So, JL, are we to presume this is autobiographical, or just somebody
that you admire and would like to emulate?

jlrogers±³© wrote:

http://edu.sina.com.cn/en/2005-02-07/30576.html
Public schools are supposed to remove barriers so people can succeed.

No it isn't. It *used* to be that public schools were supposed to turn
out potential military officers, then later public schools were presumed
to give a good enough education for entry into low-level white collar
professions and/or college.

Nowadays, public schools are an alternative to juvenile detention
centers, where young people from the lower classes with no hope are
contained temporarily before releasing them into the unskilled labor
pool and/or a life of petty crime.


... For
some, the system does remove barriers and provide a solid base for
achievement. For others, the system replaces one set of barriers with
another. For example, creativity is killed by pressuring students to accept
the status quo, by establishing a fear to be different and a fear of
failure.

Or, if you are actually smart enough to learn on your own, you can
springboard into college and thence to some high paying profession,
where you can afford to carry out your dreams without blathering on and
on about imaginary restraints.

The author of the story would have done much better to focus on sailing
instead of his infantile social theories. It sounds like he did a ot of
pretty good sailing but it was left out of the tale.

DSK

"DSK" wrote

http://edu.sina.com.cn/en/2005-02-07/30576.html
Public schools are supposed to remove barriers so people can
succeed.

Nowadays, public schools are an alternative to juvenile detention
centers, where young people from the lower classes with no hope are
contained temporarily before releasing them into the unskilled labor
pool and/or a life of petty crime.

One can get a very good education from a public school if one applies
himself. Parents that care are a big help. It's there for the taking,
but you have to want it.

Scotty

a disgruntled DSK wrote
Nowadays, public schools are an alternative to juvenile detention
centers, where young people from the lower classes with no hope are
contained temporarily before releasing them into the unskilled labor
pool and/or a life of petty crime.


Scott Vernon wrote:
One can get a very good education from a public school if one applies
himself. Parents that care are a big help. It's there for the taking,
but you have to want it.

Agreed. Parents are a BIG part of the equation. And some schools are
better than others.

The fact remains that if one is trying to get into a good college, a
diploma from most public schools is a handicap no matter how good one's
grades. This is a big change from 20 years ago, and it certainly tilts
the playing field unfairly.

DSK

"DSK" wrote
Agreed. Parents are a BIG part of the equation. And some schools are
better than others.

The fact remains that if one is trying to get into a good college, a
diploma from most public schools is a handicap no matter how good
one's
grades. This is a big change from 20 years ago, and it certainly
tilts
the playing field unfairly.

Do you consider Penn State a good college?

SV

Scott Vernon wrote:
Do you consider Penn State a good college?


Yep

DSK

its not about the school's...its about the parent's.....

Reading your story only emphasizes how tragic the educational blunders of
G.W.Bush truly are. In America's vocational high schools, students much like
you were, kids who've made a career out of daydreaming instead of
participating in the classroom activities, are given a second chance to
learn in a way that is not at the bottom of Bloom's Taxonomy (rote).
Vocational teachers look beyond the corruption of a public school system
that would use it's technical annex as a dumping ground for the learning
disabled, the trouble makers, and in general, young malcontents.
We take what they consider to be trash, and we re-awaken them, challenge
them, polish them into productive, self-respecting gems. For many of our
students, the vo-tech allows them to get a high school diploma AND real
skills they can use. Our kids show their genius every day.
Consider one welding student I know. For his senior project he re-created a
few blocks of Manhattan around ground-zero. He fabricated all the buildings
using stainless steel, except for the twin towers, which he made using mild
steel. The entire piece sits under a spotlight in the school's front-yard.
As we watch the towers rust and disintegrate, we are reminded daily of the
tragedy of 911. People pull into our parking lot and stare contemplatively
at the project. It makes a person think. This kid took what he learned about
metals and welding techniques, and integrated that with what he felt in his
heart. The result is magnificent and deep. And to think, this kid wanted to
quit school because people like our president told him he was a failure
because he couldn't write a flowery essay to describe his ideas!
Thanks to the Bush's standardized testing policies, traditional high schools
are sending swarms of kids who perform poorly on these written tests to the
full curriculum vo-techs, so their poor test scores can cause the vo-techs
to get Bush's public spanking instead of the sending school. These tests
don't acknowledge the genius of the kid who is staring out the window and
germinating the seeds of a success that is not based on pedantic learning.
We have PhDs, engineers, nurses, and professionals from many walks of life
on staff, guiding these students and giving them new motivation to learn
fundamentals (show them why they need to know math and science). When kids
find a reason for abstract thinking, they work harder to learn those skills
as well.
And these are the schools that Bush wants to close. He calls our kids "shoe
makers" I believe. He is a fool! He has no clue what level of technology our
kids are achieving. From bio-technology to CNC programming, from masonry to
hvac to roofing, from engineering to advertising, our kids are blossoming
into productive citizenship! What they're not doing is repairing shoes, what
they are doing is building smart robots, producing detailed architectural
drawings, and programming emission systems to improve air quality and gas
mileage.
Go ahead Bush, close the schools that are helping our challenging but
nonetheless brilliant kids. Send the money to Iraq so they can have the
things you want to deny American kids!
The only thing that scares me more than this jerk-off's ideas about schools
is the fact that he now wants to apply the same "privatization" mentality to
social security. That's really what this is all about isn't it? Privatize
everything so business in America can do what it will with and to the
American people. Nothing personal, it's just business. That's why it's
important that Bush cause the collapse of public schools and then blame them
for it. If it all goes well, each family can find a way to pay for the
education of their kids. If they can't afford it, screw 'em. It's important
that social security be deemed a failure too; find a way to retire without
it all you civil servants!
In the end, the only thing Bush won't privatize will be the IRS.
Scout. Phew!


"jlrogers±³©" wrote
[snip]
First-We must have a dream that motivates us. No one has ever achieved
anything without a dream attached to a burning desire.

Second-We must learn how-to-learn. In school, we learn how to memorize or
be taught. Learning how to learn frees our dependency on others for
knowledge.

Third-We must learn from failure and learn how to bounce back from
failure. No one ever succeed without failure. In the classroom, failure is
a
no-no.

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:14:13 GMT, "Scout"
wrote this crap:

Reading your story only emphasizes how tragic the educational blunders of
G.W.Bush truly are. In America's vocational high schools, students much like
you were, kids who've made a career out of daydreaming instead of
[blah blah blah]


So it boils down to needing more schools for kids who will end up
being drywallers, gardeners, and burger flippers. At least we keep
them away from the real students.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

If Bush gets his way, yes.
Scout

"Horvath" wrote
So it boils down to needing more schools for kids who will end up
being drywallers, gardeners, and burger flippers. At least we keep
them away from the real students.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

If a teacher can't inspire the will to learn in their students..... they
have failed at their profession.
Damn it all... now I'm starting to consider that maybe my grade 9
education isn't sufficient.
Mind you it never seems to bother me when I'm directing an engineer on how
to his job.

CM


"Scout" wrote in message
...
Reading your story only emphasizes how tragic the educational blunders of
G.W.Bush truly are. In America's vocational high schools, students much
like you were, kids who've made a career out of daydreaming instead of
participating in the classroom activities, are given a second chance to
learn in a way that is not at the bottom of Bloom's Taxonomy (rote).
Vocational teachers look beyond the corruption of a public school system
that would use it's technical annex as a dumping ground for the learning
disabled, the trouble makers, and in general, young malcontents.
We take what they consider to be trash, and we re-awaken them, challenge
them, polish them into productive, self-respecting gems. For many of our
students, the vo-tech allows them to get a high school diploma AND real
skills they can use. Our kids show their genius every day.
Consider one welding student I know. For his senior project he re-created
a few blocks of Manhattan around ground-zero. He fabricated all the
buildings using stainless steel, except for the twin towers, which he made
using mild steel. The entire piece sits under a spotlight in the school's
front-yard. As we watch the towers rust and disintegrate, we are reminded
daily of the tragedy of 911. People pull into our parking lot and stare
contemplatively at the project. It makes a person think. This kid took
what he learned about metals and welding techniques, and integrated that
with what he felt in his heart. The result is magnificent and deep. And to
think, this kid wanted to quit school because people like our president
told him he was a failure because he couldn't write a flowery essay to
describe his ideas!
Thanks to the Bush's standardized testing policies, traditional high
schools are sending swarms of kids who perform poorly on these written
tests to the full curriculum vo-techs, so their poor test scores can cause
the vo-techs to get Bush's public spanking instead of the sending school.
These tests don't acknowledge the genius of the kid who is staring out the
window and germinating the seeds of a success that is not based on
pedantic learning.
We have PhDs, engineers, nurses, and professionals from many walks of life
on staff, guiding these students and giving them new motivation to learn
fundamentals (show them why they need to know math and science). When kids
find a reason for abstract thinking, they work harder to learn those
skills as well.
And these are the schools that Bush wants to close. He calls our kids
"shoe makers" I believe. He is a fool! He has no clue what level of
technology our kids are achieving. From bio-technology to CNC programming,
from masonry to hvac to roofing, from engineering to advertising, our kids
are blossoming into productive citizenship! What they're not doing is
repairing shoes, what they are doing is building smart robots, producing
detailed architectural drawings, and programming emission systems to
improve air quality and gas mileage.
Go ahead Bush, close the schools that are helping our challenging but
nonetheless brilliant kids. Send the money to Iraq so they can have the
things you want to deny American kids!
The only thing that scares me more than this jerk-off's ideas about
schools is the fact that he now wants to apply the same "privatization"
mentality to social security. That's really what this is all about isn't
it? Privatize everything so business in America can do what it will with
and to the American people. Nothing personal, it's just business. That's
why it's important that Bush cause the collapse of public schools and then
blame them for it. If it all goes well, each family can find a way to pay
for the education of their kids. If they can't afford it, screw 'em. It's
important that social security be deemed a failure too; find a way to
retire without it all you civil servants!
In the end, the only thing Bush won't privatize will be the IRS.
Scout. Phew!


"jlrogers±³©" wrote
[snip]
First-We must have a dream that motivates us. No one has ever achieved
anything without a dream attached to a burning desire.

Second-We must learn how-to-learn. In school, we learn how to memorize
or
be taught. Learning how to learn frees our dependency on others for
knowledge.

Third-We must learn from failure and learn how to bounce back from
failure. No one ever succeed without failure. In the classroom, failure
is a
no-no.