In article ,
says...

A case in point. In Ft Myers there was a restaurant with 4 or 5 tables
on a small elevated platform in back that was not accessible. There
were dozens of tables in the same room that were accessible, same
food, same service. The owner was sued out of existence because he
would not remove 12 or more tables to build a ramp.


Wow. Some businessman there.
Remove "12 of more tables to build a ramp" when he can just eliminate
the "4 or 5 tables" on the platform.
Great business sense.
Probably cheaped out on refrigeration, food sanitation, and restroom
cleaning too.
The community is safer.
Where did you get that story? Some loonitarian website that has an
"ADA Atrocities" section?

In article ,
says...


He dad already put in a new elevator to get handicapped people on the
roof and made a number of other accommodations. This was the last
straw.
So your answer was just to abandon a couple hundred square feet of a
small restaurant. Would the city stop collecting taxes on that
footage?


Now you're on about taxes. Hey, you're the one who said the place had
"dozens" of tables and the guy closed down instead or removing 4-5 table
from use. Dumb - on any level.

Probably cheaped out on refrigeration, food sanitation, and restroom
cleaning too.

Why would you assume that? You sound like you are just making **** up
now., This was a very high dollar restaurant


Because the guy is dumb if your story is accurate.
Saying it is "very high dollar restaurant" only makes him dumber.
More likely, the place wasn't making money anyway, or the guy closed it
because he was tired of being a "businessman."

The community is safer.
Where did you get that story? Some loonitarian website that has an
"ADA Atrocities" section?

It was all over the news here for over a year. It wasn't even a case
of local people complaining. It was an out of town action group,
driving around looking for something to complain about.

You provided no cites, so I can only go by what you said.
Closing a SUCCESSFUL "very high dollar restaurant" with dozens of tables
because the ADA says 4-5 tables don't comply is just ****ing stupid
business-wise.
But plenty of people will cut off their nose to spite their face for
political reason.
His right. At least - I hope - he didn't arson it for insurance.
BTW, you said it was "historical."
What happened to the building?

wrote:
On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 14:09:03 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


He dad already put in a new elevator to get handicapped people on the
roof and made a number of other accommodations. This was the last
straw.
So your answer was just to abandon a couple hundred square feet of a
small restaurant. Would the city stop collecting taxes on that
footage?


Now you're on about taxes. Hey, you're the one who said the place had
"dozens" of tables and the guy closed down instead or removing 4-5 table
from use. Dumb - on any level.

At that point it was just the principle.



Probably cheaped out on refrigeration, food sanitation, and restroom
cleaning too.

Why would you assume that? You sound like you are just making **** up
now., This was a very high dollar restaurant


Because the guy is dumb if your story is accurate.
Saying it is "very high dollar restaurant" only makes him dumber.
More likely, the place wasn't making money anyway, or the guy closed it
because he was tired of being a "businessman."

He certainly didn't have as much money as he had a while ago after the
other changes he had to make. Elevators are not cheap.

The community is safer.
Where did you get that story? Some loonitarian website that has an
"ADA Atrocities" section?

It was all over the news here for over a year. It wasn't even a case
of local people complaining. It was an out of town action group,
driving around looking for something to complain about.

You provided no cites, so I can only go by what you said.
Closing a SUCCESSFUL "very high dollar restaurant" with dozens of tables
because the ADA says 4-5 tables don't comply is just ****ing stupid
business-wise.

I tend to agree. I would have put a huge display up there pointing out
how stupid some government regulation can get.
He was just done.

But plenty of people will cut off their nose to spite their face for
political reason.
His right. At least - I hope - he didn't arson it for insurance.

Look in the Ft Myers archives for Peters la Cuisine

He reopened in another place a few years ago so you may get off topic
hits. This was a while ago.

BTW, you said it was "historical."
What happened to the building?

For all I know, they tore it down. That whole area got renovated.
Strange stuff happens when the government is involved
I can look into it if you are really interested. Wayne might know, it
is right across from the Ft Myers Yacht basin that just got
reconfigured.

We had a judge out here who finally cracked down on a lot of the ADA
lawsuit business. One claimant went all over the state and his Lawyer
threaten to sue if not an out of court settlement. Judge finally told the
ADA claimant that he was going to jail if he filed another claim. Was
making a huge income a year from the extortion. The parking lot for my
insurance agent, is listed as private parking. No ADA spots. Reason.
Some guy was suing insurance agents all over the state if no handicapped
parking. Even if they had a lot with only 2-3 spaces.

wrote:
On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 16:39:33 -0500, Califbill
wrote:

The parking lot for my
insurance agent, is listed as private parking. No ADA spots. Reason.
Some guy was suing insurance agents all over the state if no handicapped
parking. Even if they had a lot with only 2-3 spaces.

If he did get into court, he would lose

If there are only 3 spaces now, you will end up with 2. One will be a
van accessible space with an 8' access aisle next to it and you can
use the rest for (probably only one) regular parking spot.
If you only have 2 now, guess what? You only have one and it is
handicap only with an access aisle where the other spot used to be.
No regular spots at all.
http://www.ada.gov/restripe.htm

BTW there is a way to move the handicapped spot away from the door.
Put the wheel chair ramp at the other end of the building..

I have to go to ADA training every other year.
This year I took a break from parking lots and wheel chair accessible
toilets. I did the "recreational facility" class

Most of the boat docks you see are illegal, simply waiting for a
complaint. Same with swimming pools. Campgrounds are next.
The DoJ is still working on those regulations but they are coming.

They call it. Employee parking only. Not for public use.

wrote:
On Fri, 20 Sep 2013 11:32:36 -0500, Califbill
wrote:

wrote:
On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 16:39:33 -0500, Califbill
wrote:

The parking lot for my
insurance agent, is listed as private parking. No ADA spots. Reason.
Some guy was suing insurance agents all over the state if no handicapped
parking. Even if they had a lot with only 2-3 spaces.

If he did get into court, he would lose

If there are only 3 spaces now, you will end up with 2. One will be a
van accessible space with an 8' access aisle next to it and you can
use the rest for (probably only one) regular parking spot.
If you only have 2 now, guess what? You only have one and it is
handicap only with an access aisle where the other spot used to be.
No regular spots at all.
http://www.ada.gov/restripe.htm

BTW there is a way to move the handicapped spot away from the door.
Put the wheel chair ramp at the other end of the building..

I have to go to ADA training every other year.
This year I took a break from parking lots and wheel chair accessible
toilets. I did the "recreational facility" class

Most of the boat docks you see are illegal, simply waiting for a
complaint. Same with swimming pools. Campgrounds are next.
The DoJ is still working on those regulations but they are coming.

They call it. Employee parking only. Not for public use.

You should go to one of those classes. The ADA guy would say "does
that mean you would not hire a handicapped person"?
That opens up a whole other can of worms. (and another class"workplace
law")
That is another required CEU course for me.

These ADA classes are increasingly being taught by lawyers, not the
typical builder/architect types who used to do it. This has gone
beyond "reasonable accommodation" into a situation where there are
people who make a living suing people.
The code enforcement officials are caught on the middle and they tend
to err on the side of caution, lest their city be named in the suit
too.

They would install a handicapped spot if there was a handicapped employee.
Basically the suing person was not allowed in the parking lot, so would not
have a right to park there from what I understand.

In article ,
says...

On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 12:06:18 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...

A case in point. In Ft Myers there was a restaurant with 4 or 5 tables
on a small elevated platform in back that was not accessible. There
were dozens of tables in the same room that were accessible, same
food, same service. The owner was sued out of existence because he
would not remove 12 or more tables to build a ramp.


Wow. Some businessman there.
Remove "12 of more tables to build a ramp" when he can just eliminate
the "4 or 5 tables" on the platform.
Great business sense.

He dad already put in a new elevator to get handicapped people on the
roof and made a number of other accommodations. This was the last
straw.
So your answer was just to abandon a couple hundred square feet of a
small restaurant. Would the city stop collecting taxes on that
footage?

Probably cheaped out on refrigeration, food sanitation, and restroom
cleaning too.

Why would you assume that? You sound like you are just making **** up
now., This was a very high dollar restaurant

The community is safer.
Where did you get that story? Some loonitarian website that has an
"ADA Atrocities" section?

It was all over the news here for over a year. It wasn't even a case
of local people complaining. It was an out of town action group,
driving around looking for something to complain about.

Every single seat in a restaurant has a profit potential of X amount of
dollars per hour. Being a crappy margin business anyway, doing away with
seats can easily be the demise of a restaurant.