On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 23:08:53 GMT, Don White
wrote:

Matt Colie wrote:
snip

(Canada has wells in most of the great
lakes - we aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese
investment to drill under the Florida straight - we can't do that either.)

snip..

Never heard of Canada drilling the Great Lakes for oil.
Can you let us know where you found that info.

There are a few gas wells in lake Erie but I'm not aware of any oil
wells either.

"Ryk" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 14:47:57 -0600, in message

"KLC Lewis" wrote:


I'm all for energy-independence, but I cannot believe that oil wells on
our
Great Lakes would be a good idea. Oil spills from rigs on the oceans are
bad
enough -- but similar spills on the Lakes would be disasterous.

Whose Great Lakes? Keep in mind that we share them with the US. Or are
you posting from the US and speaking only of Lake Michigan?

There's already plenty of wellheads under Lake Erie where the shallow
depths make drilling quite easy and Lake Erie is in way better shape
than it was 40 years ago.

Ryk



By "our Great Lakes," I was referring to humanity. But, of humanity,
naturally Americans come first. Just ask any of our politicians.

On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 15:08:32 -0800, in message

Dan Best wrote:

"Matt Colie" said
Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil..

Energy independence sounds all well and good, but if the world is gonna
run out of fossil fuel in the foreseeable future, doesn't it make sense
to use up the other guy's first? This may seem a bit greedy and
politically incorrect to put ourselves first, but to me it seems like a
smart thing to use up the other guy's reserves first.

After all, what condition would you rather be in? The Arab, South
American, Siberian, etc. oil fields have been depleted and those of the
U.S. are still producing, or our fields depleted and us completely
dependent on foreign oil? Bear in mind that the governments of some of
those places don't have much of a history of being nice to us. How
would they behave if they literally had us "over a barrel"?

Keep in mind that this is an international forum read by people in
countries with proven oil reserves much larger than those in the US.

Ryk

"Ryk" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 15:08:32 -0800, in message

Dan Best wrote:

"Matt Colie" said
Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil..

Energy independence sounds all well and good, but if the world is gonna
run out of fossil fuel in the foreseeable future, doesn't it make sense
to use up the other guy's first? This may seem a bit greedy and
politically incorrect to put ourselves first, but to me it seems like a
smart thing to use up the other guy's reserves first.

After all, what condition would you rather be in? The Arab, South
American, Siberian, etc. oil fields have been depleted and those of the
U.S. are still producing, or our fields depleted and us completely
dependent on foreign oil? Bear in mind that the governments of some of
those places don't have much of a history of being nice to us. How
would they behave if they literally had us "over a barrel"?

Keep in mind that this is an international forum read by people in
countries with proven oil reserves much larger than those in the US.

Ryk



Don't worry. When other reserves run out, I'm sure our military will take
notice of yours too.

Larry wrote:
wrote in :


It certainly smells bad.


I guess it was in my youth......

Every time I get a whiff of 2-stroke exhaust going by the dock, I have a
flashback to the mid 1950's. I can hear and smell that Evinrude Sportwin
7.5 as my grandfather, Jack, and I are headed back to the lake inlet to
refill Granny's freezer with more fish from that hole Gramps knows about
between two Weeping Willows along the East bank about .6 miles from its
mouth into the lake.

I also VIVIDLY remember tossing his brand new mushroom anchor into the
hole, exactly like he told me to do....without a LINE tied onto it....and
crying all the way home while he was laughing and couldn't wait to tell my
grandmother.

Nope....Two stroke exhaust, to me, is one of the sweetest smelling
fragrances on the planet.....




I know what you mean, I don't care so much for the smell of 2 stroke
exhaust, but the smell of engine exhaust in general reminds me of
tinkering with lawnmowers and other small engines when I was a kid. I'm
the same way with the smell of a hot soldering iron, makes me think of
things I love doing. I can certainly see how both smells would be putrid
to someone with no interest in the subject though.

On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 22:59:40 -0600, KLC Lewis wrote:

Don't worry. When other reserves run out, I'm sure our military will take
notice of yours too.

You know what worse than people with guns? *Stupid* people with guns. No
wait, I'm wrong. It's *stupid* people with guns who mate...

In order to wrap one's head around an idea, it's helpful first to tear it
away from gazing at one's navel. Sadly for the rest of the world, the
only time the American animal tears it's gaze away from the magnificence
of it's own navel, it's to train one or more of it's guns on something or
someone else.

Oil is not the answer. It's the problem you can't solve. And you can't
solve it because you can't see anything _but_ the oil.

KLC,

I don't like the thought of spills either, but three Canadian companies
have a total of 450+ wells for both oil and natural gas in Lake Erie
alone. They seem to manage just fine (with gear and technology from
American suppliers).

Recently, I was told by someone that has studied these problems for many
years that most of the oil on Lake Erie comes from untrapped storm
drains. The last big one was the Rouge River about three years ago.

We have the opportunity to correct a lot of problems if we pick the real
ones instead of the "politically correct" ones.

This has been my problem with the "evironmental movement" since they
forced cars to get much reduced fuel economy in favor of maginally
reduced tailpipe emissions. Remember the early cat cars of the mid
seventies?

Matt


KLC Lewis wrote:
"Matt Colie" wrote in message
...

Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil and not let anybody
go get what we have. (Canada has wells in most of the great lakes - we
aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese investment to drill
under the Florida straight - we can't do that either.)

Matt Colie - environmentally conscious but educated and realistic




I'm all for energy-independence, but I cannot believe that oil wells on our
Great Lakes would be a good idea. Oil spills from rigs on the oceans are bad
enough -- but similar spills on the Lakes would be disasterous.

KLC Lewis wrote:
"Ryk" wrote in message
...

On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 15:08:32 -0800, in message

Dan Best wrote:


"Matt Colie" said

Why do they make noise about dependence on foreign oil..

Energy independence sounds all well and good, but if the world is gonna
run out of fossil fuel in the foreseeable future, doesn't it make sense
to use up the other guy's first? This may seem a bit greedy and
politically incorrect to put ourselves first, but to me it seems like a
smart thing to use up the other guy's reserves first.

After all, what condition would you rather be in? The Arab, South
American, Siberian, etc. oil fields have been depleted and those of the
U.S. are still producing, or our fields depleted and us completely
dependent on foreign oil? Bear in mind that the governments of some of
those places don't have much of a history of being nice to us. How
would they behave if they literally had us "over a barrel"?

Keep in mind that this is an international forum read by people in
countries with proven oil reserves much larger than those in the US.

Ryk




Don't worry. When other reserves run out, I'm sure our military will take
notice of yours too.



Sounds like that old 'Manifest Destiny' plan again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifest_Destiny

Don,

Apart from being personal friends with the people that do this (they
sail out of La Salle Marines and Cedar Beach clubs, I can point you to
NOAA chart 14830. Down load it and look at the area east of the Pelee
Pennisula. The meatball in crosshairs is a mark that indicates a
wellhead, the dash with dot lines between them are submarine pipelines.
If you go farther east (14820) and look east of Port Stanley there are
more - but I don't sail there. Remember, each marked well head could
possibly have a dozen actual well pipes - each drilled without incident.


For the last three seasons we have all been watching a new rig working
at about N04148.500W08233.300 (location is appoximate from my log). I
was told by Canadian friends that this is a multi drill natural gas well
that will be drilling for another 10 years. Then the wells will be
capped below ice level and marked with a tower. Is makes a wonderful
refence when racing through Pelee Passage at night.

Matt

Don White wrote:

Matt Colie wrote:
snip

(Canada has wells in most of the great

lakes - we aren't allowed to, Cuba will soon be using Chinese
investment to drill under the Florida straight - we can't do that
either.)

snip..

Never heard of Canada drilling the Great Lakes for oil.
Can you let us know where you found that info.

"mr.b" wrote in message
news
On Sun, 26 Nov 2006 22:59:40 -0600, KLC Lewis wrote:

Don't worry. When other reserves run out, I'm sure our military will take
notice of yours too.

You know what worse than people with guns? *Stupid* people with guns. No
wait, I'm wrong. It's *stupid* people with guns who mate...

In order to wrap one's head around an idea, it's helpful first to tear it
away from gazing at one's navel. Sadly for the rest of the world, the
only time the American animal tears it's gaze away from the magnificence
of it's own navel, it's to train one or more of it's guns on something or
someone else.

Oil is not the answer. It's the problem you can't solve. And you can't
solve it because you can't see anything _but_ the oil.

Chill, dude. My post was satire. All-too-true, unfortunately, but satire
none-the-less.