I have found some pirogue plans that look like something to tackle for
a first project. Simple cuts and nice lines on the finished boat.
Now some questions glues, etc.

Can you use construction adhesives? If so what brands? What other
glues do you recommend?I am thinking of glassing the outside seams and
useing some sort of filet on the inside seam, with or without glass
covering the inner seam. If I can use adhesive I can save on epoxy by
not fileting with thickened epoxy. I would run a bead of adhesive
along the inside seam for seal and additional bonding same as one
would do with epoxy paste. I will need glue anyway during
construction and "one glue fits all" would be convenient.

Is construction adhesive compatible with resin and glass if I choose
to glass the inner seam over the bead (filet) of adhesive? Can you
paint over the adhesive if I do not cover wigh glass??

I am not necessarily looking for long term durability, but would like
a boat with a reasonable lifespan. I am thinking of this as a
"practice" project.

Kirk P

Subject

EPOXY

Lew

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
k.net...
Subject

EPOXY

Agreed. Forget anything else, use epoxy. Although more expensive, it will
only be a fraction of the total cost of your boat and really really not
worth the hassle of using anything else with it's typical problems. You
cannot for instance make a fillet or bead with construction adhesive,
because when this glue is not pressed between two pieces of wood, it wil
just procuse foam without any structural strength. And don't go fo polyester
either.

Meindert

I used this kind of glue when I made my boat.
Resorcinol glue is a waterproof two-part system that meets or exceeds the
requirements of MIL-A-46051 (Type 1, Grade A), (Type II, Grade C), and
MIL-A-22397 (Grade A). It resists outdoor exposure, cold or boiling water,
heat, molds, and solvents. Pot life: 3-4 hrs. Mix Ratio: 4 to 1 by weight.
Excellent for use on wood structures.
It's 2 part and one of the cans is a powder reactant. If you use it, don't
get it on your fingers like I did. It has a feeling like your hands are
dying.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...resorcinol.php
"Meindert Sprang" wrote in message
ll.nl...
"Lew Hodgett" wrote in message
k.net...
Subject

EPOXY

Agreed. Forget anything else, use epoxy. Although more expensive, it will
only be a fraction of the total cost of your boat and really really not
worth the hassle of using anything else with it's typical problems. You
cannot for instance make a fillet or bead with construction adhesive,
because when this glue is not pressed between two pieces of wood, it wil
just procuse foam without any structural strength. And don't go fo
polyester
either.

Meindert

"g" wrote in message
...
I used this kind of glue when I made my boat.
Resorcinol glue is a waterproof two-part system that meets or exceeds the
requirements of MIL-A-46051 (Type 1, Grade A), (Type II, Grade C), and
MIL-A-22397 (Grade A). It resists outdoor exposure, cold or boiling water,
heat, molds, and solvents. Pot life: 3-4 hrs. Mix Ratio: 4 to 1 by weight.
Excellent for use on wood structures.

But but but..... resorcinol needs an exact fit between both parts and then
you need to clamp the parts together. There is no way you can glue to panels
or strakes of a boat together with that, let alone make fillets. There is
only one glue that allows this: epoxy (with a proper filler).

Meindert

On Fri, 9 Mar 2007 07:51:16 +0100, "Meindert Sprang"
wrote:

"g" wrote in message
.. .
I used this kind of glue when I made my boat.
Resorcinol glue is a waterproof two-part system that meets or exceeds the
requirements of MIL-A-46051 (Type 1, Grade A), (Type II, Grade C), and
MIL-A-22397 (Grade A). It resists outdoor exposure, cold or boiling water,
heat, molds, and solvents. Pot life: 3-4 hrs. Mix Ratio: 4 to 1 by weight.
Excellent for use on wood structures.

But but but..... resorcinol needs an exact fit between both parts and then
you need to clamp the parts together. There is no way you can glue to panels
or strakes of a boat together with that, let alone make fillets. There is
only one glue that allows this: epoxy (with a proper filler).

Meindert

Hi Meindert,
Agreed in principle, but..... I built my yacht triple diagonal over
stringers with resorcinol before sheathing it with glass cloth and
epoxy. Where I couldn't clamp the first layer to the stringers I
screwed them down through a block of waste wood and removed the screws
later - thus no gaps. In other places and for the second and third
layers I used bronze serated boat nails and punched them flush. What I
like about using resorcinol, apart from its aforementioned virtues is
the pot life. Also, epoxy has no sheer strength. Taking advice from
professional wooden mast builders, I glued my box section 45 foot
wooden mast together with it. To this day, not a problem. Most
resorcinol needs a thickening agent. I bought a powder made from
ground up olive pitts of all things. A factory that makes ply near me
uses ordinary domestic flour.

A tip that someone gave me for using epoxy after I had almost finished
building. To "clamp" wood such as mouldings firmly and correctly in
place when you do not want to nail or screw and cannot apply a G or F
clamp, apply epoxy along the join excepting for a couple of small
spots. Apply a dab or molten glue from a hot glue gun and then hold it
in place for 30 seconds. It does not move at all. Saves one hell of a
lot of frustration especially when pressure from a clamp causes it to
slide.

cheers
Peter
N.Z. yacht Herodotus

Barend Mighelson of Montreal and David Beede of Florida have both used
construction adhesive (liquid nails, polyurethane adhesive) for stitch
and tape construction. David discusses it on his website www.simplicityboats.com.
Barend used to have a website but I haven't looked at it for a long
time. Try a search on his name.

I've used both urea formaldehyde (plastic resin) and polyurethane on
small boats like the pirogue, but I've used the screwed and glued
chine batten construction method. Take a look at www.ncf.ca/~ag384/Boats.htm.
The Dogskiff is urea formaldehyde. The others are polyurethane. I've
only used LePage's Bull Dog brand PL Premium but Dave Beede has tried
other kinds.

I prefer the polyurethane to the urea formaldehyde for lower cost,
greater working temperature range, and lower clamping pressure.

I don't tape the outside of the seams. Just make sure they are sealed.
I use polyester resin for that, but sometimes epoxy which I buy in
small "household glue" package. Sand the edge smooth, mix a drop or
two at a time, and spread on the edge with a toothpick. I have butt
joined plywood panels with polyester resin and fibreglass cloth. Look
at the Delta on my website,but I prefer plywood butt blocks with
polyurethane. Spread the polyurethane with a puttty knife. Also wear
gloves because the polyurethane takes a week to wear off.

PS the screw and glue method allows you to assenmble the boat dry (dry
fit) then take it apart and assemble it permanently with the adhesive.
I use 3/4" battens and 3/4" wood screws spaced 4" apart on 1/4"
plywood. Drill pilot holes and offset the ones on the side pieces 2"
from the ones on the bottom so the screws end up spaced 2" apart.