It's obvious, Jon. She's got the hots for you. In her own demented little
mind, she looks up to you and wants your attention. Just tell her you're gay
and that there's no chance for her.

Dr. Scott

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
No. This was her first time. I can do it in 15 minutes. Most of
the students can do it in 1/2 hour at their second try. I'm thinking
that the best approach is to get her in with other students. They
tend to help each other.

We do have two boats. The next class I teach will have four
in each.

Can't tip these without raising the centerboard. It's heavy
enough to sink if it goes over. We use the Holder 14 for
this, and she's already taken that class, so she got some
experience capsizing. That can't be it.

I'm going to keep trying. At least until her money runs out. :-)

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Joe" wrote in message
om...
"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Hey, here's an on-topic post.... sorry.

I had a student yesterday who just does not seem to get
it at all. She spent nearly 2 hours rigging a very simple
Holder 20. Literally, a main, a jib, and that's about it.
Most students take 30 minutes tops the first time out. It
seemed like everything was a struggle for her.

2 hours is a bit long... Has she rigged that boat before?

If so you need to pull another boat up next to her and challenge her
to a rigging race. Explain to her that you think it she has a problem
and you want to find out her weakness. A race is a good way to see
what she does not understand. Stop the race and address the issues as
they arise. You do have 2 boats right? If not do it with a stop watch.


I'm not sure how to proceed. When we finally got out on
the water, she did ok, but was very hesitant with almost
zero self-confidence, especially about gybing, even though
the wind was very light on the lake.

Why? is she afraid the boat will tip over. If so you need to go ahead
and filp it over. Better yet have her flip it over. Offer her a free
day if she can flip it on a light wind day without shifting ballast.




I hate to dissuade her completely from sailing, but I also
hate having her waste her money on lessons. She's had
two other instructors prior to me, and took the full basic
sailing class. Obviously, she's trying really hard... said
she wants some independence from her husband, her
own hobby, etc.

Then there is no question....if you are indeed and instructor you
keep teaching as long as she is willing to try.

I talked to one of the other instructors,
and he said basically the same thing... doesn't know
why she's having problems like this... didn't know what
to do.

Shouldent you address all these issues up front with her?
Perhaps hand her a report card, and teach her how to improve her
grades!


She's got the basic book, she can usually tie a bowline
the first time in about 5-10 seconds, but then she gets
totally stuck on a stopper knot (fig 8). I saw her take
3-4 minutes to do it right, even with me talking her
through it and showing her countless times.

Homework. Is that so important?

Has anyone had a student like this? What did you do?

I've had many, they were called Deckhands.

As long as they keep coming back saying thats what they want to do,
and they try hard, and dont give up you stick with em.

If they are totally lost and have no chance of ever making it no
matter what
...........you got to let em know.

They might beg for another chance then you have to set a standard and
tell them if they can not meet the standard they must leave.

How high you set your standards is up to you.

She sounds to me like she honestly wants to keep going at it and she
keeps trying. Thats good enough for me, as long as she is not a danger
to herself or anyone else.

Joe



10 NG pts for a workable solution.

Jonathan

How about if I tell her you're gay, but that you're accepting of
straight women. Do you think that'll work? I wouldn't want to
lie to her.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
It's obvious, Jon. She's got the hots for you. In her own demented little
mind, she looks up to you and wants your attention. Just tell her you're
gay
and that there's no chance for her.

Dr. Scott

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
No. This was her first time. I can do it in 15 minutes. Most of
the students can do it in 1/2 hour at their second try. I'm thinking
that the best approach is to get her in with other students. They
tend to help each other.

We do have two boats. The next class I teach will have four
in each.

Can't tip these without raising the centerboard. It's heavy
enough to sink if it goes over. We use the Holder 14 for
this, and she's already taken that class, so she got some
experience capsizing. That can't be it.

I'm going to keep trying. At least until her money runs out. :-)

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Joe" wrote in message
om...
"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Hey, here's an on-topic post.... sorry.

I had a student yesterday who just does not seem to get
it at all. She spent nearly 2 hours rigging a very simple
Holder 20. Literally, a main, a jib, and that's about it.
Most students take 30 minutes tops the first time out. It
seemed like everything was a struggle for her.

2 hours is a bit long... Has she rigged that boat before?

If so you need to pull another boat up next to her and challenge her
to a rigging race. Explain to her that you think it she has a problem
and you want to find out her weakness. A race is a good way to see
what she does not understand. Stop the race and address the issues as
they arise. You do have 2 boats right? If not do it with a stop watch.


I'm not sure how to proceed. When we finally got out on
the water, she did ok, but was very hesitant with almost
zero self-confidence, especially about gybing, even though
the wind was very light on the lake.

Why? is she afraid the boat will tip over. If so you need to go ahead
and filp it over. Better yet have her flip it over. Offer her a free
day if she can flip it on a light wind day without shifting ballast.




I hate to dissuade her completely from sailing, but I also
hate having her waste her money on lessons. She's had
two other instructors prior to me, and took the full basic
sailing class. Obviously, she's trying really hard... said
she wants some independence from her husband, her
own hobby, etc.

Then there is no question....if you are indeed and instructor you
keep teaching as long as she is willing to try.

I talked to one of the other instructors,
and he said basically the same thing... doesn't know
why she's having problems like this... didn't know what
to do.

Shouldent you address all these issues up front with her?
Perhaps hand her a report card, and teach her how to improve her
grades!


She's got the basic book, she can usually tie a bowline
the first time in about 5-10 seconds, but then she gets
totally stuck on a stopper knot (fig 8). I saw her take
3-4 minutes to do it right, even with me talking her
through it and showing her countless times.

Homework. Is that so important?

Has anyone had a student like this? What did you do?

I've had many, they were called Deckhands.

As long as they keep coming back saying thats what they want to do,
and they try hard, and dont give up you stick with em.

If they are totally lost and have no chance of ever making it no
matter what
...........you got to let em know.

They might beg for another chance then you have to set a standard and
tell them if they can not meet the standard they must leave.

How high you set your standards is up to you.

She sounds to me like she honestly wants to keep going at it and she
keeps trying. Thats good enough for me, as long as she is not a danger
to herself or anyone else.

Joe



10 NG pts for a workable solution.

Jonathan

Here's an update. I figured that part of her problem was getting
overwhelmed by having to deal with two sails. I've seen this
before, where students understand what they need to do to
tack or whatever, but because they've got both a main and
a jib, they tend to focus on one rather than the other. This is
really true on the first day or so, but after they get a bit more
comfortable, they seem to be able to deal with it.

So, I decided to have the class sail with just the main for the
first time out. It worked really well. They could tack without
stalling or going from close hauled to run. They got a good
feel for where the wind was and only had to trim the main
to sail efficiently. I found that even this particular student
seemed a lot less anxious about getting the boat moving.
The more advanced student seemed to do fine also, but
I suspect she'd like to see the jib up next time. I'm thinking
about having one boat with a jib and one without. Perhaps
having the weaker students take the one without, then
switching to the other after an hour or so. Then, I'll have
the more advanced students raise the jib after they switch,
and everyone will be equal again.

I liked a lot of the suggestions from you guys...thanks!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Hey, here's an on-topic post.... sorry.

I had a student yesterday who just does not seem to get
it at all. She spent nearly 2 hours rigging a very simple
Holder 20. Literally, a main, a jib, and that's about it.
Most students take 30 minutes tops the first time out. It
seemed like everything was a struggle for her.

I'm not sure how to proceed. When we finally got out on
the water, she did ok, but was very hesitant with almost
zero self-confidence, especially about gybing, even though
the wind was very light on the lake.

I hate to dissuade her completely from sailing, but I also
hate having her waste her money on lessons. She's had
two other instructors prior to me, and took the full basic
sailing class. Obviously, she's trying really hard... said
she wants some independence from her husband, her
own hobby, etc. I talked to one of the other instructors,
and he said basically the same thing... doesn't know
why she's having problems like this... didn't know what
to do.

She's got the basic book, she can usually tie a bowline
the first time in about 5-10 seconds, but then she gets
totally stuck on a stopper knot (fig 8). I saw her take
3-4 minutes to do it right, even with me talking her
through it and showing her countless times.

Has anyone had a student like this? What did you do?

10 NG pts for a workable solution.

Jonathan

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

This is a great thread. Here are a few things to consider when teaching:
1. It's all about patience.
2. You can't teach everyone the same amount in the same time frames (are you
listening Mr. Bush?).
3. If the student knows more at the end of the lesson than when they started
the lesson, the lesson was successful.
4. Some students need more lessons than others to meet the course
objectives.
5. A good student is a good student; gender is irrelevant.
6. You are both the teacher and the student; recognize that you can learn
from everyone.
7. It's all about patience.

Scout.
"profanity and obscenity entitle people who don't want unpleasant
information to close their ears and eyes to you."
Kurt Vonnegut


"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Hey, here's an on-topic post.... sorry.

I had a student yesterday who just does not seem to get
it at all. She spent nearly 2 hours rigging a very simple
Holder 20. Literally, a main, a jib, and that's about it.
Most students take 30 minutes tops the first time out. It
seemed like everything was a struggle for her.

I'm not sure how to proceed. When we finally got out on
the water, she did ok, but was very hesitant with almost
zero self-confidence, especially about gybing, even though
the wind was very light on the lake.

I hate to dissuade her completely from sailing, but I also
hate having her waste her money on lessons. She's had
two other instructors prior to me, and took the full basic
sailing class. Obviously, she's trying really hard... said
she wants some independence from her husband, her
own hobby, etc. I talked to one of the other instructors,
and he said basically the same thing... doesn't know
why she's having problems like this... didn't know what
to do.

She's got the basic book, she can usually tie a bowline
the first time in about 5-10 seconds, but then she gets
totally stuck on a stopper knot (fig 8). I saw her take
3-4 minutes to do it right, even with me talking her
through it and showing her countless times.

Has anyone had a student like this? What did you do?

10 NG pts for a workable solution.

Jonathan

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com