On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 15:00:00 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

Don't you just love bureaucrats?

To understand the reasoning you have to remember that it's all about
control.

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 13:37:38 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
wrote:

"Short Wave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
One of my good friends just retired from the Merchant Marine after
twenty years as Captain of various tanker and super tanker vessels.

Since he retired, he purchased a boat (50 foot Hatteras convertible)
and went to see the DEP about getting the required Boating Operation
Certificate. He took all his Master's documents down to DEP HQ in
Lyme, CT and was refused - he has to take a boating course.

So I looked it up. As silly as this is, here is the official
statement on previous experience.

13 - I have a valid Coast Guard Operating License. Do I need the Safe
Boating Certificate to operate my boat?

If you have a current master, mate, or pilot license issued through
the Coast Guard, you do not need the Connecticut Safe Boating
Certificate to operate your boat. You must keep the valid license with
you at all times. You cannot use the valid Coast Guard License to
obtain your Connecticut Safe Boating Certificate. You would have to
take a boating course or provide us with proof that you have taken an
approved boating course to obtain a safe boating certificate.

Now I ask you - does that seem even reasonable? He doesn't want to
keep his documents with him at all times - not when a small, wallet
sized card is available from the state.

Freakin' unbelivable.


Dear Governor Rell:
You are cordially invited to the next monthly meeting of the Deep Mud
Sportsman's Club. Each year, we choose a state law that we know to be
absurd, and pick a high ranking official to be lampooned in the press, many
members of which will be present at this gala event. We'll be discussing the
plight of a guy who, for the past 20 years has piloted ships half the size
of Fishers Island, but has to take a silly test to operate a 10 foot sailing
dinghy. Perhaps you'd like to attend! Bring a dish to pass. Dress is casual.
Please RSVP....
Billy Bob Stickbait
Event Coordinulator
203-555-CHUM


LOL!
--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H

To me, though, a 50 ft. Hattie may as well be a "Tanker"


Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 27 Mar 2007 19:23:35 -0700, "Tim" wrote:

On Mar 27, 7:13 pm, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On 27 Mar 2007 16:47:01 -0700, "mjpierce5" wrote:





On Mar 27, 7:42 pm, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Tue, 27 Mar 2007 23:17:05 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

One of my good friends just retired from the Merchant Marine after
twenty years as Captain of various tanker and super tanker vessels.

Since he retired, he purchased a boat (50 foot Hatteras convertible)
and went to see the DEP about getting the required Boating Operation
Certificate. He took all his Master's documents down to DEP HQ in
Lyme, CT and was refused - he has to take a boating course.

So I looked it up. As silly as this is, here is the official
statement on previous experience.

13 - I have a valid Coast Guard Operating License. Do I need the Safe
Boating Certificate to operate my boat?

If you have a current master, mate, or pilot license issued through
the Coast Guard, you do not need the Connecticut Safe Boating
Certificate to operate your boat. You must keep the valid license with
you at all times. You cannot use the valid Coast Guard License to
obtain your Connecticut Safe Boating Certificate. You would have to
take a boating course or provide us with proof that you have taken an
approved boating course to obtain a safe boating certificate.

Now I ask you - does that seem even reasonable? He doesn't want to
keep his documents with him at all times - not when a small, wallet
sized card is available from the state.

Freakin' unbelivable.

They also offer experienced boaters the opportunity to just take the test
without the course. Big deal. He should just do what's required and stop whining
like a spoiled baby. Not everything in life is fair or makes sense. Save the
tears for something worth getting excited about. Does he have inoperable
cancer?

Jeez!

CWM

Sounds like the State of CT wants its various assorted fees for taking
the test, issuing the documents, etc...
It also sounds like he could be teaching the course.

Michael

Big deal. Stop crying and do what you have to do. This is not worth whining
about. If you can't deal with this minor thing, then you probably are NOT
equipped to handle a boat safely.

CWM- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Charlie, I really don't think there's "crying" going on, but rather
laughing at the irony of the whole scenerio.

Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
probably fit in the tankers galley.

He might find that little course beneficial. After so many years of piloting
huge tankers, he might appreciate seeing things from a new perspective. He won't
be in a huge tanker any longer, and some things may be a bit different.

CWM

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 15:00:00 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On 27 Mar 2007 19:23:35 -0700, "Tim" wrote:

Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
probably fit in the tankers galley.

Interesting morning.

Let's just say that the reasoning is...well, arcane.

Plus it seems that while he's qualified to teach the class or a
USPS/USCG class without additional qualifications, he still need to
have taken either course or the State 8 hour course to qualify for the
certificate.

Addendum:

CT now offers a special endorsement to the Operater's Certificate
denoting that you can actually navigate with paper charts and such.
Minor thing actually, but I was curious if I qualified based on my
Master's License.

Turns out I don't - I have to take the course that I taught for three
years as a state instructor to qualify for the certificate or take the
USPS/USCG navigation course which is about three levels below my
qualifications.

Put another way, I can teach the course, but I don't qualify for the
certificate sticker unless I take the course and pass.

Don't you just love bureaucrats?

Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.
--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H

Do people that administer a drug/urine test, have to take one too?


Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On 27 Mar 2007 19:23:35 -0700, "Tim" wrote:

Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
probably fit in the tankers galley.

Interesting morning.

Let's just say that the reasoning is...well, arcane.

Plus it seems that while he's qualified to teach the class or a
USPS/USCG class without additional qualifications, he still need to
have taken either course or the State 8 hour course to qualify for the
certificate.

Addendum:

CT now offers a special endorsement to the Operater's Certificate
denoting that you can actually navigate with paper charts and such.
Minor thing actually, but I was curious if I qualified based on my
Master's License.

Turns out I don't - I have to take the course that I taught for three
years as a state instructor to qualify for the certificate or take the
USPS/USCG navigation course which is about three levels below my
qualifications.

Put another way, I can teach the course, but I don't qualify for the
certificate sticker unless I take the course and pass.

Don't you just love bureaucrats?

On Mar 27, 4:17�pm, Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
One of my good friends just retired from the Merchant Marine after
twenty years as Captain of various tanker and super tanker vessels.

Since he retired, he purchased a boat (50 foot Hatteras convertible)
and went to see the DEP about getting the required Boating Operation
Certificate. *He took all his Master's documents down to DEP HQ in
Lyme, CT and was refused - he has to take a boating course.

So I looked it up. *As silly as this is, here is the official
statement on previous experience.

13 - I have a valid Coast Guard Operating License. *Do I need the Safe
Boating Certificate to operate my boat?

If you have a current master, mate, or pilot license issued through
the Coast Guard, you do not need the Connecticut Safe Boating
Certificate to operate your boat. You must keep the valid license with
you at all times. You cannot use the valid Coast Guard License to
obtain your Connecticut Safe Boating Certificate. You would have to
take a boating course or provide us with proof that you have taken an
approved boating course to obtain a safe boating certificate.

Now I ask you - does that seem even reasonable? *He doesn't want to
keep his documents with him at all times - not when a small, wallet
sized card is available from the state.

Freakin' unbelivable.

The CT law gives him a choice: He can carry his mater's certificate
with him or sit the exam and carry a card. He's exempt from carrying a
card as long as he carries his certificate. Sounds like the choice he
wants to make is "neither".

The law recognizes that as a master mariner he needn't demonstrate his
basic competency to operate a boat. Fine. But here's the problem;
suppose he gets stopped for inspection?

"Trust me officer, I really am a licensed master, unlimited tonnage,
and I don't need to carry a state card. Prove it? Why should I have to
prove it? Shouldn't my word be sufficient?"

What about the 200 other guys who use the same line, but are simply
BS'n?
The enforcement officer won't really know who's on the level.

Earning the merchant document exempts him from complying with the law
requiring him to take the test, but only if he carries the document
instead of a card.

Doesn't seem entirely unreasonable to me.

"John H." wrote in message
...

Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.
--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H


Yeah but...when did you get that instructor's card... 1948 ??

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 11:32:28 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
.. .

Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.


MA has a pretty good rule regarding new motorcycle license applicants. If
you successfully complete an approved course of instruction the registry
waives the requirements of a formal road test and issues the motorcycle
endorsement. My son did this a couple of years ago and although I've had a
motorcycle endorsement for many years (obtained the old fashioned way), I
decided to take the course with him, just for the fun of it. It was very
worthwhile and I'd recommend it to even the most seasoned of riders.

Eisboch


I'd recommend the MSF course to anyone who hasn't taken it. I took it with
my wife after many years of riding, and it *was* worthwhile.

Virginia DMV had a rep there for the last day, and he issued the motorcycle
endorsement to all the students who completed the course.
--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H

On Mar 28, 12:14 pm, "Tim" wrote:
Do people that administer a drug/urine test, have to take one too?



Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On 27 Mar 2007 19:23:35 -0700, "Tim" wrote:

Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
probably fit in the tankers galley.

Interesting morning.

Let's just say that the reasoning is...well, arcane.

Plus it seems that while he's qualified to teach the class or a
USPS/USCG class without additional qualifications, he still need to
have taken either course or the State 8 hour course to qualify for the
certificate.

Addendum:

CT now offers a special endorsement to the Operater's Certificate
denoting that you can actually navigate with paper charts and such.
Minor thing actually, but I was curious if I qualified based on my
Master's License.

Turns out I don't - I have to take the course that I taught for three
years as a state instructor to qualify for the certificate or take the
USPS/USCG navigation course which is about three levels below my
qualifications.

Put another way, I can teach the course, but I don't qualify for the
certificate sticker unless I take the course and pass.

Don't you just love bureaucrats?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

If they are going to do the task that is being tested for, then I'd
presume yes.

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 17:10:35 GMT, "Don White"
wrote:


"John H." wrote in message
.. .

Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.
--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H


Yeah but...when did you get that instructor's card... 1948 ??


1991, why?

BTW, not all Canadians share your unwillingness to read.

http://www.canadianvalues.ca/commentary.aspx?aid=288


--
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****

John H