AR-15 rifles
 

Its Me
- show quoted text -
You're parroting the anti-gun talking points. :)
Nobody said to give up or to get used to it. Gregg did say, accurately, that the AR is just the darling of the moment, and if you magically eradicated them all the killers would just move on to something else. As stated before, a more effective weapon is a 12 gauge shotgun. You don't even have to be accurate, just point it in the general direction. Every blast sprays 8-12 00 buck pellets.
....

The last VP said to get a shotgun and to aim it in the air through an outside window and blast “both barrels�

That’ll fix em! 😋�

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 17:04:53 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:

On 2/22/2018 4:54 PM, Its Me wrote:
On Thursday, February 22, 2018 at 3:59:32 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.



So, give up, huh? I guess nothing can be done to prevent children from
being murdered on a regular basis. I guess we just have to get used to
it, right?

I don't care about all the technical data on any particular weapon. The
only thing I am interested in is which one is used most often in these
mass killings. No need for them to be so easily obtained and used.

You're parroting the anti-gun talking points. :)
Nobody said to give up or to get used to it. Gregg did say, accurately, that the AR is just the darling of the moment, and if you magically eradicated them all the killers would just move on to something else. As stated before, a more effective weapon is a 12 gauge shotgun. You don't even have to be accurate, just point it in the general direction. Every blast sprays 8-12 00 buck pellets.

You're not going to stop these senseless killings until you somehow change society. The AR didn't create these monsters, it's just their tool of choice at the moment.



Ok. How do we "change" society?


How did society change? Undo those changes. If the AR-15 has produced these deviants, then let's
stop selling them. Do you really believe that'll work? I don't, but if I were in charge, I'd stop
selling them just to appease those who think that would solve the problem.

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 15:59:27 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.



So, give up, huh? I guess nothing can be done to prevent children from
being murdered on a regular basis. I guess we just have to get used to
it, right?

I don't care about all the technical data on any particular weapon. The
only thing I am interested in is which one is used most often in these
mass killings. No need for them to be so easily obtained and used.


The problem is you are thinking like someone looking backward and not
forward. If you are a troubled kid who wants to shoot up your school,
any gun will do. If there are no guns, you just start looking for
other weapons, perhaps even being worse.
You have been around industrial chemicals. Certainly it does not take
a lot of imagination or google searching to figure a way to cause
mayhem.
Chlorine gas, typically found in the back of a swimming pool service
truck, springs to mind.
(Yes commercial pool companies shock pools with gas)

AR-15 rifles
 

On 2/22/18 3:59 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid
problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC
line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest
scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of
most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state
background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to
be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the
Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out
to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or
less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up
weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't
mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion,
but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing".Â* The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not.Â*Â* I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do.Â* Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.



So, give up, huh?Â* I guess nothing can be done to prevent children from
being murdered on a regular basis.Â* I guess we just have to get used to
it, right?

I don't care about all the technical data on any particular weapon.Â* The
only thing I am interested in is which one is used most often in these
mass killings.Â* No need for them to be so easily obtained and used.





It is the Libertarian philosophy...don't do anything.

AR-15 rifles
 

Tim wrote:
Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?

.....

Because they “play the part�. Light and accurate.

Though I consider my Steyr AUG a superior weapon, nobody wants one of those Star Wars looking things. But the ease of disassembly and barrel interchange is attractive if you wanna be “tactical�. I like it...

But the AR is “Made in USA “ and the platform for a host of different cartridges. And they look way cool compared to an AK-47/74

Anyhow, back to the Steyr...

https://sofrep.com/68224/steyr-aug-m...odular-rifles/


I have an IWI Tavor that, to me, looks nicer and is more ergonomic:

https://iwi.us/product/tavor-sar-556-w16-barrel/

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thursday, February 22, 2018 at 5:04:57 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 4:54 PM, Its Me wrote:
On Thursday, February 22, 2018 at 3:59:32 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left..


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.



So, give up, huh? I guess nothing can be done to prevent children from
being murdered on a regular basis. I guess we just have to get used to
it, right?

I don't care about all the technical data on any particular weapon. The
only thing I am interested in is which one is used most often in these
mass killings. No need for them to be so easily obtained and used.

You're parroting the anti-gun talking points. :)
Nobody said to give up or to get used to it. Gregg did say, accurately, that the AR is just the darling of the moment, and if you magically eradicated them all the killers would just move on to something else. As stated before, a more effective weapon is a 12 gauge shotgun. You don't even have to be accurate, just point it in the general direction. Every blast sprays 8-12 00 buck pellets.

You're not going to stop these senseless killings until you somehow change society. The AR didn't create these monsters, it's just their tool of choice at the moment.



Ok. How do we "change" society?

I don't know. If I did, I'd have more money than you. :)

One thing is for sure... people killing people has gone on forever. Cain killed Able with a rock. It's a question we won't be able to answer on a NG that used to be about boating. But the other thing that's for sure... If you remove every single AR-15 from the planet tonight, this stuff will continue. That will not fix it.. it's not even a speed bump in the way of someone that wants to do this stuff.

If you want to lessen the ability of sick people to do these types of mass shootings, you'll have to strip all firearms from the US. Every long gun, pistol, shotgun... everything. It'll take decades. Is that what we/you want?

Or we could go after the actual perps... profile the people that do this stuff, be proactive in stopping them, start some "scared straight" programs in school that teach kids right from wrong (since the non-existent parents don't seem to), and maybe even nudge society back towards some conservative values. Having rap singers surrounded by half-clothed girls chanting lyrics like "Fu** cops, kill them all, death to America" doesn't seem to be working out that well, does it? But no, we can't profile kids that have repeatedly been in and out of trouble, has been in mental health treatments, and has even been reported to the FBI. Let's make sure we don't infringe on that asshole's life experience.

Our society is sick. Making AR's slightly harder to get doesn't seem to me to be an effective solution. What's your's?

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thursday, 22 February 2018 20:50:48 UTC-4, Alex wrote:
Tim wrote:
Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?

.....

Because they “play the part�. Light and accurate.

Though I consider my Steyr AUG a superior weapon, nobody wants one of those Star Wars looking things. But the ease of disassembly and barrel interchange is attractive if you wanna be “tactical�. I like it....

But the AR is “Made in USA “ and the platform for a host of different cartridges. And they look way cool compared to an AK-47/74

Anyhow, back to the Steyr...

https://sofrep.com/68224/steyr-aug-m...odular-rifles/


I have an IWI Tavor that, to me, looks nicer and is more ergonomic:

https://iwi.us/product/tavor-sar-556-w16-barrel/


Of course you do......

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thursday, 22 February 2018 21:58:50 UTC-4, Its Me wrote:
snip...
If you want to lessen the ability of sick people to do these types of mass shootings, you'll have to strip all firearms from the US. Every long gun, pistol, shotgun... everything. It'll take decades.
snip...


Bingo! Now you're finally talking sense...didn't know y'all had it in you.
Simple fact...too many Americans just can't be trusted with firearms so the rest of y'all have to suffer for the common good.

AR-15 rifles
 

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/22/18 3:59 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 3:22 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid
problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC
line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest
scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of
most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state
background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to
be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the
Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out
to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or
less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up
weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't
mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion,
but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing".Â* The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not.Â*Â* I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do.Â* Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.



So, give up, huh?Â* I guess nothing can be done to prevent children from
being murdered on a regular basis.Â* I guess we just have to get used to
it, right?

I don't care about all the technical data on any particular weapon.Â* The
only thing I am interested in is which one is used most often in these
mass killings.Â* No need for them to be so easily obtained and used.





It is the Libertarian philosophy...don't do anything.


It is the Liberal philosophy...do something, even if it makes no sense, or
will make the problem worse. As long as the government grows.

AR-15 rifles
 

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 16:44:05 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 15:22:50 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 14:14:26 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/22/2018 1:21 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:33:58 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/22/18 11:24 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 08:57:24 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.

That is simply rationalizing. Plenty of mass shootings have happened
with 9mms, usually pistols but your assault rifle would do just fine.
The "military style" thing is really a red herring. Your CZ is
certainly "military style" and they will sell you a tactical style
stock for just about anything. You can certainly make a very
"military" looking weapon out of a Mini14 or even a 10-22.


What part is "rationalizing"? The AR-15 is the school shoot up weapon of
choice. Any idiot can buy a long gun privately in many parts of this
country without any background check or waiting period. I didn't mention
"military style." You did.


Richard is stuck on the military thing, along with most of the left.


Yes, I am sure some moron can shoot up a school with a CZ Scorpion, but
a $900 9mm rifle is not a weapon of choice for that sort of "fun."

If that is what they had, that is what they would use. The Columbine
boys used a similar Hi Point carbine.


I am not stuck on the "military thing". The military should have the
most lethal weapons available.

I am stuck on military type AR-15s available for civilian purchase
because they have a record of being the weapons of choice for these mass
shootings more often than not. I don't know why they hold such a
fascination for nut cases who want to go kill a bunch of people but they
do. Maybe it's because they are cheap, heavily marketed and available
as you have pointed out.

If restricting their sales would reduce the cowardly mass shooting of
innocent people, including children by making them less desirable, I am
all for it.


First off "banning" something just makes it more desirable not less
but if every AR in the country disappeared, a person who wanted to
kill a lot of people would buy a cheap AK47 clone or a Mini 14. That
is basically the same gun down range. The AK actually shoots a bigger
bullet but the ammo is just as cheap and there are plenty of
magazines, up to 100 rounds or so. That was the evil gun in 1993-4. It
just fell out of favor.
I bet in the private market they were not getting more than $250 300
for them a couple weeks ago but I am sure they are more now.
You really don't see a lot of those old thumb hole models around but
they sold a couple million during the ban so I am sure there are
plenty gathering dust somewhere.

Would restricting their sale make the anti-gun crowd happier? Yes. It's not a matter of prevention,
it's a matter of perception.

How do you really restrict the sale of existing guns? If you simply
say they are not legally transferable, a lot of people would sell them
under the table. Most people are not going to just throw away several
hundred dollars for an AK/AR or well over a thousand for my M1A.
Actually there are AR platforms that are well over a thousand too.