New Conservative wrote:

Along with lurid accounts of absurdly heavy weather, it's hazards
like this that are enough to put me off sailing (before I've even
started). Can anyone offer a few crumbs of comfort on the prospects of
surviving such encounters?

Yeah - this is a good lesson in "pick your weather". People on
delivery voyages seldom have that option. Pleasure sailing season in
the North Atlantic ISN'T in February IMO.

I bet the story wouldn't have been that exciting if they had gone in
May or June. In 3-1/2 years of sailing from Vancouver Canada, through
the Panama Canal and ending up in Annapolis MD, I can only recall 3
episodes of weather "bad enough" to remember (and nothing as bad as
the original poster). We got very good at watching the weather and
deciding for _ourselves_ when it was time to make a passage.

Evan Gatehouse

rhys wrote:
Great story, by the way, particularly for this time of year when half
of us are on the hard!


Thank you, glad yoou enjoyed it.

What kind of preventers and jacklines did you have rigged?


Preventers... none. IMHO a preventer might have saved the traveler (but
then it might not) and probably would have resulted in a shredded main
much sooner and possibly a serious (ie flooding) knockdown. One reason
we didn't rig a preventer to the main boom was that there was no place
to secure one, other than the mooring cleats.

What kind of tethers and harnesses did the crew have, or did the
owner or skipper provide them?


I have a wide poly webbing harness with a shock absorber; the captain
brought two harnesses & long tethers; two of the crew bought SOSpenders
the day before departure.

The jacklines were galvanized cable put on by the delivery captain;
these proved a bit troublesome in that they definitely interfere with
footing and also bang up the deck. However I don't doubt that they would
have functioned to keep a person from getting lost overboard.

The biggest problem is accessibility. With an afterthought jackline, not
fitted to the boat, much of the time you can't be hooked on while
working. For example, the biggest risk we had of a person going
overboard was when unrigging the bimini... involving two people standing
up on the coaming, at the height of the squall, wrestling with the
thing... unhooked to jackline of course. Later, when working at the
mast, I had to unhook too. It slows you down and makes it more risky IMHO.

What kind of foul weather gear did you have, and did it work well
enough in the conditions? (I know it wasn't freezing, but I bet it got
pretty damn chilly in spots with that 40-50 knot wind).


I didn't notice the chill until later. Foul weather gear varied... I had
a one-piece Gill dinghy racing suit, which was great until I wore out
the knees crawling on the deck (it was old anyway). After a change into
dry socks, I was comfy. I plan to get another one-piece racing suit, as
I think it's more limber & more waterproof than bibs & jacket. I've also
worn my dinghy racing neoprene booties offshore and find them better
than "offshore" gear... your feet get wet but stay warm. As long as you
have a place to stow the wet stuff, and don't run out of dry towels,
it's the way to go.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Doug,

Would the potential flooding knockdown be due to an inability to release
the preventer from the cockpit, or what ?

What would you recommend for properly securing such a preventer, on that
boat, since you say it had only cleats ?

Courtney




DSK wrote:

rhys wrote:

Great story, by the way, particularly for this time of year when half
of us are on the hard!


Thank you, glad yoou enjoyed it.

What kind of preventers and jacklines did you have rigged?


Preventers... none. IMHO a preventer might have saved the traveler (but
then it might not) and probably would have resulted in a shredded main
much sooner and possibly a serious (ie flooding) knockdown. One reason
we didn't rig a preventer to the main boom was that there was no place
to secure one, other than the mooring cleats.

What kind of tethers and harnesses did the crew have, or did the
owner or skipper provide them?


I have a wide poly webbing harness with a shock absorber; the captain
brought two harnesses & long tethers; two of the crew bought SOSpenders
the day before departure.

The jacklines were galvanized cable put on by the delivery captain;
these proved a bit troublesome in that they definitely interfere with
footing and also bang up the deck. However I don't doubt that they would
have functioned to keep a person from getting lost overboard.

The biggest problem is accessibility. With an afterthought jackline, not
fitted to the boat, much of the time you can't be hooked on while
working. For example, the biggest risk we had of a person going
overboard was when unrigging the bimini... involving two people standing
up on the coaming, at the height of the squall, wrestling with the
thing... unhooked to jackline of course. Later, when working at the
mast, I had to unhook too. It slows you down and makes it more risky IMHO.

What kind of foul weather gear did you have, and did it work well
enough in the conditions? (I know it wasn't freezing, but I bet it got
pretty damn chilly in spots with that 40-50 knot wind).


I didn't notice the chill until later. Foul weather gear varied... I had
a one-piece Gill dinghy racing suit, which was great until I wore out
the knees crawling on the deck (it was old anyway). After a change into
dry socks, I was comfy. I plan to get another one-piece racing suit, as
I think it's more limber & more waterproof than bibs & jacket. I've also
worn my dinghy racing neoprene booties offshore and find them better
than "offshore" gear... your feet get wet but stay warm. As long as you
have a place to stow the wet stuff, and don't run out of dry towels,
it's the way to go.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King



--
s/v Mutiny
Rhodes Bounty II
lying Oriental, NC
WDB5619

There's lots of diving always going on


Very interesting. Thanks.

Courtney Thomas wrote:
Doug,

Would the potential flooding knockdown be due to an inability to release
the preventer from the cockpit, or what ?


Yes. If the boat accidentally gybes, for whatever reason, in severe
conditions, there is a risk that the preventer will hold the sail aback
and knock the boat further over than it otherwise would go... and do to
the fact that the preventer is still holding it, keep the lee side
pressed down and possibly begin taking on water. Boats with large and/or
low companionways, and/or large cockpit lockers opening into the hull
are particularly at risk of flooding (in this or other scenarios).

Another risk with a preventer is that when the boat heels or rolls far
enough to dip the boom end, at good speed... or perhaps just into a wave
crest, that it will either spin the boat around or carry something away.

I have not liked preventers but up until very recently have never had a
problem with accidental gybes.

What would you recommend for properly securing such a preventer, on that
boat, since you say it had only cleats ?


I said it had mooring cleats, which are both the wrong type and in an
awkward place to secure something like a preventer. You want to be able
to cast it off quickly. I'd suggest setting up a big jam cleat, perhaps
leading it fair to a jib sheet cleat.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 19:31:14 -0500, DSK wrote:

I said it had mooring cleats, which are both the wrong type and in an
awkward place to secure something like a preventer. You want to be able
to cast it off quickly. I'd suggest setting up a big jam cleat, perhaps
leading it fair to a jib sheet cleat.

===================================

That is a common situation. You can secure a good sized snatch block
to the mooring cleat with a short piece of line, and then lead the
preventer line aft from the snatch block to a cockpit winch where it
can be released or adjusted. This is common practice in my
experience. The snatch block can also be fastened forward to the
toerail or a lifeline stanchion base on many boats.

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:19:31 -0500, DSK wrote:

If you go out to the middle of the Gulf Stream looking for favorable
current, or follow a rhumb line all the way, you end up about 120 miles
out which is too far IMHO for weather contingincies.

============================

That is true but you can shade the course a bit to the west for the
first half of the trip and still get a piece of the gulf stream. I
can average over 8 kts with the trawler so getting a full kick from
the stream is not as important.