* Duncan McC (NZ) wrote, On 6/10/2007 10:02 PM:
My issue with this situation is that the boat is marketed to novices,
yet requires extra attention to issues that are found on very few
other boats.

Absolutely - so really the instructions should be *always* operate the
boat with the ballast in place (when on the water).


Here is the decal from the 26M. I don't know if the 26X had the same
warning, but IIRC the boat that rolled didn't have a decal.

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/sa...l_apr_2006.pdf

The M version was redesigned to include several hundred pounds of
ballast plus foam in the mast which means that it should be
self-righting in most situations. In the X version, they say that if
the boat heels 50 degrees without water ballast it will quite possibly
capsize and not self-right.

Here is the full list of safety recommendations/warnings on the site:

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/safety.htm

Some of the warnings would apply to any boat, but many are unique for
a 26 foot sailboat sold as a "cruiser." In particular, without the
water ballast crew size is limited to 4 people/640 pounds. Having
sailed many years in daysailers 15-19 feet, the concept of a 26 foot
cruising boat with a cabin that is unsafe with 5 people on board is
quite unexpected.

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
* Duncan McC (NZ) wrote, On 6/10/2007 10:02 PM:
My issue with this situation is that the boat is marketed to novices,
yet requires extra attention to issues that are found on very few
other boats.

Absolutely - so really the instructions should be *always* operate the
boat with the ballast in place (when on the water).


Here is the decal from the 26M. I don't know if the 26X had the same
warning, but IIRC the boat that rolled didn't have a decal.

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/sa...l_apr_2006.pdf

The M version was redesigned to include several hundred pounds of
ballast plus foam in the mast which means that it should be
self-righting in most situations. In the X version, they say that if
the boat heels 50 degrees without water ballast it will quite possibly
capsize and not self-right.

Here is the full list of safety recommendations/warnings on the site:

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/safety.htm

Some of the warnings would apply to any boat, but many are unique for
a 26 foot sailboat sold as a "cruiser." In particular, without the
water ballast crew size is limited to 4 people/640 pounds. Having
sailed many years in daysailers 15-19 feet, the concept of a 26 foot
cruising boat with a cabin that is unsafe with 5 people on board is
quite unexpected.

That is a bit of an eye-opener!
It is hard to believe that a boat designed with these use restrictions is
offered to its target market, even for use in calm coastal waters. I wonder
how many dealers ensure that buyers know exactly what they are getting?
ChrisR

"chrisR" wrote in message
...

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
* Duncan McC (NZ) wrote, On 6/10/2007 10:02 PM:
My issue with this situation is that the boat is marketed to novices,
yet requires extra attention to issues that are found on very few
other boats.

Absolutely - so really the instructions should be *always* operate the
boat with the ballast in place (when on the water).


Here is the decal from the 26M. I don't know if the 26X had the same
warning, but IIRC the boat that rolled didn't have a decal.

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/sa...l_apr_2006.pdf

The M version was redesigned to include several hundred pounds of
ballast plus foam in the mast which means that it should be
self-righting in most situations. In the X version, they say that if
the boat heels 50 degrees without water ballast it will quite possibly
capsize and not self-right.

Here is the full list of safety recommendations/warnings on the site:

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/safety.htm

Some of the warnings would apply to any boat, but many are unique for
a 26 foot sailboat sold as a "cruiser." In particular, without the
water ballast crew size is limited to 4 people/640 pounds. Having
sailed many years in daysailers 15-19 feet, the concept of a 26 foot
cruising boat with a cabin that is unsafe with 5 people on board is
quite unexpected.

That is a bit of an eye-opener!
It is hard to believe that a boat designed with these use restrictions is
offered to its target market, even for use in calm coastal waters. I
wonder
how many dealers ensure that buyers know exactly what they are getting?
ChrisR

I used to know the owner of one of the largest dealers of them in Northern
California. He told me two things. They sell like crazy, and they're crap
boats. No, they don't fully inform the prospective owners certainly.... they
want to make the sale.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

All a bit evangelical for me

Buy one if you really want
but don't inflict it on anyone else




"Ed Gordon" wrote in message
8...
http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and see
just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac really
is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

If you're too much of a coward to admit how good the Mac26X is don't
click the link and don't read a little of what it has in it that I
pasted right here.-- Owing to "focally ruptured gangreous acute
appendicitis", I spent the better part of January 2001 arguing about
this (the Mac26x is fit for all waters), rather than sailing or working,
and have 80 pages of emails as well as several magazines and books on
boat design involving the subject. According to Sea magazine (April
2005) "California's coastline is not particularly trailerboat-friendly -
the areas where you can take small or trailerboats are limited, so it
also would stand to reason that boaters would be heading to inland lakes
and rivers in droves." But MacGregor Yachts has always oriented its
products for world-wide coastal ocean and not just Califorina sales. The
manufacturer believes that a 26 footer is too small to hold enough gear
and supplies for passage. However, at least one Mac26x dealer considers
ocean passage to be within the boat's design parameters and in 1999 more
that a few Mac26x vessels made the trip from Crandon Park marina on
Miami's Key Biscayn or nearby to the Bahamas. At least one Mac26x yacht
made the trip from the city marina at Garison Bight in Key West to the
Marquesas and on to the Tortugas. The 1000 mile coast of Florida has
been sailed by a Mac26x. And two Mac26x cruisers (from Bellingham and
Everett) were outfitted for an Alaskan inside passage (over 2000 miles)
following the Cassiopeia in that regard. Those who find the ride of a
light displacement under 30 foot sailboat preferable in ocean swells see
its potential as a long-distance passage maker. This is demonstrated by
reports that MacGregor Yachts receives many unsolicited requests for
sponsorship of expeditions involving Mac26x ocean passages and by the
consideration given to adding a platform (as discussed above) which
would be used for storage during an extended cruise. It is also a
favorite for chartering at blue water destinations such as the BVI,
Bahamas Malaysia, Spain and Belize.


Told you so. I enjoy being your mentor...


Oh, be sure to visit my new anti-drug abuse site linked under my name.
Also please click on a link or two for the sponsors to keep this site
free of charges. Much appreciated.


--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

"Richard" wrote in message
...
All a bit evangelical for me

Buy one if you really want
but don't inflict it on anyone else




"Ed Gordon" wrote in message
8...
http://www.eskimo.com/~mighetto/p11.htm

Myth#11 Mac26 is not for ocean sailing. Go ahead, click the link and see
just how good and seaworthy a professional captain thinks the Mac really
is. Dare you. Jeff expecially.

If you're too much of a coward to admit how good the Mac26X is don't
click the link and don't read a little of what it has in it that I
pasted right here.-- Owing to "focally ruptured gangreous acute
appendicitis", I spent the better part of January 2001 arguing about
this (the Mac26x is fit for all waters), rather than sailing or working,
and have 80 pages of emails as well as several magazines and books on
boat design involving the subject. According to Sea magazine (April
2005) "California's coastline is not particularly trailerboat-friendly -
the areas where you can take small or trailerboats are limited, so it
also would stand to reason that boaters would be heading to inland lakes
and rivers in droves." But MacGregor Yachts has always oriented its
products for world-wide coastal ocean and not just Califorina sales. The
manufacturer believes that a 26 footer is too small to hold enough gear
and supplies for passage. However, at least one Mac26x dealer considers
ocean passage to be within the boat's design parameters and in 1999 more
that a few Mac26x vessels made the trip from Crandon Park marina on
Miami's Key Biscayn or nearby to the Bahamas. At least one Mac26x yacht
made the trip from the city marina at Garison Bight in Key West to the
Marquesas and on to the Tortugas. The 1000 mile coast of Florida has
been sailed by a Mac26x. And two Mac26x cruisers (from Bellingham and
Everett) were outfitted for an Alaskan inside passage (over 2000 miles)
following the Cassiopeia in that regard. Those who find the ride of a
light displacement under 30 foot sailboat preferable in ocean swells see
its potential as a long-distance passage maker. This is demonstrated by
reports that MacGregor Yachts receives many unsolicited requests for
sponsorship of expeditions involving Mac26x ocean passages and by the
consideration given to adding a platform (as discussed above) which
would be used for storage during an extended cruise. It is also a
favorite for chartering at blue water destinations such as the BVI,
Bahamas Malaysia, Spain and Belize.


Told you so. I enjoy being your mentor...


Richard, this guy isn't a sailor and he has no intention of buying anything.
He's a troll... he's cross posting to make himself feel like more of human
being, something for which he barely qualifies.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

On Jun 11, 10:31 am, "Capt. JG" wrote:
"Richard" wrote in message
All a bit evangelical for me
Buy one if you really want
but don't inflict it on anyone else

Richard, this guy isn't a sailor and he has no intention of buying anything.
He's a troll... he's cross posting to make himself feel like more of human
being, something for which he barely qualifies.
- Show quoted text -

He was more amusing when he was proselytizing Veridicanism; but I
guess that's the gang who drugged, brainwashed, and robbed him.
According to him, anyway. Now he's proselytizing Macs. Plus ca change,
plus c'est la meme chose.

"KLC Lewis" wrote in
et:

Well, let's look at it rationally. Three to four trips in one year?
That means sailing year-round, in all weather conditions, including
winter storms and summer cyclone season, not to mention three or four
trips across the doldrums. Let's say three round trips, to make it
easier on our lucky sailor. Six crossings of the Pacific round trip in
one year. And not a simple rhumb-line passage from, say San Diego to
Sydney, because that is simply impossible. No, our sailor will need to
follow the prevailing winds and currents, meaning a southerly course
down and a northerly course up. Essentially, the return trip will mean
sailing at least as far north as Washington, then coming back down the
west coast.

Of course, they could always just fly back, but that would eat into
their profits. They'd be lucky to do two trips in a year, and would be
beaten up pretty well by the time it's over.



It would be dumb to sail back. What they'd be doing is more like a
delivery captain trip. Have two adverturesome young men sail down each
taking a Mac26M and sailing in company for safety. Deliver the boats and
make about 20 grand profit or more each. Then fly back to California and
do it again. What's an airline ticket cost from Australia to California?
Two grand? That's a eighteen grand profit for about a month's work. You
could do as many trips as you could during the off season to not run
into typhoons. I think you could do six trips a year by flying back.
According to sailing instructions it's a downwind milk run from
California to Australia. You'd have to cross a bit of doldrums around
Hawaii but then you're in the trades and going like all getout right for
Australia. Remember how Capt. Bligh went from Tahiti all the way past
Australia in an open row boat? It would be a piece of cake in a Mac.

--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

"Ed Gordon" wrote in message
8...
"KLC Lewis" wrote in
et:


It would be dumb to sail back. What they'd be doing is more like a
delivery captain trip. Have two adverturesome young men sail down each
taking a Mac26M and sailing in company for safety. Deliver the boats and
make about 20 grand profit or more each. Then fly back to California and
do it again. What's an airline ticket cost from Australia to California?
Two grand? That's a eighteen grand profit for about a month's work. You
could do as many trips as you could during the off season to not run
into typhoons. I think you could do six trips a year by flying back.
According to sailing instructions it's a downwind milk run from
California to Australia. You'd have to cross a bit of doldrums around
Hawaii but then you're in the trades and going like all getout right for
Australia. Remember how Capt. Bligh went from Tahiti all the way past
Australia in an open row boat? It would be a piece of cake in a Mac.

--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

Okay, give us a report when you've completed the first "delivery." :-)

Duncan McC (NZ) wrote in
. nz:

In article ,
says...
On Sun, 10 Jun 2007 14:31:54 +1200, Duncan McC (NZ)
wrote:

My own comments on a Mac 26X - which I tried out (a new one) two
years ago.

Is it a sailing boat or a speedboat? My biggest gripe, for a brand
new boat, is that it is beaten on the water (sailing) by boats that
are 25 years old (eg Farr 7.5, Noelex 25). (I bought a Farr 7.5 in
the end, BTW). I was pleasantly surprised by it's pointing ability,
but again much older boats out point it (as probably expected given
it's 'cross nature' design).

I couldn't find any Farr 7.5's for sale in the U.S., but maybe they
come on market sometimes. Do they still make them? Looks like
a nice boat. Probably not many made the trip to the U.S.

Naa, haven't made 'em for years.

That said there are several trailer sailors still made in Australia.


There was a long thread in the Mac forum where an Aussie
went through contortions having a Mac 26X shipped there.
Shipping container prices, fumigation, trailer rules/modifications,
etc. Ended costing him quite a bit. I couldn't quite figure why he
would do it.
Then another Aussie mentioned the outrageous price asked for the Mac
there (60k AUS for the X, 70k AUS for the M) and said that despite
his costs he will come out ahead should he decide to sell it off. He
is himself arranging an import.

Sorry, it was the latest model I went out in - the M model it must be.
They are about $75K (NZD) here - which is good value for a brand new
boat I think. (Actually with the high exchange rate, I'd expect to
see a much lower price, but I don't have it at hand).

The X and M are almost identical, with the M being the newer version.
A new M in the U.S. will cost maybe 30-34K U.S. tricked out with a
4-stroke 50HP and other common add-ons. I think the bare boat itself
with trailer and just a mainsail is 20-24K U.S.
Apparently trade between the U.S. and Oz/NZ is well restricted
between distance and regs. One of my sons recently sold his Chicago
based Bayliner powerboat for an attractive price (he wanted a quick
sale) to an Aussie working in Indiana. The fellow told my son he
would be sending the boat off for sale in Australia and pocket 10k
U.S. on the deal.
All very strange. Another of my sons now resides in Sydney and tells
me there are similar price anomalies with some U.S. cars, where older
models not given a second look here (Ford Taurus, eg) sell for
seemingly large sums in Australia. If I had more energy I might look
into U.S./Oz import/export business.

The price is good, and the cabin is spacious in feel. I like that.

Pretty scary you would say the price is good for a Mac 26 in Oz/NZ,
given what I've heard. Were you looking there or in the U.S.?
Agree on the Mac 26 cabin. The spartan nature gives it a less
claustrophobic feel than similar sized boats. But some will see that
lack of cabinetry as inadequate stowage.

Indeed the word 'spartan' came to mind - and indeed there is not a lot
of locker space as a result - probably not *that* bad for a weekend or
even a week away - at least everything is at hand (don't have to
rumage around lockers - as I do on my boat).



Spartan is another word for sensible when it comes to a small cruiser.
You don't want a bunch of carpets and upholtery to get moldy or dank.
You want surfaces that clean up easily with a sponge and some fresh
water. On one of the Mac sites I was reading the other day there are
pages and pages of modifications owners have made to customize their
Macs. One guy showed where he did extra storage shelves. Here's the link
to the main page. http://macgregorsailors.com/index.php

--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm

Jeff wrote in
:

* Duncan McC (NZ) wrote, On 6/10/2007 10:02 PM:
My issue with this situation is that the boat is marketed to
novices, yet requires extra attention to issues that are found on
very few other boats.

Absolutely - so really the instructions should be *always* operate
the boat with the ballast in place (when on the water).


Here is the decal from the 26M. I don't know if the 26X had the same
warning, but IIRC the boat that rolled didn't have a decal.

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/sa...l_apr_2006.pdf

The M version was redesigned to include several hundred pounds of
ballast plus foam in the mast which means that it should be
self-righting in most situations. In the X version, they say that if
the boat heels 50 degrees without water ballast it will quite possibly
capsize and not self-right.

Here is the full list of safety recommendations/warnings on the site:

http://www.macgregor26.com/safety/safety.htm

Some of the warnings would apply to any boat, but many are unique for
a 26 foot sailboat sold as a "cruiser." In particular, without the
water ballast crew size is limited to 4 people/640 pounds. Having
sailed many years in daysailers 15-19 feet, the concept of a 26 foot
cruising boat with a cabin that is unsafe with 5 people on board is
quite unexpected.




You've got to get back to basics. The Mac26X or M are trailerable boats.
The ballast is water so it can be drained for trailering. That's all you
have to remember. Fill the ballast tank right after you launch and drain
it right after you pull. That's not so hard is it?

Once you got the basics down you just have to remember that even with
the ballast tank full it's still a trailer boat that can't be treated
like a heavy ballast keel boat. It's a compromise and a damned good one
but you gotta keep it in mind all the time. Get drunk and forget and you
might pay for your stupidity.

I like to look at it this way. Macs are for the more intelligent and
careful sailors. Heavy keel boats perform poorer but are harder to
capsize so you can get drunk and sloppy and get away with it more often.
A Mac is like riding a thorobred. Hang on and enjoy the greater speed
and versatility but don't get complacent.


--
Cheerio,
Ed Gordon
http://www.freewebs.com/egordon873/index.htm