Thinking about buying this bouat with the 5 litre moter..Any pros or
cons.This will be my first boat and not looking for the bayliner
bashers.I can live with some of the small problems as most new boats
experience these.Just looking for some pros and cons from you wise
people.
Thank you

On Aug 8, 6:49?am, wrote:
Thinking about buying this bouat with the 5 litre moter..Any pros or
cons.This will be my first boat and not looking for the bayliner
bashers.I can live with some of the small problems as most new boats
experience these.Just looking for some pros and cons from you wise
people.
Thank you

You might check www.baylinerownersclub.org for some comments from
folks who actually own one of these.

It might be a pretty good boat, or not, for your intended uses. How
and where you will be using it has as much or more to do with
suitability than do original build specs or design. Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.

On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.

Agreed.

The problem is trying to figure what normal and appropriate is for any
given boat.

The manufacturers and sales people are certainly not going to help you
out, nor will the boating magazines who have never met a boat they
didn't like.

Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.

Above all, do not overload the boat, learn how to navigate, and learn
proper boat operation and safety. Way too many people think that if
they can operate a car that they can also operate a boat. Nothing
could be further from the truth. Your local coast guard auxiliary and
power squadron organizations offer courses everywhere at little or no
charge. You owe it to the safety of your friends and family to take
one of these courses before operating any boat.

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.


Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.


What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed to
operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although not
recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.

One of the most respected boat surveyors in the Lake Erie western basin area
recommends Bayliners knowing the intended use is on Lake Erie. He knows
value for the $, especially when comparing them to comparable sized Sea Rays
(also built by Brunswick).

Folks like you are the reason Bayliner continues to carry the well deserved
bad reputation on their 1980's models.

Give it up and stick to opinions on your 50 foot, 8 mph trawler.

"JimH" ask wrote in message
...

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.


Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.


What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed
to operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although
not recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.

One of the most respected boat surveyors in the Lake Erie western basin
area recommends Bayliners knowing the intended use is on Lake Erie. He
knows value for the $, especially when comparing them to comparable sized
Sea Rays (also built by Brunswick).

Folks like you are the reason Bayliner continues to carry the well
deserved bad reputation on their 1980's models.

Give it up and stick to opinions on your 50 foot, 8 mph trawler.



I doubt like heck that you are running in 3-5' seas in the Great Lakes.
Those are very nasty size seas. Most bigger sport boats will not run in
those seas. I run in 8' swells max, and those are higher than the boat by a
lot! And those 8' swells only when they are long period and not accompanied
by 2-3' wind waves. I hear these quotes of 5' seas in protected waters by a
lot of boaters here. Find out how a sea wave is measured. That said,
Bayliners in the 21' Trophy types do quite well in moderate seas, but they
will break before higher quality boats will, so try to avoid the bigger
seas. Just not as strong a boat as less glass. Most 21' open bow are just
not built for big waves. If one breaks over the front, the nose of the boat
fills and you may sink in a short time.

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 19:48:50 -0700, "Calif Bill"
wrote:

I doubt like heck that you are running in 3-5' seas in the Great Lakes.
Those are very nasty size seas.

Absolutely right.

I have no doubt that Lake Erie can generate 3 to 5 foot seas but I
don't think there are too many people running through them in a 21
footer unless they have to, and certainly not on plane enjoying the
day.

"Calif Bill" wrote in message
...

"JimH" ask wrote in message
...

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.


Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.


What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed
to operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although
not recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.

One of the most respected boat surveyors in the Lake Erie western basin
area recommends Bayliners knowing the intended use is on Lake Erie. He
knows value for the $, especially when comparing them to comparable sized
Sea Rays (also built by Brunswick).

Folks like you are the reason Bayliner continues to carry the well
deserved bad reputation on their 1980's models.

Give it up and stick to opinions on your 50 foot, 8 mph trawler.



I doubt like heck that you are running in 3-5' seas in the Great Lakes.

Not planned, but caught in. Lake Erie can turn from flat to nasty in a
heart beat.

Waynes comments were the ridiculous ones, not mine.

On Wed, 8 Aug 2007 21:48:33 -0400, "JimH" ask wrote:

What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed to
operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although not
recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.

One of the most respected boat surveyors in the Lake Erie western basin area
recommends Bayliners knowing the intended use is on Lake Erie. He knows
value for the $, especially when comparing them to comparable sized Sea Rays
(also built by Brunswick).

Folks like you are the reason Bayliner continues to carry the well deserved
bad reputation on their 1980's models.

Give it up and stick to opinions on your 50 foot, 8 mph trawler.

You're entitled to your opinion of course but I disagree. Running a
21 footer in 3 to 5 footers is survival not boating. I've done it and
I've survived it, but it is not what you'd call a pleasant day on the
water.

Please note that no where in my reply did I mention the Bayliner brand
name, or imply it. My opinion applies to all 21 footers. They are
simply too small for anything but protected water, assuming that you'd
like to run on plane and not negotiate every wave. I've run a 12 foot
inflatable on Lake Michigan, Lake Ontario, Gulf of Mexico and the open
ocean but it's not exactly what you'd recommend for someone elses wife
and kids.

Please also note that in recent years I've owned a 24 ft I/O cuddy, a
33 ft sportfish, and at present a Searay 270 in addition to the
trawler. That's a fairly wide spectrum of experience over a wide
range of conditions. Other than the trawler, the only one of those
boats at home in 3 to 5 foot seas is the sportfish.

"JimH" ask wrote in message
...

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.


Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.


What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed
to operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although
not recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.



I think there's a lot more to consider than just the "size" of waves. Sea
state varies dependent on many factors including period, chop, swells,
fetch, confused ..... etc.
3-5 "footers" in an easy, rolling swell is one thing. 3-5 in a confused,
breaking, close chop is quite another and can challenge boat stability and
the operator's piloting skills when operating much larger boats.

It's also been my experience over the years that the "size" of waves ...
particularly when the seas are a bit rough .... are usually exaggerated by
casual boaters. Those "3-5" footers are often more like 2-3 footers at
most. Navigating confused "3-5's" in a light, 21 foot boat is an
experience one will soon not forget.

Eisboch

Eisboch wrote:
"JimH" ask wrote in message
...
"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 08:53:09 -0700, Chuck Gould
wrote:

Most boats will
stand up to normal and *appropriate* use fairly well.
Virtually all 21 foot boats however, especially Bayliners, are
designed for use in protected water, typically with waves and chop
less than 1 foot high, winds less than 12 kts.

What a bunch of total BS.

I have owned 3 boats at 21 feet and under that stood up well when needed
to operate in moderate seas on Lake Erie, including 3-5 footers (although
not recommended). My 20 foot Glastron can take on 2-4 foot seas.



I think there's a lot more to consider than just the "size" of waves. Sea
state varies dependent on many factors including period, chop, swells,
fetch, confused ..... etc.
3-5 "footers" in an easy, rolling swell is one thing. 3-5 in a confused,
breaking, close chop is quite another and can challenge boat stability and
the operator's piloting skills when operating much larger boats.

It's also been my experience over the years that the "size" of waves ...
particularly when the seas are a bit rough .... are usually exaggerated by
casual boaters. Those "3-5" footers are often more like 2-3 footers at
most. Navigating confused "3-5's" in a light, 21 foot boat is an
experience one will soon not forget.

Eisboch




Two seasons ago, coming out of the Patuxent River in Yo Ho, a 25-footer
with a huge bow. built like a battleship, and heavy as one, I ran into
five footers on the Bay. Real five footers, close and breaking. After 15
minutes of attempting to slog north for my home port, I made a wise
captain's decision, turned around, and headed back for the Pax River.