IN OTHERWORDS, NO ONE WHO HAS ANSWERED SO FAR KNOWS FORE SURE!

They are just guessing. Any body out there know the answer? I don't.
Larry Hill



I know people who own and operate boats over 60-feet who do not hold master's
licenses. I know of a guy who bought a 105 foot ex Navy Yard tug, no license.

As for making a blanket statement about
what-all "every insurance company" is going to require........that would be
impossible.

Ever insurance compnay is going to assess risk before underwriting a policy.
Part of that risk includes the previous experience of the insured. If Joe Blow
has operated a 52-foot motoryacht for the last ten years without incident and
he wants to step up to a 65-footer, there won't be all that serious a challenge
in getting him a policy somewhere. (May take some shopping).

If Joe Blow's experience has been running
an outboard-powered trailer boat....let's hope that nobody will insure him to
take command of that same 65-footer.

I know that to get a Coast Guard Master's license you
first have to show two years experience on the size (tonnage) of boat your
getting the license for.
Paul

Two years of pleasure boat ownership
isn't going to qualify you to sit for the exam unless you are *underway*, (not
at the dock), for eight hours or more for 360 of those 730 days. The CG has the
option to
reduce the hours requirement from 8-hours to 4-hours, and some districts do
almost routinely.

In actual practice, a very high percentage of people who apply for a six-pack
license based solely on pleasure boat ownership have lied about qualifying sea
service on the application form. There ought to be a check mark for "wink" and
"nod" at the bottom of the form.

Subject: Captain's License
From: "Paul Schilter" paulschilter@comcast,dot,net
Date: 07/22/2004 02:28 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

Mick,
Wasn't it the mate that put her on the rocks while the Captain was
asleep?
Paul


It wasn't "the" mate, it was the 3rd Mate ...big difference, and I doubt the
Captain was asleep as he had to take departure, send messages and complete
various tidbits of paperwork.

Shen

Shen,
If you'll notice after about 70 feet most of these boats come with crew
quarters for the reasons you state. A boat that large involves a lot of work
that most people that can afford the boat can also afford someone else to do
the work. I'd guess 60 foot would be the upper range for a couple to
operate. Have you ever heard of an insurance company denying coverage due to
experience?
Paul


Say you hired a crew for this boat. How many would you have? Maybe a Capt,
Mate/cook? in other words, a couple.
There's nothing that would keep two people from handling a 60 or even 100 foot
boat competently as long as they know what they are doing and the boat is well
equipped.
Insurance companies and banks tend to want to protect their investments, and
set up rules which must be followed to obtain their insurance and loans.
Aside from them, there can be other regulatory hoops to jump through, so I
can't give any specific answer as to requirement which may be specific to all
sizes because there are just too many variables.
For instance, I know of 550' ships that are certified for a crew of six. Not
totally in line with the question, but it gives an idea of the possible
variables involved.

Shen

Gene,
Good site, I've bookmarked it, thanks.
Paul

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 18:01:10 -0400, "Paul Schilter"
paulschilter@comcast,dot,net wrote:

A friend and I were having a discussion, I stated that if I had the money
to
buy an ocean liner and just used it for personal pleasure (no paying
passengers) I didn't need a captain's (master's) license. I said that it
might be a bit of a problem finding someone willing to insure you though.
My
friend disagreed, he said that after 60 feet the boat required a
captain's
license. (just to keep this post on topic to this newsgroup I'll state
that
my friend is a Republican and I'm basically a Democrat, but we don't
discuss
this at all.) :-) So I ask the group. was I correct? Also is there a
point
(size wise) where insurance companies want you to have credentials such
as a
master's license or previous experience?
Paul


1) Unless the operation of the vessel is "for hire" there is no USCG
requirement for a commercial license.

2) Likewise, a Master's rating is only useful for those vessels that
are used in commerce and are required by the number of paying souls on
board to be "Inspected" by the USCG.

Your insurance carrier might require a Captain's License.

I doubt it, but your particular state might require it. Check here to
see: http://www.nasbla.org/blas.htm
--



Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC.

http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/cavern/
Homepage
http://www.southharbourvillageinn.com/directions.asp Where
Southport,NC is located.
http://www.southharbourvillageinn.linksysnet.com Real Time
Pictures at My Marina
http://www.thebayguide.com/rec.boats
Rec.boats at Lee Yeaton's Bayguide

If you remain in US waters, you do not require one by law. Go anywhere else
and you will. Getting insured is impossible. 60+ft does not require a
license for recreational use. I just finished training an owner /operator on
his 84' boat, and he has no license. He will however end up hiring a crew to
operate and maintain the boat, he just wanted to know what he was doing.

"Paul Schilter" paulschilter@comcast,dot,net wrote in message
...
A friend and I were having a discussion, I stated that if I had the money
to
buy an ocean liner and just used it for personal pleasure (no paying
passengers) I didn't need a captain's (master's) license. I said that it
might be a bit of a problem finding someone willing to insure you though.
My
friend disagreed, he said that after 60 feet the boat required a captain's
license. (just to keep this post on topic to this newsgroup I'll state
that
my friend is a Republican and I'm basically a Democrat, but we don't
discuss
this at all.) :-) So I ask the group. was I correct? Also is there a point
(size wise) where insurance companies want you to have credentials such as
a
master's license or previous experience?
Paul

Uh, that's not totally correct regarding the time frame. 2 years ( 720 days
at sea underway. They'll allow you 1.5 days per 8-12 hr days) will qualify
you for a maximum of 100 tons. After that, more time serving as Master,
Mate, or in a Supervisory Position is required.

"Paul Schilter" paulschilter@comcast,dot,net wrote in message
...
Larry,
I wasn't able to find a definitive answer on the Coast Guard site, it
just deals with commercial vessels. I've never read of anyone saying they
had trouble getting insurance because they didn't have enough experience
for
a given boat size. I know that to get a Coast Guard Master's license you
first have to show two years experience on the size (tonnage) of boat your
getting the license for.
Paul

"Larry Hill" wrote in message
...

It all comes down to financing and insurance. Unless you own the boat
free and clear, you're going to need insurance. To get insurance, you
will need a qualified operator of the vessel. What that means is up
to the insurance company to decide.


IN OTHERWORDS, NO ONE WHO HAS ANSWERED SO FAR KNOWS FORE SURE!

They are just guessing. Any body out there know the answer? I don't.
Larry Hill

550', crew of 6?? Don't see how, that's the minimum Wheelhouse
Officer/Lookout complement. That vessel will also require a Captain, Chief
Engineer, Second and Third Engineers, at least 3 A/B Unlimiteds, 3 O/Ss and
a couple Oilers/Wipers depending on how advanced the engineering space is.

"Shen44" wrote in message
...
Shen,
If you'll notice after about 70 feet most of these boats come with
crew
quarters for the reasons you state. A boat that large involves a lot of
work
that most people that can afford the boat can also afford someone else to
do
the work. I'd guess 60 foot would be the upper range for a couple to
operate. Have you ever heard of an insurance company denying coverage due
to
experience?
Paul


Say you hired a crew for this boat. How many would you have? Maybe a Capt,
Mate/cook? in other words, a couple.
There's nothing that would keep two people from handling a 60 or even 100
foot
boat competently as long as they know what they are doing and the boat is
well
equipped.
Insurance companies and banks tend to want to protect their investments,
and
set up rules which must be followed to obtain their insurance and loans.
Aside from them, there can be other regulatory hoops to jump through, so I
can't give any specific answer as to requirement which may be specific to
all
sizes because there are just too many variables.
For instance, I know of 550' ships that are certified for a crew of six.
Not
totally in line with the question, but it gives an idea of the possible
variables involved.

Shen

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 18:01:10 -0400, "Paul Schilter"
paulschilter@comcast,dot,net wrote:

A friend and I were having a discussion, I stated that if I had the money to
buy an ocean liner and just used it for personal pleasure (no paying
passengers) I didn't need a captain's (master's) license. I said that it
might be a bit of a problem finding someone willing to insure you though. My
friend disagreed, he said that after 60 feet the boat required a captain's
license. (just to keep this post on topic to this newsgroup I'll state that
my friend is a Republican and I'm basically a Democrat, but we don't discuss
this at all.) :-) So I ask the group. was I correct? Also is there a point
(size wise) where insurance companies want you to have credentials such as a
master's license or previous experience?
Paul

There is no absolute "requirement" by statute, regulation or other in
federal waters/international waters, but....

I believe there may be a requirement for a license in any particular
state, I'm not sure about that. I'm positive that other governments
require licenses to enter their ports or territorial waters.

With regard to insurance, it's up to the individual carrier, but most
would want to have an experienced Master on board in order for them to
insure it. I occasionally get a call to deliver a boat, or take a
party beyond the Boundry Line and it's always because the insurance
company requires a licensed Master to do so.

Hope that helps.

Later,

Tom
S. Woodstock, CT
-----------
"Angling may be said to be so
like the mathematics that it
can never be fully learnt..."

Izaak Walton "The Compleat Angler", 1653

Subject: Captain's License
From: "HLAviation"
Date: 07/22/2004 22:46 Pacific Standard Time
Message-id: . net

550', crew of 6?? Don't see how, that's the minimum Wheelhouse
Officer/Lookout complement. That vessel will also require a Captain, Chief
Engineer, Second and Third Engineers, at least 3 A/B Unlimiteds, 3 O/Ss and
a couple Oilers/Wipers depending on how advanced the engineering space is.


G First off, you'll note I said "certified".
Normally they sail with a crew of 11.
Looking at your list of crew, I'd say you're a bit behind the times. For
instance, on any ship I sailed on, we didn't have OS's or oiler/wipers since
the early 80's.
The particular ships I'm talking about are not US flag and carry Capt, 1M, 2M,
3M, CE, 1rst E, 2nd eng, 3 AB's, cook.
Needless to say the vessel's are HIGHLY automated and were built as a test bed.
There are two people on the bridge during inbound/outbound trips ... Capt and
CE.
For longer runs there will be a Mate.

Shen