Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message ...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the way from Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several hours before they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were dangerously off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied souly on GPS, but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

You're point is not valid for sailors. Only professional motor
boaters carry on in such a stupid fashion. Only sloppy captains
like Shen44 and Otnmbrd allow such a slovenly-run ship.

Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
action, shape, etc. Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

S.Simon




"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message ...
Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the way from Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several hours before they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were dangerously off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied souly on GPS, but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

Once again, you demonstrate very limited experience.

There are many locations where its not possible to avoid hazards just by looking at the
water. This may be possible in the Keys or Bahamas (up to a point) but not in New England
or the Chesapeake.

Most of the hard groundings I've witnessed could have been avoided if more attention had
be paid to the depth sounder. For example, Boston Harbor has only one non-obvious hazard
near the main channel, Lower Middle. You can't get close to it without going through 100
yards of shallow water, yet someone whacks it every week. The Irwin 30 I sailed for a
season hit it the next year at 6.5 knots in a GPS assisted incident. The rudder was
broken and the engine was knocked off its mounts.

Neal, if you want to call yourself a "real sailor" you'll have to come up to New England
to complete your education.



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
You're point is not valid for sailors. Only professional motor
boaters carry on in such a stupid fashion. Only sloppy captains
like Shen44 and Otnmbrd allow such a slovenly-run ship.

Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
action, shape, etc. Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

S.Simon




"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the way from
Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several hours before they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were dangerously off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied souly on GPS, but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

I was born in Somerville, Mass. I lived there until I was ten years
old - old enough to realize I never want to go back there again.

ANY water shallow enough to ground my boat will be evident
without a depth sounder. If nothing else all I have to do is watch
for wading birds.

S.Simon


"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message ...
Once again, you demonstrate very limited experience.

There are many locations where its not possible to avoid hazards just by looking at the
water. This may be possible in the Keys or Bahamas (up to a point) but not in New England
or the Chesapeake.

Most of the hard groundings I've witnessed could have been avoided if more attention had
be paid to the depth sounder. For example, Boston Harbor has only one non-obvious hazard
near the main channel, Lower Middle. You can't get close to it without going through 100
yards of shallow water, yet someone whacks it every week. The Irwin 30 I sailed for a
season hit it the next year at 6.5 knots in a GPS assisted incident. The rudder was
broken and the engine was knocked off its mounts.

Neal, if you want to call yourself a "real sailor" you'll have to come up to New England
to complete your education.



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
You're point is not valid for sailors. Only professional motor
boaters carry on in such a stupid fashion. Only sloppy captains
like Shen44 and Otnmbrd allow such a slovenly-run ship.

Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
action, shape, etc. Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

S.Simon




"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the way from
Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several hours before they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were dangerously off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied souly on GPS, but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

Wow! Neal grew up in Slummerville! That explains a lot.

Somerville is the ultimate working class 'burb. In Neal's day it was one of the most
densely populated cities in the country. It was 98% Catholic and covered entirely by
tightly packed three-deckers. Its become a bit gentrified of late, as it became an
inexpensive alternative to Cambridge.

I lived for many years on the Cambridge side of the line, and still visit often.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
I was born in Somerville, Mass. I lived there until I was ten years
old - old enough to realize I never want to go back there again.

ANY water shallow enough to ground my boat will be evident
without a depth sounder. If nothing else all I have to do is watch
for wading birds.

S.Simon


"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Once again, you demonstrate very limited experience.

There are many locations where its not possible to avoid hazards just by looking at
the
water. This may be possible in the Keys or Bahamas (up to a point) but not in New
England
or the Chesapeake.

Most of the hard groundings I've witnessed could have been avoided if more attention
had
be paid to the depth sounder. For example, Boston Harbor has only one non-obvious
hazard
near the main channel, Lower Middle. You can't get close to it without going through
100
yards of shallow water, yet someone whacks it every week. The Irwin 30 I sailed for a
season hit it the next year at 6.5 knots in a GPS assisted incident. The rudder was
broken and the engine was knocked off its mounts.

Neal, if you want to call yourself a "real sailor" you'll have to come up to New
England
to complete your education.



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
You're point is not valid for sailors. Only professional motor
boaters carry on in such a stupid fashion. Only sloppy captains
like Shen44 and Otnmbrd allow such a slovenly-run ship.

Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
action, shape, etc. Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

S.Simon




"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the way from
Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several hours before
they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were dangerously
off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied souly on GPS,
but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about 5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

On Saturday my depth guage started acting up, just as I was entering Still
Pond anchorage (the entrance is narrow, between 2 sand spits) , however, I
looked around, saw NO wading birds and proceeded to blast full speed ahead .

SV


"Simple Simon" wrote

ANY water shallow enough to ground my boat will be evident
without a depth sounder. If nothing else all I have to do is watch
for wading birds.

S.Simon

Or in the SF bay... mostly mud, some rocks, and a few crapola
hunters sitting on the bottom.

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Once again, you demonstrate very limited experience.

There are many locations where its not possible to avoid hazards just by
looking at the
water. This may be possible in the Keys or Bahamas (up to a point) but
not in New England
or the Chesapeake.

Most of the hard groundings I've witnessed could have been avoided if more
attention had
be paid to the depth sounder. For example, Boston Harbor has only one
non-obvious hazard
near the main channel, Lower Middle. You can't get close to it without
going through 100
yards of shallow water, yet someone whacks it every week. The Irwin 30 I
sailed for a
season hit it the next year at 6.5 knots in a GPS assisted incident. The
rudder was
broken and the engine was knocked off its mounts.

Neal, if you want to call yourself a "real sailor" you'll have to come up
to New England
to complete your education.



"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
You're point is not valid for sailors. Only professional motor
boaters carry on in such a stupid fashion. Only sloppy captains
like Shen44 and Otnmbrd allow such a slovenly-run ship.

Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
action, shape, etc. Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

S.Simon




"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message
...
Tell that to the crew of the Royal Majesty. They traveled most of the
way from
Bermuda to
Nantucket unaware that their GPS was not working. In the several
hours before they
grounded a glance at the depth sounder would have shown that they were
dangerously off
course.

Frankly I was appalled by this incident, since I have never relied
souly on GPS, but
always verify position with soundings or bearings.

http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/1997/mar9701.pdf


--
-jeff
"Constant Vigilance!" - Frances W. Wright


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...
And, good morning to you, sir!

With the advent of GPS and its accurate nature, plotting your
position on a chart is a more accurate method than using
depth readings and dead reckoning. It's that simple.

S.Simon


"Thom Stewart" wrote in message
...
Good Morning Simple,

Many of us SAILORS that sail among Whales use charts and depth
finders
to get a location of exactly where we are on the chart. This is an
accepted practest in DED piloting.

We finally got a nice cleaning rain last night and we have about
5mph
wind at the house here. Waiting for my dog to wake up. We'll
probabilly
spend the day out on the water. The Pilothouse will come into
play. Nice
and dry and warm.

OT

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
| Any cruising sailor worth his salt can look into and at the water
| and tell immediately if he is in shoal water by the color, wave
| action, shape, etc.

This type of ridiculous comment can only be attributed to a tropical
backwater daysailor with severely limited experience and absolutely no clue
as to sea states North or South of the tropics.



Depth sounders are simply not a vital instrument
| of navigation. I'd be willing to bet more boats go aground while
| the operator is looking at the instrument than when using visual
| clues of sea state, color of water, etc.

I never ran aground while operating without a sounder because I carried a
lead line and exercised extreme caution knowing the my limitations and those
of my vessel. Unknown harbour ... verify chart soundings, enter dead slow,
split the entries 50/50 or favour the steep topography by 60/40. Once you've
been in... you can sail back in under full press in a gale and really wow
the rubber neckers moored inside.

CM