On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 06:01:25 GMT, remove the *
(Norm) wrote:

If I leave the varnish go on the teak cap rail, hand rails and other
trim will it ruin the wood? If several years later I decide to go
back to varnish, is it harder to clean up and get back into shape then
it would have been if I would have maintained the varnish over the
years?

What is everyone doing with their outside teak trim? Comments would
be great.


After 15 years and a couple of scraping sessions, I have almost got
rid of the varnish on my teak. I don't know how hard it would be to
revarnish, and I don't intend to find out.

Most of it peeled off in the first year, bu tthere were stubborn spots
that seemed as if they would never peel.



Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a

"WooWooism lives" Anon grafitto on the base of the Cuttyhunk breakwater light

Varnish is quite 'passe' with the advent of the 'modern'
acrylic/urethanes. Two products that will last typically at least 5
years: "Honey Teak" and "Smith&Co. 5 yr. Clear". If you do at least
one major 'overhaul' you may get more years. I'm into 6 years and still
looks good. These 'almost' look as good as varnish, can be
power-buffed back to brilliance, but typicaly need a quick overcoat of
clear once yearly. They are catalysed 2 part base plus 2 part clear
and can be totally applied in one long day (4-5 coats). The 'secret' to
make tham last is to put on HEAVY base coats. The longer they are
exposed to sun the lighter they get. They are expensive but when you
amortize over 5+ years are really cheap overall .... and much less work
than all the 'others'. Dont use them on Iroko or other teak
'imitations'. For recoating just rub the finish with a 3M purple pad
and apply with a soft artist's brush.
Honey Teak is available from www.signaturefinish.com.
I use Honey teak with extra applied clear coats and then flat sand
(2000 grit) and then hand rub with rottenstone for a mirror finish that
would make a brand new Hinckley blush with envy.

I abhor Cetol and Cetol 'Light; as they both hide the wood grain (and
look like **** and ****-light).

Absolutely NOTHING will look as good as varnish, but it *always* loses
adhesion and eventually lifts.

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 05:20:19 GMT, Rich Hampel
wrote:

Varnish is quite 'passe' with the advent of the 'modern'
acrylic/urethanes. Two products that will last typically at least 5
years: "Honey Teak" and "Smith&Co. 5 yr. Clear". If you do at least
one major 'overhaul' you may get more years. I'm into 6 years and still
looks good. These 'almost' look as good as varnish, can be
power-buffed back to brilliance, but typicaly need a quick overcoat of
clear once yearly. They are catalysed 2 part base plus 2 part clear
and can be totally applied in one long day (4-5 coats). The 'secret' to
make tham last is to put on HEAVY base coats. The longer they are
exposed to sun the lighter they get. They are expensive but when you
amortize over 5+ years are really cheap overall .... and much less work
than all the 'others'. Dont use them on Iroko or other teak
'imitations'. For recoating just rub the finish with a 3M purple pad
and apply with a soft artist's brush.
Honey Teak is available from www.signaturefinish.com.
I use Honey teak with extra applied clear coats and then flat sand
(2000 grit) and then hand rub with rottenstone for a mirror finish that
would make a brand new Hinckley blush with envy.

I abhor Cetol and Cetol 'Light; as they both hide the wood grain (and
look like **** and ****-light).

Absolutely NOTHING will look as good as varnish, but it *always* loses
adhesion and eventually lifts.

Last year, I tried Tropitech, an acrylic deck/spa 'stain' on the wood
I didn't remove on the outside...companionway boards, cockpit coming
and grate.

One year and 3 hurricanes later it's still in fairly good shape.
There are a few places with wear, dings, and needs a bit of care, but
haven't moved up the priority list. It could be late winter before it
is bad enough to touch up....even though I'm told it can refreshed
with a dab on a rag....we'll see.

While sold as a stain for decks, docks, and spas, it looks ok.
Clearly not the luster of mile deep varnish, but non-slip and durable,
and doesn't quite look like paint.

Rich Hampel wrote:

I abhor Cetol and Cetol 'Light; as they both hide the wood grain (and
look like **** and ****-light).

lol beer shoots out of nose

Absolutely NOTHING will look as good as varnish, but it *always* loses
adhesion and eventually lifts.

Abolutely nothing looks as good as the _oiled_ brightwork on my 1966
Hinterhoeller. Varnishing is a total PITA that is as much work as
oiling. Wearing out the rails? Replace 'em.
my $0.02

Rich,
I saw a boat done in "Honey Teak" and it looked real dark. Is that the
normal color for it? Or maybe was it just the wood?
I have been told that the acrylics are great except around stanchions or
anywhere where the water may get under it and lift. I have all varnished
teak on my floating piece of furniture and I had thought about trying the
cap rail with Bristol or Honey Teak if there wasn't much difference to
notice from the toe rail. I use 2015 Flagship varnish now and if I am lucky
I may get 6 months before a recoat.
I would paint a piece of teak white in a heartbeat before I would ever apply
Cetol but that's just my opinion. I have a neighbor that uses it and just
"slaps" it on over the peeling Cetol stuff and it looks like a bad house
paint job but then again he has oysters growing on the side of the hull!
Phil

"Rich Hampel" wrote in message
...
Varnish is quite 'passe' with the advent of the 'modern'
acrylic/urethanes. Two products that will last typically at least 5
years: "Honey Teak" and "Smith&Co. 5 yr. Clear". If you do at least
one major 'overhaul' you may get more years. I'm into 6 years and still
looks good. These 'almost' look as good as varnish, can be
power-buffed back to brilliance, but typicaly need a quick overcoat of
clear once yearly. They are catalysed 2 part base plus 2 part clear
and can be totally applied in one long day (4-5 coats). The 'secret' to
make tham last is to put on HEAVY base coats. The longer they are
exposed to sun the lighter they get. They are expensive but when you
amortize over 5+ years are really cheap overall .... and much less work
than all the 'others'. Dont use them on Iroko or other teak
'imitations'. For recoating just rub the finish with a 3M purple pad
and apply with a soft artist's brush.
Honey Teak is available from www.signaturefinish.com.
I use Honey teak with extra applied clear coats and then flat sand
(2000 grit) and then hand rub with rottenstone for a mirror finish that
would make a brand new Hinckley blush with envy.

I abhor Cetol and Cetol 'Light; as they both hide the wood grain (and
look like **** and ****-light).

Absolutely NOTHING will look as good as varnish, but it *always* loses
adhesion and eventually lifts.

Any joint that can 'work' butts, scarfs will break integrity and
promote loss of adhesion.... no matter if varnish, acrylics, and the
ever popular orange boat paint.

Honey Teak, etc. will be fairly dark when you first apply, but will
fade over a short time to an amber glow - similar to oil based
varnishes.
If the teak darkens too much, you can bleach with oxalic, etc. to
lighten before large scale applications and with apparently no adhesion
problems later on.

I have acres of Burmese teak and 'everything' that I put on will
darken; therefore, I bleach it first with oxalic. I also before *any*
coating cover with saran and let the sun 'develop' the color and hue
for several days/weeks before bleaching and coating.

Additional comments with Honey Teak, varnish, etc. .... I usually do a
hand-rub finish step to develop the irridescent 'patina' of the wood.
This is essentially a frictional heat process done by a bare hand that
deveops the 'warmth' effect in high quality varnish, etc. Plus, a hand
rub will provide a totally flattened surface onto which further coats
are easily laid down. .... Hand rubbing is usually only found on
mega-yachts with unlimited budgets, Hinckleys at boat shows, museums,
etc. If you only slap on successive coats and dont hand rub, all you
get is coated wood; if however, you also hand rub then you get
perfection that 'glows.

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 03:09:44 GMT, Rich Hampel
wrote:

This is essentially a frictional heat process done by a bare hand that
deveops the 'warmth' effect in high quality varnish, etc. Plus, a hand
rub will provide a totally flattened surface onto which further coats
are easily laid down.

===========================

I'm not doubting you but am curious to know more about your technique.
Do you rub with an abrasive polishing compound like pumice or
rottenstone?

First flat sand with 1300 or 2000 grit wet and dry to get a FLAT
surface; then, .... Rottenstone and water for gloss, rottenstone and
oil for semi-gloss, pumice and and oil for satin. For a 'perfection'
surface final coat with an airbrush. The modern acrylic/urethanes can
be power buffed (with super fine diotomaceous earth etc. as the 'grit')
to make this whole hand-rub process very fast.

If you ever have the opportunity to look at the wood trim in top of the
line type of private jets or mega yachts or even automobiles.... all
the finishes are hand rubbed to a super brilliant surface. A benefit
of a flat hand-rubbed surface is longevity. The only finish that is
more brilliant than a hand rub on varnish is a 'french-polish' using
alcohol and shellac .... but that is NOT for any wet locations.

Subject: Teak - Varnish, Oil, Or leave it go blond?
From: Rich Hampel

Absolutely NOTHING will look as good as varnish, but it *always* loses
adhesion and eventually lifts.

First is true, second part is not.

Capt. Bill