On Aug 6, 11:35 pm, "John Weiss" wrote:
"Michael Daly" wrote...

I like the wave friendliness of the
Pintail but dislike it's stodginess for pace.

I don't know anything about production kayaks. What actual speeds are you
talking about? What are the "no sweat" and hull speeds of the 2 kayaks?

For reference, my Pygmy Coho goes 3 kt at a leisurely "all day" pace (no
wind, flat water), and the hull speed is right at 5.

I haven't done the calculation. One seems to take all day to get
somewhere, with the other you're there in short order. Impressions
count!

I also note that yesterday I went to the Seda homepage and noticed
that they're selling the boat with a slogan like "with speed comes
safety!" I doubt that the Pintail is sold like that at all. That kinda
relates to my hunch that I posted earlier. I kinda like being able to
do a modest hour+ hop before the weather changes.

Really, these boats represent two TOTALLY DIFFERENT approaches to
touring.

I think I'll go for the Pintail for this trip. I'll take my time and
enjoy how nicely the Pintail behaves with all the biggish swells I'm
likely to get.

Also, this is an
Expedition layup model---darn, must be 80# empty.

Probably around 60-65 lb, but I know what you mean.

If you got the time, build one at closer to 42#! :-)

No time, man!

I let other guys do the work then buy their cast-offs when they get
the itch to build something new! : ) The guy who used to have both
of these boats built the Seda-copy---he said it was only about 30 lbs
before he added the hatches, lines, fixtures---now it weighs lots
more. But even at 19 feet it's still not as heavy as the 17' Pintail
with all its fixtures/lines/pump. How did they get so much weight into
such a slim, low-volume "little" boat? (Compared to the Glider, the
Pintail with its fine ends seems SMALL.) I think my pal damaged the
Pintail bottom at one point, patched it, then ended up painting most
of the bottom with some weird white epoxy paint---maybe that also
added a buncha weight. But I'm a wimp---I really prefer my 25# kevlar
C1 for daily lake use. So easy to handle off the water! (When I go
bike touring I mail most everything home after the first couple days.
I'm getting better though---to avoid starting out with too much in
first place. Yet when I go by car for a weekend outing, dang, that rig
FILLS UP.)

Jeff Potter (of OutYourBackdoor.com) wrote:

I also note that yesterday I went to the Seda homepage and noticed
that they're selling the boat with a slogan like "with speed comes
safety!" I doubt that the Pintail is sold like that at all.

Naah, the Pintail would be something like "With handling comes safety."
You wouldn't use downhill skis on a slalom course, no matter how
"fast" they are.

BTW - I know a lot of kayakers who paddle a Pintail at the same speed
as many can paddle a Seda under touring conditions. I also know someone
who bought a Seda (forget which model) for "speed" and spent an
incredible amount of time getting back into the kayak after tipping
over. YMMV.

Mike