Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light. Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead and sternlight.
OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?

I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

pete wrote:
Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light.

Two diffrent circuits. Two diffrent switches to activate.

Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead and sternlight.

I think you mean "side lights" not sternlight. No?


OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?


tricolor light is used on sailboats only.

once you are "propelled by machinery" (motor) you are offically a
motorboat and can not use the tricolor.

Of course ya got the 7m , 12m and 20m thing.

Ya might read the colregs found:

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/mwv/navrules/navrules.htm


I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

So do you want to use your anchor light to also serve as an all around
white light when putting about as a motor boat?

And how far does the anchor light in your tricolor shine?

And how far is a ColReg all-round white light suppose to shine when
underway as a motorboat under 12m?
Bulb Head Bob

Pete,

Your confusion is not unique.

The all around and the navigation lights (red and green set) should
never be on at the same time.

The problem is that the regulators have been pushing the trilight on the
basis of better visiblity when undersail without any consideration of:
a- maintenance, b- equipment complications.

Though it is not clear unless you are very good at reading regulese (my
new word), there is separation required between the navigation lights
and the forward range light (aka steaming light) that is not possible
with a trilight.

Ergo - you must still retain and use the low level navigation lights
when propelled by machinery.

Matt Colie
Lifelong Waterman, Licensed Mariner and Congenital Sailor

pete wrote:
Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light. Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead


and sternlight.
OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?

I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

pete wrote:
Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light.
snip

The Tri-Color is a sail only light located at the top of the mast.

The mooring light is also usually located at the top of the mast and
requires a separate circuit.

When you are under engine power, NONE of the above lights are used.

A white "Steaming light", usually located about half way up the mast,
a rear white light as well as red and green lights, usually mounted
near deck level, are required, again on a separate circuit.

I used a couple of 3 pole, double throw panel switches that were wired
to cross interlock them.

You could have either the Tri-Color or the "Steaming" lights, but not
both.

The 3rd pole on the switches was used to control the red back lighting
used at night on the compass and other instruments.

HTH

Lew

Pete,

Do yourself a big favor and DO NOT opt for the tricolour mastead light
allowed under colregs Rule 25b, especially if you plan to go offshore.
The problem is with visibility to other ships. Sure, they're easier to
see because they're high up, but on a dark night, where a watchkeeper
on a cargo ship may be judging your distance by the light's height on
the horizon, he may think that you're far away while you're almost up
against him.

Radar doesn't help the problem, because your small boat might not
return much of an echo. Normally, if you have a radar reflector, enough
of an echo is returned to show up on the screen, but in the case where
the officer of the watch sees your lights high on the horizon, and
thinks you're further away, he may not notice your echo very close to
the sea clutter at the center of his screen. I was sailing on a Panamax
bulker, last winter, and the captain told me how this had happened to
him. He came very close to a yacht, so close that he could see there
wasn't anyone steering, once he turned on the outside floodlights. As I
described above, he thought the vessel was further away, and made of a
material absorbing his radar waves, like wood or fibreglass. He finally
had a doubt when he noticed the bearing was altering quickly, and so he
turned on the floodlights. The yacht was about a hundred meters away on
the port side. Needless to say, there was panic and "hard-a-starboard".

Anyway, my point is that if you want masthead lights in order for ships
to spot you more easily, you should opt for the combination allowed
under rule 25c, which is all-round red over green at the masthead
combined with sidelights at the deck level, and a sternlight also at
deck level. Thus, you'll present Red-Green-Red, Red-Green-Green or
Red-Green-White to any approaching ship, which is guaranteed to
persuade even the thickest-headed Russian mate to shy from the course
line on his electronic chart.

-maxime camirand


pete wrote:
Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light. Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead and sternlight.
OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?

I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

On Thu, 19 Oct 2006 18:06:24 +0200, pete wrote:

Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light. Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead and sternlight.
OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?

I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

Ah ha, thanks for the input guys, I wasn't ware that the masthead tri
light wasn't allowed under engine, my copy of the regs doesn't read
like that, but I had my fears confirmed about it all.

I am opting for the lower level lighting arrangement, my old boat was
like that with the separate steaming light halfway up the mast.

As it happens, I have been advised that inshore, higher level lights
can get confused with land lights, whereas the lower level lights look
to be on the water and therefore not on land.

I did hire a 9m sailboat a few months ago though, and this was a brand
new Beneteau, with no steaming light, just the all round anchor light
I described before. I wasn't happy about it as I was motor sailing in
poor weather, but I never met any other boats to confuse
so.................

Pete. (Next questions coming soon!!)

"pete" wrote

I did hire a 9m sailboat a few months ago though, and this was a brand
new Beneteau, with no steaming light, just the all round anchor light
I described before. I wasn't happy about it as I was motor sailing in
poor weather, but I never met any other boats to confuse
so.................

On a boat less than 20m, it is acceptable to have port/stb lights plus an
all round white light when under power. Many power boats use this set-up and
it is acceptable on sailboats too when under power.

The all round light should of course be a nav light not a low intensity
anchor light. Our all round light has a bulb with two filaments - one for
anchor light and one for navigation.

So the minimum you would need is (?):

Sailing: Tricolor on mast top, nothin else.
Motoring: Tricolor on mast top plus 'steaming light' forward, half up
the mast
OR
All around white light on mast top plus red/green on
bow
Anchoring: All around white light on mast top.

That would mean for motoring you could augment the tricolor with
whichever of the original lights is still working.

Is this correct? (I am currently putting a lightstick up the mast when
anchoring.


Matt Colie wrote:
Pete,

Your confusion is not unique.

The all around and the navigation lights (red and green set) should
never be on at the same time.

The problem is that the regulators have been pushing the trilight on the
basis of better visiblity when undersail without any consideration of:
a- maintenance, b- equipment complications.

Though it is not clear unless you are very good at reading regulese (my
new word), there is separation required between the navigation lights
and the forward range light (aka steaming light) that is not possible
with a trilight.

Ergo - you must still retain and use the low level navigation lights
when propelled by machinery.

Matt Colie
Lifelong Waterman, Licensed Mariner and Congenital Sailor

pete wrote:
Hi guys, I'm just about to buy the nav lights for my 34 sailboat and
need a bit of advice on tricolour lights.
I reckon that the higher the nav lights the better and although none
of my previous boats had masthead tri colour lights I want to fit
those on my new one.
BUT I'm a bit confused about the use of what is advertised as a
combined tri/mooring light. Under sail there is no problem, but if
under motor, according to the colregs boats of my size may display a
white all round combined masthead


and sternlight.
OK staightforward enough, but if using an all round white light
directly under the port and starboard masthead lights, will the white
all round light not make it harder for other boats to see the coloured
lights?

I have looked at a few new boats and they don't have any other
steaming light fitted. Is this just sloppy practice by the
boatbuilders or am I getting my knickers in a twist for nothing?

wrote:
So the minimum you would need is (?):

Sailing: Tricolor on mast top, nothin else.
Motoring: Tricolor on mast top plus 'steaming light' forward, half up
the mast
OR
All around white light on mast top plus red/green on
bow
Anchoring: All around white light on mast top.

Not quite.

Read and understand my previous post.


Lew

Ooops, November 3rd must be smartassday.

I understand that you can't show the all around white light
directly above the red green, but I thought that one can
combine steaming and rear (~12m), so what is wrong
with the combinations above?


Not quite.

Read and understand my previous post.


Lew