I would like to add my two cents.
Last spring I used Luan to make hatch doors for my boat.
Biscuits were used and the panel boards were washed with acetone and glued
with Titebond ll and pipe clamps.
The doors were coated with Behr Tung oil finish fortified with UVI. Several
coat were applied inside my garage.
They were my pride and joy. Then in mid August the panels were showing
signs of separations. Part lines began to be very visible. I then replaced
the new hatch doors with the old one made with Teak plywood..
I do not know what happened. Maybe the Luan is not compatible with Titebond
ll.
Now that I learned my lesson I'll go back to using epoxy on my boat.

"Rodney Myrvaagnes" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 15:50:05 GMT, "Fred Williams"
wrote:


Tite Bond II is all I use for wood working around the house. I have
projects like bird houses that have survived outdoors, but I would never
use
it on my boat. That is what Epoxy is for, IMHO.

If the interior job involves continuous load, original Titebond is
less prone to creep than Titebond II.


Rodney Myrvaagnes Opionated old geezer

Faith-based economics: It's deja voodoo all over again

Brian Whatcott wrote in message . ..
Yesterday, I was applying two by four doublers to one or two rafters
and perlins in the roofspace of the homestread, cracked or broken
after half a century's service. I left one doubler stud overnight,
with some Titebond carpenter's glue applied to one face.

This morning, I noticed I had left a fender washer on the glue face,
and the glue had set 15 hours later.
I tapped at the steel washer's edge to no avail, and finally hammered
it off. It came away with a surface layer of softwood.

I was more than impressed, not expecting such good metal/wood
bonding performance from a one part white resin glue.
It claims to be the strongest wood glue - and water resistant too,
but not for use below the water line.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

I think the ballots are in, and the majority of posts concur, it just
ain't good for boats..
Scotty

On 14 Oct 2003 02:19:04 GMT, (William R.
Watt) wrote:

Brian Whatcott ) writes:

It claims to be the strongest wood glue - and water resistant too,
but not for use below the water line.

shear strenth 3,750 psi. water resistent but not waterproof. pot life
indefinite. clean up with water before it sets.

shear strength of epoxy is 15,000n psi and its waterproof.

It happens I volunteered to reinforce the folding leg joints on some
church tables. To replace the two wood screws securing each saddle
on the legs, I used a metal insert with four woodscrews, and two studs
to hold each saddle. I was interested to glue the metal to the table's
underside too.
The strongest (advertized) tensile I could find in 2 part 24 hour
epoxy was 4500 psi. I usually find shear is a fraction of tensile for
the ordinary run of materials... Where did your data originate?

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

Well I had to learn the hard way "It says Titebond II is only good for 3
freeze thaw".
Further more, the temperature variation like near freezing at night to +
20-30C during the day will eventually cause ungluing.
I have also use LePage exterior glue with similar results.

"William R. Watt" wrote in message
...
Glenn Ashmore ) writes:

Everything else is epoxy. I use the West single lever pump and solicit
cups from all the neighbors. Large curd cottage cheese for fairing,
soft cream cheese for bonding and Jello pudding for detail. :-)

we have municipal recyling in Ottawa. we put our plastic containers in
platic bins and put them out for pickup on garbage day. so its a simple
matter of walking around the neigbourhood on garbage day looking in
people's plastic bins for plastic containers. I don't use epoxy but do
ocassionaly find need for discarded plastic containers.

Titebond is "aliphatic" glue, yellow carpenter's glue, not water
resistent. I don't know what Titebond II is but one of my home handyman
books says there is a water resistent variety of aliphatic glue available.
Maybe that's what Titebond II is.

The shear strength I posted earlier was for Titebond II from the Lee
Valley
Tools glue guide. It says Titebond II is only good for 3 freeze thaw
cycles so I wouldn't use it on boats up here in Canada.

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community
network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-freenet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

Brian Whatcott ) writes:
On 14 Oct 2003 02:19:04 GMT, (William R.
Watt) wrote:

Brian Whatcott ) writes:

It claims to be the strongest wood glue - and water resistant too,
but not for use below the water line.

shear strenth 3,750 psi. water resistent but not waterproof. pot life
indefinite. clean up with water before it sets.

shear strength of epoxy is 15,000n psi and its waterproof.


The strongest (advertized) tensile I could find in 2 part 24 hour
epoxy was 4500 psi. I usually find shear is a fraction of tensile for
the ordinary run of materials... Where did your data originate?

Lee Valley Tools adhesives guide. The testing was done on birch blocks.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-freenet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

William R. Watt ) writes:

Lee Valley Tools adhesives guide. The testing was done on birch blocks.

opps, my mistake. "Shear strengths are maple to maple blocks", not birch.

the epoxies tested are "G1", "G2", "Cold Cure", "205 West", and "206 West"
the West came out slightly lower at 14,000 psi.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William R Watt National Capital FreeNet Ottawa's free community network
homepage: www.ncf.ca/~ag384/top.htm
warning: non-freenet email must have "notspam" in subject or it's returned

On 14 Oct 2003 05:36:38 -0700, (Backyard
Renegade) wrote:

(William R. Watt) wrote in message ...
Brian Whatcott ) writes:

It claims to be the strongest wood glue - and water resistant too,
but not for use below the water line.

shear strenth 3,750 psi. water resistent but not waterproof. pot life
indefinite. clean up with water before it sets.

And if it gets wet, it turns to runny snot. The stuff is just not for
boats and if you call the manufacturer they will tip toe around the
subject... Knowing you should not use it, but hoping you will buy it
anyway.

Is it possible you are confusing Titebond with Titebond II? I've used
Titebond II on outdoor furniture without problems. I wanted to pull
apart a Titebond II joint and it finally came loose after I soaked it
in a bucket for two weeks. Regular yellow glue would not have been
that tenacious.

No, I do not use Titebond II for structural applications on boats.

- Rick Tyler
--
"Ignorant voracity -- a wingless vulture -- can soar only into the
depths of ignominy." Patrick O'Brian

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 01:24:54 GMT, "Denis Marier"
wrote:

I would like to add my two cents.
Last spring I used Luan to make hatch doors for my boat.
Biscuits were used and the panel boards were washed with acetone and glued
with Titebond ll and pipe clamps.
The doors were coated with Behr Tung oil finish fortified with UVI. Several
coat were applied inside my garage.
They were my pride and joy. Then in mid August the panels were showing
signs of separations. Part lines began to be very visible. I then replaced
the new hatch doors with the old one made with Teak plywood..
I do not know what happened. Maybe the Luan is not compatible with Titebond
ll.
Now that I learned my lesson I'll go back to using epoxy on my boat.

While I agree with your conclusion, I'm interested in the details of
your experience with Titebond II. Were your hatches cross-grain glued
at the ends? This will guarantee either failed joints or wood grain
splits. If it was a straight adhesive failure, that would be
interesting.

By the way, you could take the hatches, rip out the adhesive joints on
a table saw, and re-glue them with epoxy.

- Rick Tyler
--
"Ignorant voracity -- a wingless vulture -- can soar only into the
depths of ignominy." Patrick O'Brian

Two doors were made. Each measuring 16" high X 25" wide X +3/8" thick.
Each door were made with 4" wide X 25" long Luan board with the grain
running from left to right horizontally. Biscuits were used with Titebond
ll and pipe clamps. At the end of each door bread boards (grain running
vertically ) were glued with biscuits, Titebond ll and pipe clamps. Then,
after a few months, sanding was done and the finish was applied.
"Rick Tyler" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 01:24:54 GMT, "Denis Marier"
wrote:

I would like to add my two cents.
Last spring I used Luan to make hatch doors for my boat.
Biscuits were used and the panel boards were washed with acetone and
glued
with Titebond ll and pipe clamps.
The doors were coated with Behr Tung oil finish fortified with UVI.
Several
coat were applied inside my garage.
They were my pride and joy. Then in mid August the panels were showing
signs of separations. Part lines began to be very visible. I then
replaced
the new hatch doors with the old one made with Teak plywood..
I do not know what happened. Maybe the Luan is not compatible with
Titebond
ll.
Now that I learned my lesson I'll go back to using epoxy on my boat.

While I agree with your conclusion, I'm interested in the details of
your experience with Titebond II. Were your hatches cross-grain glued
at the ends? This will guarantee either failed joints or wood grain
splits. If it was a straight adhesive failure, that would be
interesting.

By the way, you could take the hatches, rip out the adhesive joints on
a table saw, and re-glue them with epoxy.

- Rick Tyler
--
"Ignorant voracity -- a wingless vulture -- can soar only into the
depths of ignominy." Patrick O'Brian

In the vague recesses of my mind I seem to recall Norm, of This Old
House, warning about over clamping Titebond II.

Ron