HK wrote:
Capt John wrote:
On Nov 3, 6:29 pm, HK wrote:
Just read that Albemarle was bought out by Brunswick. Another famous
line goes in the crapper. Cabo was sold last year. Sad to see the
independents disappearing, since they build the best boats.

I can't say I blame them, with the price of fuel, the future is very
cloudy. Powerboating was very much a middle class activity. Sure, the
really big boats are owned by the wealthy, but the vast majority of
boat owners are middle class. Crazy fuel prices are starting to push
the middle class out of boating.

If I owned a business that was very much dependant on middle class
incomes. And the business started to change, pushing the operating
cost of my product beyond that which my customer base can afford,
driving increasing numbers of those customers away. And someone came
along and offered me a good price for that business, I'd probably take
the money and run.

John


Oh, I don't *blame* Albemarle for selling out, but the likelihood is
that the product that emerges in the years to come will no longer be an
"Albemarle." It'll be the product of the MBAs and accountants, and
therefore the probability is, it will be crap, because that is what MBAs
and accountants produce.

Some decades ago, an ad and pr company I worked for had a client that,
at that time, was the largest and most successful FHA-VA mortgage banker
in the country. We liked the company and its management a lot, so much
so that the owner of the company and I (I was the chief account exec and
writer) bought some stock. It was traded O-T-C at the time, for about
$4.00 a share.

Lo and behold, a giant NY-based financial institution offer the founders
$35 a share for the stock. Too good an offer to turn down. We all cashed
in to the limits of our holdings, of course. I made a few bucks and was
happy to do so.

Well, the new owners simply didn't understand the market for the
acquisition and in a few years, it sold the company off to someone else,
after most of its value (which was mainly in good will and very
competent staff in about 20 U.S. markets). The company disappeared,
along with the service it had provided. The big institution's MBAs
turned the mortgage company into crap.

The family that started the mortgage company, the guys who cashed out,
stayed active in business. A large regional bank in our market was about
to be shut down by the FDIC, and the guys, over the course of ONE
weekend, put together enough cash to take over the bank with the FDIC's
blessing. Bank opened Monday with a new name and new management.
No MBAs involved.

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end sportfishing
boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going to become just
another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has retained
it's edge.

Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
HK wrote:
Capt John wrote:
On Nov 3, 6:29 pm, HK wrote:
Just read that Albemarle was bought out by Brunswick. Another famous
line goes in the crapper. Cabo was sold last year. Sad to see the
independents disappearing, since they build the best boats.

I can't say I blame them, with the price of fuel, the future is very
cloudy. Powerboating was very much a middle class activity. Sure, the
really big boats are owned by the wealthy, but the vast majority of
boat owners are middle class. Crazy fuel prices are starting to push
the middle class out of boating.

If I owned a business that was very much dependant on middle class
incomes. And the business started to change, pushing the operating
cost of my product beyond that which my customer base can afford,
driving increasing numbers of those customers away. And someone came
along and offered me a good price for that business, I'd probably take
the money and run.

John


Oh, I don't *blame* Albemarle for selling out, but the likelihood is
that the product that emerges in the years to come will no longer be
an "Albemarle." It'll be the product of the MBAs and accountants, and
therefore the probability is, it will be crap, because that is what
MBAs and accountants produce.

Some decades ago, an ad and pr company I worked for had a client that,
at that time, was the largest and most successful FHA-VA mortgage
banker in the country. We liked the company and its management a lot,
so much so that the owner of the company and I (I was the chief
account exec and writer) bought some stock. It was traded O-T-C at the
time, for about $4.00 a share.

Lo and behold, a giant NY-based financial institution offer the
founders $35 a share for the stock. Too good an offer to turn down. We
all cashed in to the limits of our holdings, of course. I made a few
bucks and was happy to do so.

Well, the new owners simply didn't understand the market for the
acquisition and in a few years, it sold the company off to someone
else, after most of its value (which was mainly in good will and very
competent staff in about 20 U.S. markets). The company disappeared,
along with the service it had provided. The big institution's MBAs
turned the mortgage company into crap.

The family that started the mortgage company, the guys who cashed out,
stayed active in business. A large regional bank in our market was
about to be shut down by the FDIC, and the guys, over the course of
ONE weekend, put together enough cash to take over the bank with the
FDIC's blessing. Bank opened Monday with a new name and new management.
No MBAs involved.

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end sportfishing
boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going to become just
another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has retained
it's edge.



There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size category.
If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean "battlewagon,"
though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina builders.

There are some builders in the Maritime Provinces of Canada who build
some really serious fishing boats.

HK wrote:

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end sportfishing
boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going to become just
another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has
retained it's edge.



There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size category.
If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean "battlewagon,"
though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina builders.

There are some builders in the Maritime Provinces of Canada who build
some really serious fishing boats.

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different size
sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show? The
reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive than
similar boats using an existing mold and design.

Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
HK wrote:

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end sportfishing
boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going to become
just another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has
retained it's edge.



There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size
category. If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean
"battlewagon," though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina builders.

There are some builders in the Maritime Provinces of Canada who build
some really serious fishing boats.

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different size
sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show? The
reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive than
similar boats using an existing mold and design.


In the larger sizes, most of the boats are pretty much custom even if an
existing mold is used or stretched or modified. And not all the boats
come out of molds.


There's a relatively new builder of larger custom glass boats...Mirage
something or other. Forty to 60 footers, with Bertram-like hulls in
their lineage. Lots of custom features, very nice. There's a fellow on a
boat discussion board who is having one built for him, and he's posted a
zillion good photos. I'd have to say they are the best looking (from
photos, anyway) glass battlewagons I have seen lately.

Most of the custom builders will have a lineup at the Miami show. Their
customers are glad to help them, so you'll see several owner boats
included at the show.

If you are a serious fisherman, you cannot evaluate a boat by seeing its
photos or specs on line. Even on a bitty boat like my new Parker,
showroom visits alone were not enough, at least not for me. I got the
dealer to arrange a "demo" with a customer who bought the identical hull
and engine combo a year earlier, and from that demo I concluded I did
not want the forward vee-seating he opted for. Fortunately, Parker is a
manufacturer who, within reason, will semi-custom its stock boats to
some degree.

HK wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
HK wrote:

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end
sportfishing boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going
to become just another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has
retained it's edge.



There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size
category. If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean
"battlewagon," though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina
builders.

There are some builders in the Maritime Provinces of Canada who build
some really serious fishing boats.

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different
size sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show?
The reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive
than similar boats using an existing mold and design.


In the larger sizes, most of the boats are pretty much custom even if an
existing mold is used or stretched or modified. And not all the boats
come out of molds.


There's a relatively new builder of larger custom glass boats...Mirage
something or other. Forty to 60 footers, with Bertram-like hulls in
their lineage. Lots of custom features, very nice. There's a fellow on a
boat discussion board who is having one built for him, and he's posted a
zillion good photos. I'd have to say they are the best looking (from
photos, anyway) glass battlewagons I have seen lately.

Most of the custom builders will have a lineup at the Miami show. Their
customers are glad to help them, so you'll see several owner boats
included at the show.

If you are a serious fisherman, you cannot evaluate a boat by seeing its
photos or specs on line. Even on a bitty boat like my new Parker,
showroom visits alone were not enough, at least not for me. I got the
dealer to arrange a "demo" with a customer who bought the identical hull
and engine combo a year earlier, and from that demo I concluded I did
not want the forward vee-seating he opted for. Fortunately, Parker is a
manufacturer who, within reason, will semi-custom its stock boats to
some degree.




I have always purchased a boat from a dealer who had the boats already
in the water for a demo or they could easily get them to the water for a
test ride. I thought it was normal for a test ride until I heard Chuck
and others talking about not having a test ride until your signature was
on the contract. I never asked for a test ride, unless I was seriously
considering the boat, but whenever i asked it for a demo, was never a
big deal.

Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
HK wrote:
Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
HK wrote:

Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end
sportfishing boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is
going to become just another nameplate.

Sad to see, whatever the reasons.



Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has
retained it's edge.



There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size
category. If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean
"battlewagon," though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina
builders.

There are some builders in the Maritime Provinces of Canada who
build some really serious fishing boats.

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different
size sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show?
The reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive
than similar boats using an existing mold and design.


In the larger sizes, most of the boats are pretty much custom even if
an existing mold is used or stretched or modified. And not all the
boats come out of molds.


There's a relatively new builder of larger custom glass boats...Mirage
something or other. Forty to 60 footers, with Bertram-like hulls in
their lineage. Lots of custom features, very nice. There's a fellow on
a boat discussion board who is having one built for him, and he's
posted a zillion good photos. I'd have to say they are the best
looking (from photos, anyway) glass battlewagons I have seen lately.

Most of the custom builders will have a lineup at the Miami show.
Their customers are glad to help them, so you'll see several owner
boats included at the show.

If you are a serious fisherman, you cannot evaluate a boat by seeing
its photos or specs on line. Even on a bitty boat like my new Parker,
showroom visits alone were not enough, at least not for me. I got the
dealer to arrange a "demo" with a customer who bought the identical
hull and engine combo a year earlier, and from that demo I concluded I
did not want the forward vee-seating he opted for. Fortunately, Parker
is a manufacturer who, within reason, will semi-custom its stock boats
to some degree.




I have always purchased a boat from a dealer who had the boats already
in the water for a demo or they could easily get them to the water for a
test ride. I thought it was normal for a test ride until I heard Chuck
and others talking about not having a test ride until your signature was
on the contract. I never asked for a test ride, unless I was seriously
considering the boat, but whenever i asked it for a demo, was never a
big deal.



Well, it may be a problem on "broker" boats, but I've never had a
problem arranging a demo on a new boat. Even with the one I just boat,
the dealer did not have one in stock, but made a call and arranged a
ride with an owner. Even better, because the boat was a season old and I
could see how it was doing.

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 13:45:29 -0500, "Reginald P. Smithers III"
wrote:

I have always purchased a boat from a dealer who had the boats already
in the water for a demo or they could easily get them to the water for a
test ride. I thought it was normal for a test ride until I heard Chuck
and others talking about not having a test ride until your signature was
on the contract.

The dealers would like it that way of course but if they are hungry
for business will be glad to take you out for a quick spin as long as
they think you're a good prospect. It's important to look and act the
part if you want attention from a dealer. They have no interest in
wasting time on tire kickers or joy riders so they develop skill at
screening customers, just like the real estate folks.

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 13:18:44 -0500, "Reginald P. Smithers III"
wrote:

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different size
sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show? The
reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive than
similar boats using an existing mold and design.

You generally start out by hiring a naval architect/designer. After
they come up with a design you like, they will typically help you find
a builder. It's a bit like contracting for a custom house.

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 17:19:24 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 13:18:44 -0500, "Reginald P. Smithers III"
wrote:

Are these custom boats or do they have a model line up of different size
sportfishing boats that one can see online or at a boat show? The
reason I ask is I normally think custom boats are more expensive than
similar boats using an existing mold and design.

You generally start out by hiring a naval architect/designer. After
they come up with a design you like, they will typically help you find
a builder. It's a bit like contracting for a custom house.

I was just reading an article about this - can't remember where.

It involved a custom builder in LA. What was interesting is that
these boats are spec'd out and almost always sold to another party
other than the original client even before they are built.

Apparently for more money than the boats originally cost.

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 13:01:33 -0500, HK wrote:

There are top-end sportfishing boats in just about every size category.
If I were in the market for a large Atlantic Ocean "battlewagon,"
though, I'd be visiting the independent Carolina builders.

You bet. There are a number of very high quality custom sportfish
being built just a few miles south of us in Wanchese, NC. These guys
have a lot of experience and build a top notch product at a very high
end price. You'd never suspect it just driving down the road looking
at the nondescript building sheds.