close to being realistic to flying an airplane. I see it as a fun hobby for many but to compare it to actually flying an airplane it isn't even close. Many of the airplanes flown at our field fly in excess of 100mph - and that's measured by radar. One of our guys has one of these: http://www.modelairplanenews.com/blo...ini-radar-gun/ They measure real speed, not scale speed. Since I've never flown a real airplane, I can't argue your 'turns and maneuvers' statement. I know that if I bank my airplane using the ailerons and don't give it some up elevator, it will head for the dirt. Perhaps you could tell us what the big differences are. I'm thinking the biggest difference is that my crash isn't going to kill anyone. Oh, and my pre-flight checklist is shorter! An introductory flight lesson is cheap. Used to be about $50 for a half hour but maybe it's gone up now. If the CFI is halfway comfortable with how you follow directions, he'll let you taxi, take off and "fly the pattern". He'll land it although he may let you think you did. Do that and then come back and tell me how similar RC flying is to actually flying a real aircraft. You may be surprised. Flying a real airplane might be simpler. Geezie Pete - this is getting you wrapped around an axle, isn't it. While in Vietnam I was lucky enough to go up in an OV-10 for a three hour flight. The pilot was nice enough to let me fly the plane for about a half hour after flying our missions. There are a lot of similarities, especially in the controls. Pulling the stick back on the OV-10 does the same thing as pulling the stick back on the RC xmtr. And, not giving the plane some throttle when doing so could cause a stall - as the OV-10 pilot told me. Only his words were, "Do you want to crash?" Me, "No". Him, "Well you'd better give it some throttle." There were a tremendous number of similarities. Was it the same as flying an RC aircraft? Hell no. But, it was a tad more difficult than steering a train. Not me getting wrapped around an axle. You are the one who thinks flying RC airplanes is like flying a real one. Putting words in my mouth, are you? Shame on you. So you took the controls of an airplane after it took off and was flying straight and level. I did that when I was 10 years old with a pilot friend of my father. I've never proclaimed myself to be the pilot you are. Try "the hood". The hood is a device that you wear that limits your field of view to the inside of the airplane only. All you can see is the instruments. Your instructor will take control of the airplane and put it in an unusual attitude meaning it may be banked over and descending or in a banked climb nearing stall. He'll then say, "Your plane" and you learn to recover using instruments only with no ground reference. When you are in a banked turn, you can't tell by the seat of your pants. The airplane could be standing on one wing tip and you wouldn't know other than by instruments. Don't need to. Not interested in getting a 'real' pilot's license. I have a hard enough time with RC planes - as do a lot of 'real' pilots, and I'm not talking piper cub guys. Yet just a few posts ago you were asking what the "differences" are. I don't think I said that. But you, Krause, and Don do have a way of inserting words. I believe I said that there are similarities between RC flying and real airplane flying. Just as there are "similarities" between running a radio controlled toy boat in a swimming pool and a real boat in the ocean, eh? Exactly. Thank you for your insight. -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 05:50:09 -0800 (PST), wrote:
On Wednesday, February 18, 2015 at 8:17:27 AM UTC-5, John H. wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:42:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: Whatever you say Captain Herring. I admit that I have many more hours logged flying for real than I have flying a RC airplane, standing on the ground and controlling it with basically a game controller. Maybe if I did it more often I'd learn how similar it is to the real thing. Then again, probably not. No interest. with a Let's see...ingrained racist, Aunt Clara, Sheriff, and now Captain...all in a couple months. From now on, whenever you're flying your real airplane, you will think this: "STICK LEFT, STEER LEFT" "STICK RIGHT, STEER RIGHT" That thought will become ingrained. Don't ever mistake it with countersteering! -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. Say, aren't "real" airplanes and a pilot's license just toys for wealthy boys? :) I'm not getting into finances. But it does kinda sound like that. Can one order a Piper from Amazon? This is what I want when I grow up: http://tinyurl.com/ofvvkzb -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 09:19:58 -0500, KC wrote:
On 2/17/2015 12:16 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:08:08 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:31 PM, wrote: On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 12:25:26 PM UTC-5, John H. wrote: The big difference between simulators/real airplanes and RC airplanes - in sims or real planes, the nose of the plane is in front of you. With an RC plane, at least part of the time, the nose is pointed at you. That means the left and right controls are reversed. This, I believe, is what causes the most problems, at least for me. Another related difference is that pilots in a real plane has a seat of the pants, first person view. Not so with RC. Something that helps newbies to RC is that when the airplane is flying towards you and the controls are reversed, your can turn your body so the transmitter is faced the same way as the plane, but look back over your shoulder at the plane. That way the stick moves to the right, the plane moves to the right. It's a crutch, but with some more stick time it'll come naturally. I don't think there's much at all in common comparing RC flying and flying a real airplane. Speed scale is totally different. Turns and maneuvers are not anything close to being realistic to flying an airplane. I see it as a fun hobby for many but to compare it to actually flying an airplane it isn't even close. Many of the airplanes flown at our field fly in excess of 100mph - and that's measured by radar. One of our guys has one of these: http://www.modelairplanenews.com/blo...ini-radar-gun/ They measure real speed, not scale speed. Since I've never flown a real airplane, I can't argue your 'turns and maneuvers' statement. I know that if I bank my airplane using the ailerons and don't give it some up elevator, it will head for the dirt. Perhaps you could tell us what the big differences are. I'm thinking the biggest difference is that my crash isn't going to kill anyone. Oh, and my pre-flight checklist is shorter! Has anybody mentioned the seat of the pants feeling? I mean, that must help you fly in some respect feeling the plane under you? Yup, that was mentioned. That feeling does not occur when flying an RC aircraft, although some asshole puckering often does. -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 09:08:06 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/18/15 9:01 AM, Abit Loco wrote: Gosh, and here just a while back you were telling me my 18'er was way too small for the bay. Gosh, Harry. You sure do change stories a lot. When was that, John? During one of your anesthesia induced surgeries? When I bought the Key West. Where'd your memory go? -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:17:31 -0500, Abit Loco wrote:
On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:42:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 6:39 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 18:17:23 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 5:58 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 16:34:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 12:16 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:54:29 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/16/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:31 PM, wrote: On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 12:25:26 PM UTC-5, John H. wrote: The big difference between simulators/real airplanes and RC airplanes - in sims or real planes, the nose of the plane is in front of you. With an RC plane, at least part of the time, the nose is pointed at you. That means the left and right controls are reversed. This, I believe, is what causes the most problems, at least for me. Another related difference is that pilots in a real plane has a seat of the pants, first person view. Not so with RC. Something that helps newbies to RC is that when the airplane is flying towards you and the controls are reversed, your can turn your body so the transmitter is faced the same way as the plane, but look back over your shoulder at the plane. That way the stick moves to the right, the plane moves to the right. It's a crutch, but with some more stick time it'll come naturally. I don't think there's much at all in common comparing RC flying and flying a real airplane. Speed scale is totally different. Turns and maneuvers are not anything close to being realistic to flying an airplane. I see it as a fun hobby for many but to compare it to actually flying an airplane it isn't even close. What happens when your toy plane crashes? It breaks. What happens when a real airplane crashes? Death and destruction. And that, my friends, is the big difference! The chances of you crashing a real airplane are pretty slim compared to crashing a RC. First of all, while under instruction your CFI isn't keen on crashing. By the time you are ready to solo you will be well qualified in the eyes of your instructor. When you consider the number of people taking flight lessons every day across the country and the number of small aircraft pilots flying every day, the safety record is pretty high and the number of crashes are low. Have you ever 'buddy-boxed' with an RC instructor pilot? While under instruction, the instructor isn't keen on you ruining your airplane. He has a switch which immediately gives him control of the aircraft if he thinks trouble is approaching. When I was actively flying the thought of ruining the airplane never crossed my mind. John, if you want to believe that flying a $200 airplane by remote control emulates flying a real airplane, more power to you. I see them as two completely different experiences that require totally different skill sets. Any licensed pilot can remember every single detail of their first solo flight when the CFI was no longer sitting beside you and once you went up ... getting down alive was entirely dependent on you. Second is the cross country phase where navigation becomes key. With RC flying you don't lose where you are. I remember some of the early flight lessons when the instructor would tell me to head back to the airport ... and I just stared at the ground wondering where the hell I was. These have nothing to do with controlling or flying the airplane but are part of "real" flying. If you think there are *no* similarities between flying an RC aircraft (of any cost) and flying the real airplane, then more power to you. Now you're comparing flying an RC airplane to getting a pilot's license for a real airplane. Why not compare it to flying and landing an F/A-18 on a carrier. I'll bet that's much different from landing an RC airplane in the grass. True, when flying an RC airplane, the pilot never loses where *he* is. But, they often lose where the airplane is. Happened to me a couple weeks ago. I flew the airplane beyond my ability to see it. The clouds were much the same color as the airplane. Had to yell for help. Young guy came and got it back for me. Just calm down a bit. No one is trying to denigrate your experience in getting your pilot's license. And, when you pushed that stick left or right, you were steering the airplane, whether you like it or not! Whatever you say Captain Herring. I admit that I have many more hours logged flying for real than I have flying a RC airplane, standing on the ground and controlling it with basically a game controller. Maybe if I did it more often I'd learn how similar it is to the real thing. Then again, probably not. No interest. with a Let's see...ingrained racist, Aunt Clara, Sheriff, and now Captain...all in a couple months. From now on, whenever you're flying your real airplane, you will think this: "STICK LEFT, STEER LEFT" "STICK RIGHT, STEER RIGHT" That thought will become ingrained. Don't ever mistake it with countersteering! And now 'asshole' can be added to the list. You're giving Krause a real run for his money! -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On 2/18/15 9:11 AM, Abit Loco wrote:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:25:08 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/18/15 8:09 AM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 21:46:53 -0500, Wayne.B wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:34:16 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: Don't need to. Not interested in getting a 'real' pilot's license. I have a hard enough time with RC planes - as do a lot of 'real' pilots, and I'm not talking piper cub guys. This just gets funnier and funnier. :) === Why the heck are you in this discussion? Accumulating points with Eriksson, why else? Oh, please. Richard and I disagree on a lot of subjects, and never will agree on most of them. I'm giggling at you and your comments about toy airplanes, your obsession with them, and your claims that flying toy airplanes and flying real airplanes require similar skills. Perhaps you see yourself as a *real* pilot. Some might see you as a disintegrating old fart with nothing real to do, too much time on your hands, and an endless list of hobbies. I'm not saying *I* see you that way, but some might, eh? Touched a nerve, eh? What? I'm not the one who has had a seemingly endless list of surgeries, or the one with nothing real to do, or the one with an endless list of hobbies. -- Proud to be a Liberal. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On 2/18/15 9:32 AM, Abit Loco wrote:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 09:08:06 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/18/15 9:01 AM, Abit Loco wrote: Gosh, and here just a while back you were telling me my 18'er was way too small for the bay. Gosh, Harry. You sure do change stories a lot. When was that, John? During one of your anesthesia induced surgeries? When I bought the Key West. Where'd your memory go? Since I boated on the bay with a boat only slightly larger when I came up here, that hardly seems the case. -- Proud to be a Liberal. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:27:14 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/18/15 8:17 AM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:42:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 6:39 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 18:17:23 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 5:58 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 16:34:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 12:16 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:54:29 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/16/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:31 PM, wrote: On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 12:25:26 PM UTC-5, John H. wrote: The big difference between simulators/real airplanes and RC airplanes - in sims or real planes, the nose of the plane is in front of you. With an RC plane, at least part of the time, the nose is pointed at you. That means the left and right controls are reversed. This, I believe, is what causes the most problems, at least for me. Another related difference is that pilots in a real plane has a seat of the pants, first person view. Not so with RC. Something that helps newbies to RC is that when the airplane is flying towards you and the controls are reversed, your can turn your body so the transmitter is faced the same way as the plane, but look back over your shoulder at the plane. That way the stick moves to the right, the plane moves to the right. It's a crutch, but with some more stick time it'll come naturally. I don't think there's much at all in common comparing RC flying and flying a real airplane. Speed scale is totally different. Turns and maneuvers are not anything close to being realistic to flying an airplane. I see it as a fun hobby for many but to compare it to actually flying an airplane it isn't even close. What happens when your toy plane crashes? It breaks. What happens when a real airplane crashes? Death and destruction. And that, my friends, is the big difference! The chances of you crashing a real airplane are pretty slim compared to crashing a RC. First of all, while under instruction your CFI isn't keen on crashing. By the time you are ready to solo you will be well qualified in the eyes of your instructor. When you consider the number of people taking flight lessons every day across the country and the number of small aircraft pilots flying every day, the safety record is pretty high and the number of crashes are low. Have you ever 'buddy-boxed' with an RC instructor pilot? While under instruction, the instructor isn't keen on you ruining your airplane. He has a switch which immediately gives him control of the aircraft if he thinks trouble is approaching. When I was actively flying the thought of ruining the airplane never crossed my mind. John, if you want to believe that flying a $200 airplane by remote control emulates flying a real airplane, more power to you. I see them as two completely different experiences that require totally different skill sets. Any licensed pilot can remember every single detail of their first solo flight when the CFI was no longer sitting beside you and once you went up ... getting down alive was entirely dependent on you. Second is the cross country phase where navigation becomes key. With RC flying you don't lose where you are. I remember some of the early flight lessons when the instructor would tell me to head back to the airport ... and I just stared at the ground wondering where the hell I was. These have nothing to do with controlling or flying the airplane but are part of "real" flying. If you think there are *no* similarities between flying an RC aircraft (of any cost) and flying the real airplane, then more power to you. Now you're comparing flying an RC airplane to getting a pilot's license for a real airplane. Why not compare it to flying and landing an F/A-18 on a carrier. I'll bet that's much different from landing an RC airplane in the grass. True, when flying an RC airplane, the pilot never loses where *he* is. But, they often lose where the airplane is. Happened to me a couple weeks ago. I flew the airplane beyond my ability to see it. The clouds were much the same color as the airplane. Had to yell for help. Young guy came and got it back for me. Just calm down a bit. No one is trying to denigrate your experience in getting your pilot's license. And, when you pushed that stick left or right, you were steering the airplane, whether you like it or not! Whatever you say Captain Herring. I admit that I have many more hours logged flying for real than I have flying a RC airplane, standing on the ground and controlling it with basically a game controller. Maybe if I did it more often I'd learn how similar it is to the real thing. Then again, probably not. No interest. with a Let's see...ingrained racist, Aunt Clara, Sheriff, and now Captain...all in a couple months. From now on, whenever you're flying your real airplane, you will think this: "STICK LEFT, STEER LEFT" "STICK RIGHT, STEER RIGHT" That thought will become ingrained. Don't ever mistake it with countersteering! Yup...we're on our way to Herring's 30+ posts today about toy airplanes. What can I say? Eriksson keeps asking questions and I answer them. He then calls me an asshole 'cause he doesn't like the answers. -- Guns don't cause problems. The behavior of certain gun owners causes problems. |
Navy Carrier Pilots - Overpaid?
On 2/18/15 9:47 AM, Abit Loco wrote:
On Wed, 18 Feb 2015 08:27:14 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/18/15 8:17 AM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 19:42:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 6:39 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 18:17:23 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 5:58 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Tue, 17 Feb 2015 16:34:20 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 2/17/2015 12:16 PM, Abit Loco wrote: On Mon, 16 Feb 2015 19:54:29 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote: On 2/16/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 2/16/2015 6:31 PM, wrote: On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 12:25:26 PM UTC-5, John H. wrote: The big difference between simulators/real airplanes and RC airplanes - in sims or real planes, the nose of the plane is in front of you. With an RC plane, at least part of the time, the nose is pointed at you. That means the left and right controls are reversed. This, I believe, is what causes the most problems, at least for me. Another related difference is that pilots in a real plane has a seat of the pants, first person view. Not so with RC. Something that helps newbies to RC is that when the airplane is flying towards you and the controls are reversed, your can turn your body so the transmitter is faced the same way as the plane, but look back over your shoulder at the plane. That way the stick moves to the right, the plane moves to the right. It's a crutch, but with some more stick time it'll come naturally. I don't think there's much at all in common comparing RC flying and flying a real airplane. Speed scale is totally different. Turns and maneuvers are not anything close to being realistic to flying an airplane. I see it as a fun hobby for many but to compare it to actually flying an airplane it isn't even close. What happens when your toy plane crashes? It breaks. What happens when a real airplane crashes? Death and destruction. And that, my friends, is the big difference! The chances of you crashing a real airplane are pretty slim compared to crashing a RC. First of all, while under instruction your CFI isn't keen on crashing. By the time you are ready to solo you will be well qualified in the eyes of your instructor. When you consider the number of people taking flight lessons every day across the country and the number of small aircraft pilots flying every day, the safety record is pretty high and the number of crashes are low. Have you ever 'buddy-boxed' with an RC instructor pilot? While under instruction, the instructor isn't keen on you ruining your airplane. He has a switch which immediately gives him control of the aircraft if he thinks trouble is approaching. When I was actively flying the thought of ruining the airplane never crossed my mind. John, if you want to believe that flying a $200 airplane by remote control emulates flying a real airplane, more power to you. I see them as two completely different experiences that require totally different skill sets. Any licensed pilot can remember every single detail of their first solo flight when the CFI was no longer sitting beside you and once you went up ... getting down alive was entirely dependent on you. Second is the cross country phase where navigation becomes key. With RC flying you don't lose where you are. I remember some of the early flight lessons when the instructor would tell me to head back to the airport ... and I just stared at the ground wondering where the hell I was. These have nothing to do with controlling or flying the airplane but are part of "real" flying. If you think there are *no* similarities between flying an RC aircraft (of any cost) and flying the real airplane, then more power to you. Now you're comparing flying an RC airplane to getting a pilot's license for a real airplane. Why not compare it to flying and landing an F/A-18 on a carrier. I'll bet that's much different from landing an RC airplane in the grass. True, when flying an RC airplane, the pilot never loses where *he* is. But, they often lose where the airplane is. Happened to me a couple weeks ago. I flew the airplane beyond my ability to see it. The clouds were much the same color as the airplane. Had to yell for help. Young guy came and got it back for me. Just calm down a bit. No one is trying to denigrate your experience in getting your pilot's license. And, when you pushed that stick left or right, you were steering the airplane, whether you like it or not! Whatever you say Captain Herring. I admit that I have many more hours logged flying for real than I have flying a RC airplane, standing on the ground and controlling it with basically a game controller. Maybe if I did it more often I'd learn how similar it is to the real thing. Then again, probably not. No interest. with a Let's see...ingrained racist, Aunt Clara, Sheriff, and now Captain...all in a couple months. From now on, whenever you're flying your real airplane, you will think this: "STICK LEFT, STEER LEFT" "STICK RIGHT, STEER RIGHT" That thought will become ingrained. Don't ever mistake it with countersteering! Yup...we're on our way to Herring's 30+ posts today about toy airplanes. What can I say? Eriksson keeps asking questions and I answer them. He then calls me an asshole 'cause he doesn't like the answers. Actually, if he is calling you an asshole, it likely has little to do with your answers and more to do with his perception of your ignorance, arrogance, and attitude. Just a guess on my part. I'd never call you ignorant, arrogant, and in need of an attitude adjustment. :) -- Proud to be a Liberal. |
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