Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I wish we
had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they say
here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...
Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:
Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:

Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...

G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:

And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have

steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some

have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She

can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could

make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often

have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close

enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the

edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6

inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross

as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to

stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two

blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

My wife can't watch - she hasn't been to a haul or launch in years. When she has to be at
the marina she goes out of sight! I'm just the opposite - I can't bear the thought of
having it done without being there.


"katysails" wrote in message
...
Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

Don't you just hate seeing your boat suspended in midair .like that? When there's wind?
I always breathe a sigh of relief when mine hits the water or the trailer in safety.

--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:
Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I wish we
had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they say
here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...

Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:

Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
thlink.net...


G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have


steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some


have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She


can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could


make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often


have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close


enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the


edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6


inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross


as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to


stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two


blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

It isn't quite as low as it looks - the bottom paint goes about two inches over the
waterline. Also, it tapers down aft, so up forward the clearance is about 24 inches, and
aft it tapers to 14. This is one of the problems with smaller cats - very few under 35
feet have even a foot of clearance. The ones with high clearance (like the Victory) have
huge freeboard and windage.

Most of the time we don't notice any pounding, but in large, steep waves it can slap
really hard. And since the bottom is flat it can sound like being inside a bass drum.
The first time it happened I ran below and checked the bilges! After a while, you learn
that there are certain angles to the waves that make the problem worse, other angles make
the pounding go away totally. Frankly, our worst day of pounding was our first passage -
6 to 8 (with a few 10s) foot steep chop and a 25 knot following wind crossing Lake
Ontario. I thought we would never get used to the pounding. Now I hardly notice it,
because it doesn't affect performance that much. The snap rolling from beam seas is more
annoying, because most of the time the boat stays level, but if it catches a wave square
on the beam it suddenly lurches 15 degrees. The net affect of all this is that we usually
hand steer in rough going, because once you're used to it you can minimize the nasties
pretty well.


"The_navigator©" wrote in message
...
Wow that's a low flat bridge structure! What happens in waves!

Cheers MC

Jeff Morris wrote:

And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have daggerboards. Some
have
steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely spaced diesels.
Some
have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and widely space diesels.
She
can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People have told me they
could
make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've always failed. I
often
have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually rely on getting
close
enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the visibility around
the
edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a TravelLift the is about
6
inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up to about 15 knots
cross
as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This made it difficult
to
stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the gearing that forces to
two
blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

Both turn the same way, Counterclockwise, when viewed from the stern. I think. I
actually had a prop in my hand this afternoon to bring home, and decided that was silly!

But I do know for sure they both go the same way!

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
ink.net...
G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:
Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I
wish we
had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they
say
here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...

Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:

Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
thlink.net...


G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have


steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some


have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She


can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could


make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often


have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close


enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the


edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6


inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross


as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to


stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two


blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

LOL...whose decision was that? .... Oh well, not good, but part of the
answer ...prop walk is negated, when twisting. Still need to know
whether bow or stern lags, when trying to walk sideways.

Jeff Morris wrote:

Both turn the same way, Counterclockwise, when viewed from the stern. I think. I
actually had a prop in my hand this afternoon to bring home, and decided that was silly!

But I do know for sure they both go the same way!

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
ink.net...

G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:

Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I

wish we

had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they

say

here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
hlink.net...


Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:


Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:



Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
arthlink.net...



G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:



And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have



steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some



have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She



can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could



make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often



have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close



enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the



edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6



inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross



as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to



stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two



blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

Hey silly, Yanmars turn clockwise looking at them from the stern.

Unless you have a weird, v-drive tranny or something your props
turn clockwise.

S.Simon

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message ...
Both turn the same way, Counterclockwise, when viewed from the stern. I think. I
actually had a prop in my hand this afternoon to bring home, and decided that was silly!

But I do know for sure they both go the same way!

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
ink.net...
G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:
Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I
wish we
had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they
say
here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...

Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:

Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
thlink.net...


G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have


steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some


have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She


can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could


make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often


have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close


enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the


edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6


inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross


as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to


stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two


blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

2GM20FC with SD20 Saildrive, bottom of page:
http://www.yanmar.com.au/marine/Sail...sailseries.htm

Also, the props are shown on this page - search for 872880
http://www.penta.volvo.se/files/kapitel45-gb.pdf

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...

Hey silly, Yanmars turn clockwise looking at them from the stern.

Unless you have a weird, v-drive tranny or something your props
turn clockwise.

S.Simon

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Both turn the same way, Counterclockwise, when viewed from the stern. I think. I
actually had a prop in my hand this afternoon to bring home, and decided that was
silly!

But I do know for sure they both go the same way!

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
ink.net...
G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:
Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she
just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I
wish we
had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as
they
say
here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
nk.net...

Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:

Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
thlink.net...


G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:


And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have


steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some


have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She


can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could


make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often


have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close


enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the


edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6


inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross


as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to


stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two


blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

Doesn't matter a Hoot Owls Butt, which way the engines turn .....only
matters which way the props turn.

otn

Simple Simon wrote:
Hey silly, Yanmars turn clockwise looking at them from the stern.

Unless you have a weird, v-drive tranny or something your props
turn clockwise.

S.Simon

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message ...

Both turn the same way, Counterclockwise, when viewed from the stern. I think. I
actually had a prop in my hand this afternoon to bring home, and decided that was silly!

But I do know for sure they both go the same way!

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
hlink.net...

G May be wrong answer .... when looking from astern, both props turn
clockwise, when engines ahead? or does stbd turn one way and port, the
other? (may be part of the reason for no walk).

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:

Yes.

There're not counter-rotating.

As to what happens when I try to "walk" - I can't quite remember exactly - she just
jiggles forward or back but never really gets and loser to the dock! Of course, I

wish we

had this discussion yesterday, I could have tried it out this morning! But as they

say

here in Boston, "Wait till next season!"

"otnmbrd" wrote in message
thlink.net...


Dang it! That's twice I forgot to ask .....inboard or outboard turning
props?

otnmbrd wrote:


Walk set-up is correct (props control bow, rudders control stern). Don't
think your keel (from what I saw in the picture) is the problem.
Seemingly (but not) unimportant question .... which end lags behind ....
bow or stern? (in your example, hard right rudder, engines clutched,
only,[no throttle] for left twist) BTW, I'm hoping you say bow, lags
behind G.

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:



Oy! You had to ask! It isn't easy to remember with the controls in
front of me, but I
guess:

To walk to Port, Rudders to Starboard, Port Engine in Reverse,
Starboard Engine Forward.

The works with many twin screw boats, but I think mine has a keel that
too long - I wonder
if its too efficient at low speed? Also, although the rudders are
large, they are hung on
skegs and set back a bit from the screws, which are folding. I think
all these things add
up to minimal "walking."

-jeff



"otnmbrd" wrote in message
. earthlink.net...



G It varies a lot with all multi screw (except tractor tugs). From the
look at the picture, I would think she'd "walk" fairly well ( I'm
talking about sideways motion, not prop walk).
Just out of curiosity, when you set up to "walk" to stbd, how do you set
your engines and rudders? .... and which part has the problem keeping
up, bow or stern?

otn

Jeff Morris wrote:



And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have
daggerboards. Some


have



steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely
spaced diesels.


Some



have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and
widely space diesels.


She



can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People
have told me they


could



make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've
always failed. I


often



have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually
rely on getting


close



enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I
have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The
hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the
visibility around


the



edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a
TravelLift the is about


6



inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up
to about 15 knots


cross



as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble
staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This
made it difficult


to



stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was
complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the
gearing that forces to


two



blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg

Yes, I can imagine that. How does the structure stand up to pounding -is
it a cored bridge and/or do stringers and cross braces flex?

Cheers MC

Jeff Morris wrote:

It isn't quite as low as it looks - the bottom paint goes about two inches over the
waterline. Also, it tapers down aft, so up forward the clearance is about 24 inches, and
aft it tapers to 14. This is one of the problems with smaller cats - very few under 35
feet have even a foot of clearance. The ones with high clearance (like the Victory) have
huge freeboard and windage.

Most of the time we don't notice any pounding, but in large, steep waves it can slap
really hard. And since the bottom is flat it can sound like being inside a bass drum.
The first time it happened I ran below and checked the bilges! After a while, you learn
that there are certain angles to the waves that make the problem worse, other angles make
the pounding go away totally. Frankly, our worst day of pounding was our first passage -
6 to 8 (with a few 10s) foot steep chop and a 25 knot following wind crossing Lake
Ontario. I thought we would never get used to the pounding. Now I hardly notice it,
because it doesn't affect performance that much. The snap rolling from beam seas is more
annoying, because most of the time the boat stays level, but if it catches a wave square
on the beam it suddenly lurches 15 degrees. The net affect of all this is that we usually
hand steer in rough going, because once you're used to it you can minimize the nasties
pretty well.


"The_navigator©" wrote in message
...

Wow that's a low flat bridge structure! What happens in waves!

Cheers MC

Jeff Morris wrote:


And the answer is:

It varies a lot with the cat. Some have long keels, others have daggerboards. Some

have

steerable drives, some have a single outboard, some have a widely spaced diesels.

Some

have little windage, others a lot.

My boat has long keels, low windage on the bow (more aft), and widely space diesels.

She

can pivot in place very nicely but has little prop walk. People have told me they

could

make it go sideways, but when I've challenged them to try, they've always failed. I

often

have to dock on a face, which is actually often tough - I usually rely on getting

close

enough to snag a cleat, then springing in the rest of the way. If I have a few hands
around to help I can usually get the boat anywhere I want. The hands don't have to do
much of anything, but I find it difficult to singlehand because the visibility around

the

edges is limited.

This morning I had a special challenge - I had to back into a TravelLift the is about

6

inches wider than my beam. The wind started light, but picked up to about 15 knots

cross

as I was coming in. The real problem was that one prop had trouble staying open in
foreword - I had to do most of the work with just one engine. This made it difficult

to

stay lined up. I felt that I totally turkeyed it, but I was complimented by the Lift-
Meister and dockhand, and no damage was done. I found that the gearing that forces to

two

blades to open together had totally sheared off.

Here's a pic taken slightly later:
http://www.sv-loki.com/Img_1616a.jpg