Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:51:28 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 14, 11:19*am, hk wrote:


* Not my quote...found it on DailyKOS and it is completely true.


LOL... That's the best one I have heard all day!!!

Have you ever noticed that liberals, when asked a specific question, will
ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal insults -
rather than answer the question.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Dec 14, 2:28*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:51:28 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 14, 11:19*am, hk wrote:

* Not my quote...found it on DailyKOS and it is completely true.

LOL... That's the best one I have heard all day!!!

Have you ever noticed that liberals, when asked a specific question, will
ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal insults -
rather than answer the question.
--
John

Why yes, yes I have.. Notice the direct answer;) ??

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:41:56 -0500, Boater wrote:

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:

Harry,
I have never known anyone


Reggie, I *don't care* who you have or haven't known, or what you think.

Got it?

Harry, for your own good, I will address you.

Reggie is correct.

You *should* care.

Until next time....goodbye.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:41:56 -0500, Boater wrote:

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Harry,
I have never known anyone

Reggie, I *don't care* who you have or haven't known, or what you think.

Got it?

Harry, for your own good, I will address you.

Reggie is correct.

You *should* care.

Until next time....goodbye.


Since you are dumber than and less relevant than even Reggie, I will
give your suggestions the same consideration I give his: none.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:22:02 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Dec 14, 9:22*am, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:14:22 -0600, wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 09:06:56 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 07:51:17 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:45:40 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 07:23:49 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 07:23:39 -0500, John wrote:

http://www.americanprogress.org/issu...tribution.html

Thunder, do you really believe the 'worker' has increased his output
by 20%? Does that line make sense to you?

The fact that you read it in an anti-Bush article doesn't make it
true.

As you are clearly too lazy to do your own search:

http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Let's see, 7 * 2.5 = 17.5 *You could then extrapolate, considering it
is 2008. *So, yes, I do believe the 'worker' has increased his output
by 20%, even though, I probably shouldn't believe anything that comes
out of the Bush government.

That's overall productivity, not an increase in productivity of
'workers'.

If I have an assembly line with 10 workers, I replace five with a
robot, and my output remains constant, does that mean the productivity
of the five remaining workers has increased by 100%? *Should I double
the pay of the remaining five workers?

If you believe that, then I can understand your anguish.

Well, seeing you are talking an assembly line, productivity in the
manufacturing sector was 26% between 2000-2007. *I'm well aware of what
"productivity" is, and I'm also quite aware that productivity has
increased, wages haven't kept up, which was the whole point of the first
link posted.

I'd also point out, that article was posted in reply to Just's statement
that "The lazy ones who won't work need the representation." *Well,
apparently, that's not true, now is it?

Have you ever noticed that liberals, when asked a specific question,
will ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal
insults - rather than answer the question.

Just's statement is very true. The article you posted had no bearing on
his statement, just as your comparison of productivity and wages has no
bearing on his statement.

Here, I'll ask again:

" If I have an assembly line with 10 workers, I replace five with a
robot,
*and my output remains constant, does that mean the productivity of the
*five remaining workers has increased by 100%? *Should I double the pay
*of the remaining five workers?"

Are you talking labor productivity? *Multifactor productivity? *What
productivity model? *Kurosawa? Gollop?

Widget productivity.

Jeeez.

Have you ever noticed that liberals, when asked a specific question,
will ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal
insults - rather than answer the question?

Goodbye. Going golfing. You've proven my point.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Not all of them. I'll take to task anyone who lumps ALL people of a
certain political belief into a very narrow group.

You are probably correct. Note that I didn't say Democrats, but I probably
should have said, "...most liberals...".
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Dec 14, 2:34*pm, Boater wrote:
John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:41:56 -0500, Boater wrote:

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Harry,
I have never known anyone

Reggie, I **don't care* who you have or haven't known, or what you think.

Got it?

Harry, for your own good, I will address you.

Reggie is correct.

You *should* care.

Until next time....goodbye.

Since you are dumber than and less relevant than even Reggie, I will
give your suggestions the same consideration I give his: none.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So, since you think everyone here is dumb and not worth addressing,
why do you post? Here, let me make it easy for even you. Tell us who
you feel is worth addressing here in rec.boats, that will give a
little insight into where you are coming from?

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:28:20 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:51:28 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 14, 11:19*am, hk wrote:


* Not my quote...found it on DailyKOS and it is completely true.


LOL... That's the best one I have heard all day!!!

Have you ever noticed that liberals, when asked a specific question, will
ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal insults -
rather than answer the question.

edit...'most liberals'...
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:46:12 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 14, 2:34*pm, Boater wrote:
John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:41:56 -0500, Boater wrote:

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Harry,
I have never known anyone

Reggie, I **don't care* who you have or haven't known, or what you think.

Got it?

Harry, for your own good, I will address you.

Reggie is correct.

You *should* care.

Until next time....goodbye.

Since you are dumber than and less relevant than even Reggie, I will
give your suggestions the same consideration I give his: none.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

So, since you think everyone here is dumb and not worth addressing,
why do you post? Here, let me make it easy for even you. Tell us who
you feel is worth addressing here in rec.boats, that will give a
little insight into where you are coming from?

And ask him why he's made about 72 posts to me in the past week even though
I've made none to him.

Weird.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Boater wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:

Harry,
I have never known anyone


Reggie, I *don't care* who you have or haven't known, or what you think.

Got it?

Why is that?

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:


There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told to
slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from the
other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:


There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told to
slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from the
other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by myself
or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:


In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Well Colonel, I'm not in the service. Why in the hell, would I take
orders from you? Answer your own strawman.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:


There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told to
slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from the
other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/


You've got to be something of an intellectual nitwit to attempt to
portmanteau these isolated incidents of JustHate's into any sort of
universal truth.

What defines "work hard," anyway? It's certainly more than "just"
physical labor.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:


There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:03:17 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:


http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Well, that's kind of the point. What data do you trust?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics.


Who should benefit from the obvious productivity increase - the company
or the workers?

Historically, when productivity increases, there may be a lag, but wages
also increase. What's changed?

The answer to that, is far more devastating to this country's long term
economic health, than the middle-class not getting their share.

What's the measure of productivity he's quoting? Per unit, per hour,
per what? I would think that if a company over 8 years increased it's
productivity by 20% (which is 2.5%/yr by the way) that's not a whole lot
considering inflation, raw material costs, etc. And if your company has
a high labor quotient to the cost of production, that's almost
negligible.

If you want to consider inflation, real wages have decreased.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Dec 14, 5:04*pm, Boater wrote:
wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told to
slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from the
other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

You've got to be something of an intellectual nitwit to attempt to
portmanteau these isolated incidents of JustHate's into any sort of
universal truth.

What defines "work hard," anyway? It's certainly more than "just"
physical labor.

Hard work is earning a days pay, by giving up a days work....

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:02:13 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:


In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Well Colonel, I'm not in the service. Why in the hell, would I take
orders from you? Answer your own strawman.

Orders?

Have you ever noticed that most liberals, when asked a specific question,
will ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal
insults... rather than answer the question?

--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

wrote:
On Dec 14, 5:04 pm, Boater wrote:
wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:
There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told to
slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from the
other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...
That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/
You've got to be something of an intellectual nitwit to attempt to
portmanteau these isolated incidents of JustHate's into any sort of
universal truth.

What defines "work hard," anyway? It's certainly more than "just"
physical labor.

Hard work is earning a days pay, by giving up a days work....


That's no definition.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:


There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:02:13 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:


In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.
Well Colonel, I'm not in the service. Why in the hell, would I take
orders from you? Answer your own strawman.

Orders?

Have you ever noticed that most liberals, when asked a specific question,
will ignore the question, change the subject, or resort to personal
insults... rather than answer the question?



Most liberals would consider you and your questions specious and not
worth the bit of effort it would take to respond.

The more you post, the more it becomes obvious that money spent on the
military is wasted.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

You've noticed, some liberals resort to the personal insult phase without
even being asked a question.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:12:10 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:03:17 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:


http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Well, that's kind of the point. What data do you trust?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Fine - but what caused the increase? Something has to change - what
was it?

Who should benefit from the obvious productivity increase - the company
or the workers?

Historically, when productivity increases, there may be a lag, but wages
also increase. What's changed?

The answer to that, is far more devastating to this country's long term
economic health, than the middle-class not getting their share.

You raise some important questions and frankly, I don't have an answer
for you - I'll admit it.

Obviously, its far to simplistic to blame the fat cats and corporate
executives. Perhaps there has been a fundamental shift in how money
is distributed, the money supply being managed - there's a whole host
of factors that could explain it, but I'm not an economist although I
do play one on TV. :)

I watch CNBC a lot - in particular the early show Squawk Box or if I'm
out and about, I listen on Sirius. When you watch two opposing sides
take the same sets of data and make them fit their own agendas and
viewpoints, you begin to wonder if anybody really and truly knows
what's going on.

Now for the really oddball opinon. I've often suspected that "real
wages" are being sucked up by government in various ways. I had an
experience Friday that floored me. I was kind of messing around in
the kitchen and I gathered up the bills for the paper pusher to
handle. I just started looking through them - there are more fees,
taxes and "adjustments' on my cable, telephone and wireless bills that
I could shake a stick at - easily adding 3-4% to the cost of the bill
and that's before sales/service taxes which add another - what, 6%?

What are all these fees/taxes/access charges doing to real wages?

What's the measure of productivity he's quoting? Per unit, per hour,
per what? I would think that if a company over 8 years increased it's
productivity by 20% (which is 2.5%/yr by the way) that's not a whole lot
considering inflation, raw material costs, etc. And if your company has
a high labor quotient to the cost of production, that's almost
negligible.

If you want to consider inflation, real wages have decreased.

Well, I think the last time I could buy a decent cigar for .75¢ was
about twenty years ago. :)

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Is snerk a remark like snot? It's "snot" in the dictionary and it's "snot"
making any sense. Snot at least is both of those.

Is it just the best the group can muster. My answer to that snerk!

snot

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:21:32 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Is snerk a remark like snot? It's "snot" in the dictionary and it's "snot"
making any sense. Snot at least is both of those.

Is it just the best the group can muster. My answer to that snerk!

snot

You need to do your own research about 'snerk'.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:55:18 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:12:10 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:03:17 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:


http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Well, that's kind of the point. What data do you trust?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Fine - but what caused the increase? Something has to change - what was
it?

2.5% annual increase in productivity isn't unusual coming out of a
recession. What is unusual, is that wages didn't increase, and this
isn't Bush bashing. The productivity/wage gap could also be seen under
Clinton.

While the top 1% still got there's, it doesn't account for all of the
difference. I would suggest we are now seeing the effects of the past 25
years of Globalization exerting it's downward pressure on wages.

Production is only one side of the marketplace paradigm. The reason this
country has been the world's marketplace, was because we had a robust
middle-class. No more.

Personally, I feel it's too late to seal our borders to imports, but, I
hope Obama has the sense to use whatever leverage we have left, to open
foreign markets. Japan, India, and China, need to know that if they want
to sell here, we have to be able to sell there. We've been giving it
away, and it's time to stop.


Who should benefit from the obvious productivity increase - the
company or the workers?

Historically, when productivity increases, there may be a lag, but wages
also increase. What's changed?

The answer to that, is far more devastating to this country's long term
economic health, than the middle-class not getting their share.

You raise some important questions and frankly, I don't have an answer
for you - I'll admit it.

Obviously, its far to simplistic to blame the fat cats and corporate
executives. Perhaps there has been a fundamental shift in how money is
distributed, the money supply being managed - there's a whole host of
factors that could explain it, but I'm not an economist although I do
play one on TV. :)

I watch CNBC a lot - in particular the early show Squawk Box or if I'm
out and about, I listen on Sirius. When you watch two opposing sides
take the same sets of data and make them fit their own agendas and
viewpoints, you begin to wonder if anybody really and truly knows what's
going on.

Now for the really oddball opinon. I've often suspected that "real
wages" are being sucked up by government in various ways. I had an
experience Friday that floored me. I was kind of messing around in the
kitchen and I gathered up the bills for the paper pusher to handle. I
just started looking through them - there are more fees, taxes and
"adjustments' on my cable, telephone and wireless bills that I could
shake a stick at - easily adding 3-4% to the cost of the bill and that's
before sales/service taxes which add another - what, 6%?

What are all these fees/taxes/access charges doing to real wages?

What's the measure of productivity he's quoting? Per unit, per hour,
per what? I would think that if a company over 8 years increased it's
productivity by 20% (which is 2.5%/yr by the way) that's not a whole
lot considering inflation, raw material costs, etc. And if your
company has a high labor quotient to the cost of production, that's
almost negligible.

If you want to consider inflation, real wages have decreased.

Well, I think the last time I could buy a decent cigar for .75¢ was
about twenty years ago. :)

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:38:52 -0500, John wrote:


Now you're making good sense, and you're not quoting a Bush-bashing
article to do it.

http://www.amishrakefight.org/gfy/

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:31:35 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 17:55:18 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:12:10 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:03:17 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:


http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Well, that's kind of the point. What data do you trust?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Fine - but what caused the increase? Something has to change - what was
it?

2.5% annual increase in productivity isn't unusual coming out of a
recession. What is unusual, is that wages didn't increase, and this
isn't Bush bashing. The productivity/wage gap could also be seen under
Clinton.

While the top 1% still got there's, it doesn't account for all of the
difference. I would suggest we are now seeing the effects of the past 25
years of Globalization exerting it's downward pressure on wages.

Production is only one side of the marketplace paradigm. The reason this
country has been the world's marketplace, was because we had a robust
middle-class. No more.

Personally, I feel it's too late to seal our borders to imports, but, I
hope Obama has the sense to use whatever leverage we have left, to open
foreign markets. Japan, India, and China, need to know that if they want
to sell here, we have to be able to sell there. We've been giving it
away, and it's time to stop.


Now you're making good sense, and you're not quoting a Bush-bashing article
to do it.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

wrote in message
t...
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:


In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Well Colonel, I'm not in the service. Why in the hell, would I take
orders from you? Answer your own strawman.


Well said...The Lt Colonels' own motley irregulars don't follow his orders,
so why should anyone else.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:12:10 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:03:17 -0500, Tom Francis - SWSports wrote:


http://www.bls.gov/lpc/prodybar.htm

Well, that's kind of the point. What data do you trust?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics.

Fine - but what caused the increase? Something has to change - what
was it?

Who should benefit from the obvious productivity increase - the company
or the workers?

Historically, when productivity increases, there may be a lag, but wages
also increase. What's changed?

The answer to that, is far more devastating to this country's long term
economic health, than the middle-class not getting their share.

You raise some important questions and frankly, I don't have an answer
for you - I'll admit it.

Obviously, its far to simplistic to blame the fat cats and corporate
executives. Perhaps there has been a fundamental shift in how money
is distributed, the money supply being managed - there's a whole host
of factors that could explain it, but I'm not an economist although I
do play one on TV. :)

I watch CNBC a lot - in particular the early show Squawk Box or if I'm
out and about, I listen on Sirius. When you watch two opposing sides
take the same sets of data and make them fit their own agendas and
viewpoints, you begin to wonder if anybody really and truly knows
what's going on.

Now for the really oddball opinon. I've often suspected that "real
wages" are being sucked up by government in various ways. I had an
experience Friday that floored me. I was kind of messing around in
the kitchen and I gathered up the bills for the paper pusher to
handle. I just started looking through them - there are more fees,
taxes and "adjustments' on my cable, telephone and wireless bills that
I could shake a stick at - easily adding 3-4% to the cost of the bill
and that's before sales/service taxes which add another - what, 6%?

What are all these fees/taxes/access charges doing to real wages?

What's the measure of productivity he's quoting? Per unit, per hour,
per what? I would think that if a company over 8 years increased it's
productivity by 20% (which is 2.5%/yr by the way) that's not a whole lot
considering inflation, raw material costs, etc. And if your company has
a high labor quotient to the cost of production, that's almost
negligible.

If you want to consider inflation, real wages have decreased.

Well, I think the last time I could buy a decent cigar for .75¢ was
about twenty years ago. :)


You should see my water bill. After all the extras like waste water
management and environmental protection fees aew tacked on, the basic charge
and actual usage fees (per cubic meter) triples.
Unbelievable..

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:31:09 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:21:32 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Is snerk a remark like snot? It's "snot" in the dictionary and it's "snot"
making any sense. Snot at least is both of those.

Is it just the best the group can muster. My answer to that snerk!

snot

You need to do your own research about 'snerk'.
I did. It means nothing. Just as your remark means nothing. As in doesn't exist.
No value. I could go on.
snot

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:56:12 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:31:09 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:21:32 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Is snerk a remark like snot? It's "snot" in the dictionary and it's "snot"
making any sense. Snot at least is both of those.

Is it just the best the group can muster. My answer to that snerk!

snot

You need to do your own research about 'snerk'.
I did. It means nothing. Just as your remark means nothing. As in doesn't exist.
No value. I could go on.
snot

Here, I've done it for you.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=snerk

Now, be nice.
--
John

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 19:06:05 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:56:12 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:31:09 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:21:32 -0500, RLM wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:15:33 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

On Dec 14, 5:15*pm, John wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 22:10:09 +0000 (UTC), RLM wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 16:57:41 -0500, John wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 15:51:27 -0600, wrote:

On Sun, 14 Dec 2008 08:17:37 -0800, justwaitafrekinminute wrote:

There is no way in the world the American worker of present day works
harder than the guy in my dad's day. I have been victim to being told
to slow down by a union. In all fairness (which we won't expect from
the other side) I was also told to slow down while on piece work at
Standadyne, a non union shop...

That may, or may not be, but American workers are still the most
productive workers on this planet.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20572828/

In all this discussion, you've never answered the questions asked by
myself or Tom.

A lot of side-stepping, but no direct answer.

Do your own research to prove him wrong. Twenty years of welfare and
nothing but questions. Too lazy to use the internet. Still on welfare.

Who holds your hand to cross the street?

There was no research needed. They were simple questions.
--
John- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

snerk

Is snerk a remark like snot? It's "snot" in the dictionary and it's "snot"
making any sense. Snot at least is both of those.

Is it just the best the group can muster. My answer to that snerk!

snot

You need to do your own research about 'snerk'.
I did. It means nothing. Just as your remark means nothing. As in doesn't exist.
No value. I could go on.WARNING: Crossposting without setting Followup-To.
Post anyway, despite this problem?
snot

Here, I've done it for you.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=snerk

Now, be nice.

There's a book of knowledge. You use that as an example?
Snot

The Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 [gcide]

Snot \Snot\, n. [AS. snot; akin to D. snot, LG. snotte, Dan.
snot, and to E. snout. See Snout.]
1. Mucus secreted in, or discharged from, the nose. [Low]
[1913 Webster]

2. A mean, insignificant fellow. [Low]
[1913 Webster]


Snot \Snot\, v. t.
To blow, wipe, or clear, as the nose.
[1913 Webster]

WordNet (r) 2.0 [wn]

snot
n 1: a person regarded as arrogant and annoying [syn: snob, prig]
2: nasal mucus

Moby Thesaurus II by Grady Ward, 1.0 [moby-thes]

77 Moby Thesaurus words for "snot":
bugger, carrion, chyle, colostrum, corruption, creep, crumb, cur,
dandruff, decay, discharge, dog, excrement, filth, foul matter,
furfur, gangrene, gleet, high-hat, humor, ichor, knave, lachryma,
lactation, leukorrhea, louse, lowlife, lymph, matter, mess, milk,
muck, mucor, mucus, obscenity, ordure, peccant humor, phlegm, pig,
prick, puke, purulence, pus, putrid matter, rat, reptile, rheum,
rogue, rot, saliva, sanies, scoundrel, scum, scurf, scuz,
serous fluid, serum, ****, ****head, skunk, slime, smut, snake,
snoot, sod, sordes, stinkard, stinker, suppuration, sweat, tear,
teardrop, the whites, toad, turd, urine, wretch

That's nice.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

BAR wrote:


Outstanding performers are taken care of, those who just show up and do
enough to get a paycheck should work for someone else.

You are 100% correct. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way in the
unions. They reward the lazy workers and, in turn, give the top
performers no reason to work harder than the losers. They all get the
same pre-negotiated raises so seniority is all they have as a true
benefit over the rest.

I have talked to some "top performers" who would prefer to not be in the
union so they can reap the benefits of their hard work. They were also
concerned about their pensions and would rather have an actual 401K that
can't be mismanaged - by law.

Fortunately, some hard working union members make it into management and
escape the union BS.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Boater wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Boater wrote:


It's going to be a "fun fun fun" four to eight years, watching
righties everywhere choking on their own bile.


This does sum up your philosophy of life. Instead of enjoying
watching your political party implement their agenda, that they
believe will strengthening the economy, protecting Americans, while
preserving the Constitution, reestablishing America as a world leader,
that can build consensus to solve global problems etc., you are going
to enjoy "watching righties everywhere chocking on their own bile".

Have you been this way all of your life?




First, Reggie, try to internalize the oft-stated fact that I don't give
a schitt about what you think, feel, or do.

Second, there is nothing inconsistent in believing President Obama with
the help of stronger Democratic majorities in Congress will work
assiduously to reverse the GOP horrors of the last eight years and
improve the quality of life for most Americans and our position in the
world *and* watching righties everywhere choke on their own bile.

I'll be glad to see us moving away from "traditional Republican values,"
such as lynching blacks, beating up gays, and Latinos, and keeping the
"little woman" barefoot, pregnant, and in servitude.

Damn. That was a *bit* over the top. WAFA.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
wrote:
On Dec 14, 9:01 am, "Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq."
wrote:
Boater wrote:

It's going to be a "fun fun fun" four to eight years, watching righties
everywhere choking on their own bile.
This does sum up your philosophy of life. Instead of enjoying watching
your political party implement their agenda, that they believe will
strengthening the economy, protecting Americans, while preserving the
Constitution, reestablishing America as a world leader, that can build
consensus to solve global problems etc., you are going to enjoy
"watching righties everywhere chocking on their own bile".

Have you been this way all of your life?

Remember, they are the party of intolerance and hate.. This is what
you get with the "far left". Unfortunately, that tends to be the
majority of the party recently...

NO, Harry does not represent anyone in any party. He is a frustrated
old man, who is desperately seeking emotional support in rec.boats.
Since he can not find any positive support, he is willing to accept
negative. He is like a 2 yr old whose parents ignore him, so he throws
a tantrum. I would guess he was ignored or abused by his father, and is
looking for some kind of confirmation from anyone.

He doesn't even own a house. I bought my first house when I was 25.

He has a lot to be bitter about and his narcissism only makes it worse.

Bridge loan to nowhere..
 

Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Boater wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
Boater wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq. wrote:
wrote:
On Dec 14, 9:01 am, "Reginald P. Smithers III, Esq."
wrote:
Boater wrote:

It's going to be a "fun fun fun" four to eight years, watching
righties
everywhere choking on their own bile.
This does sum up your philosophy of life. Instead of enjoying
watching
your political party implement their agenda, that they believe will
strengthening the economy, protecting Americans, while preserving
the
Constitution, reestablishing America as a world leader, that can
build
consensus to solve global problems etc., you are going to enjoy
"watching righties everywhere chocking on their own bile".

Have you been this way all of your life?

Remember, they are the party of intolerance and hate.. This is what
you get with the "far left". Unfortunately, that tends to be the
majority of the party recently...

NO, Harry does not represent anyone in any party. He is a
frustrated old man, who is desperately seeking emotional support in
rec.boats. Since he can not find any positive support, he is
willing to accept negative. He is like a 2 yr old whose parents
ignore him, so he throws a tantrum. I would guess he was ignored
or abused by his father, and is looking for some kind of
confirmation from anyone.


Ahhh...more psychobabble from the rec.boats pansy.

No it is a very accurate analysis.


More rationalization from Reggie the rec.boats pansy.

Sorry...*still* not interested in the b.s. you spew.

Harry,
I have never known anyone who is more obsessed about other people's
bile, puss and ejaculate than you are. Can you imagine what your wife,
friends or neighbors would say if they read any of your posts in
rec.boats? Can you imagine what they would think if they read your 10
plus years of inflammatory hate filled messages?

Perhaps a summary sent to his "wife" would be in order. We all have the
address.