On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 09:03:02 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

On 2/21/18 10:17 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 21 Feb 2018 18:27:49 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

The mental health treatment issues are far more complex than "reporting"
someone who might pose a danger.

But if they don't get "reported" they won't get any treatment, will
they?
I really think the problem is deeper but right now it is not being
addressed at all.



Typically, the reports go to the police. If the cops send someone out to
check up on a person, the odds are unless the person is acting really
wild and irrational, they'll just leave. If they do take someone in,
there is the problem of "where do we take him/her?" If there is a
facility other than the county jail, a judge typically will release that
person in short order.

Dramatic changes in rules and regulations need to be made on the state
level as part of the way to address this problem. It needs to be done,
and it probably will take a long, long time. That's one of the reasons
why I say the issues are "far more complex" than reporting.

You must have actually learned something since you were arguing
exactly the opposite with me just a few months ago.
Typically here, a Baker Act person goes to a county mental health
facility. If they qualify for medicaid or have better than average
insurance and they are willing to go, they might get put in some kind
of commercial rehab since most of these people also have some kind of
substance abuse problems along with being nuts. If they don't do that,
most are home by lunch time the next day.
Laws and court decisions in the 70s made involuntary commitment a very
steep hill to climb. I have no problem keeping guns away from these
people but the elephant in that room is they can usually get a gun
from the same people who sell them their illegal drugs. Evidently a
stolen gun is as good as money when you are trading for crack.

On 2/22/18 11:25 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 11:18 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 07:09:45 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/21/2018 9:51 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 21 Feb 2018 17:01:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Before the 2nd Amendment advocates jump all over me for this, please
hear me out and give it consideration.

I think AR-15 and other "military like" rifles that resemble assault
rifles should be allowed but only at licensed shooting ranges.Â* They
cannot be removed from the range.Â* Owners should be required to store
the rifles *at* the range when not using them.

I realize other types of guns, cars, trucks, knives, etc. can also be
used in these mass killings in schools but for some reason the people
that do this seem to have a fascination with military type assault
weapons.

It's not a 2nd Amendment thing.Â* It's a mental attitude and perception
thing and it needs to be addressed.Â* As a country, we need to do
something, not just talk about it like a bunch of politicians.


And contrary to Harry's claims,Â* mental health professionals need
to pay
closer attention to their patients and not hesitate to report
anyone who
even remotely appears to be a potential threat.Â* The mental health
people at the out-patient facility who treated Cruz reported him to be
of "no danger to himself or others."Â*Â* He then went out with an AR-15
and killed 17 people, most of them children.

Are you really saying any box, magazine fed SA auto?
Also you are showing how much you are affected by the Acela corridor
bubble. How about that guy in Wyoming who is nowhere near a range but
he can shoot in the forest behind his house?
This is where an old states rights guy like me can compromise. If you
are living in Manhattan or Boston, it makes perfect sense that you
store your gun where you shoot it, assuming home defense is a throw
away right. If that is what law you want, go for it. Just don't get
the idea this should be a federal law.

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.



No, I am not talking about any box, magazine fed SA auto rifle used for
hunting or recreational target practice.

I am talking about the models that are basically copies of military
style weapons.Â* For some reason people, including some mentally unstable
people have a fascination with them as evidenced by the number of times
they are used in these mass shootings.Â* Maybe it's because we've see
newscasts and videos of military personnel in Iraq or Afghanistan using
them on a daily basis for the last 17 yearsÂ* or maybe it's because we
see police departments being supplied with surplus military weapons and
gear.Â* It's a cultural thing, not a gun thing.

Think back.Â* When you were a kid how many policemen did you see walking
around in helmets, bullet proof vests and carrying a military style
weapon?Â*Â* You didn't.Â* Cops wore blue uniforms, twirling a night stick
and carrying an inconspicuous sidearm.

Again you are describing a mental problem. Maybe we should disarm
Hollywood. If you think it is a gun problem, any box fed SA is pretty
much like any other. They pretty much all take hi cap magazines.
OTOH people have caused plenty of damage with less capable fire arms.
The guy who shot up the Navy Yard used a pump shotgun. Ft Hood was a
handgun.



Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?



Many reasons, but one is that for a high-powered easy to customize
semi-auto rifle that shoots a high speed round, they are...cheap when
new and even cheaper used, and in many states you can buy one privately
without any background check.

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 06:22:02 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

When was a .357 cheap and quiet to shoot?

Good question and nobody would say that was a round that was not very
deadly. I will admit not many box magazine guns will shoot it tho.

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 09:47:45 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

A .357 MAG/.38 Special rifle like the one I have can be suppressed:

Maybe if you are shooting sub sonic .38

Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 2/22/18 11:25 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 11:18 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 07:09:45 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/21/2018 9:51 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 21 Feb 2018 17:01:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Before the 2nd Amendment advocates jump all over me for this, please
hear me out and give it consideration.

I think AR-15 and other "military like" rifles that resemble assault
rifles should be allowed but only at licensed shooting ranges. They
cannot be removed from the range. Owners should be required to store
the rifles *at* the range when not using them.

I realize other types of guns, cars, trucks, knives, etc. can also be
used in these mass killings in schools but for some reason the people
that do this seem to have a fascination with military type assault
weapons.

It's not a 2nd Amendment thing. It's a mental attitude and perception
thing and it needs to be addressed. As a country, we need to do
something, not just talk about it like a bunch of politicians.


And contrary to Harry's claims, mental health professionals need
to pay
closer attention to their patients and not hesitate to report
anyone who
even remotely appears to be a potential threat. The mental health
people at the out-patient facility who treated Cruz reported him to be
of "no danger to himself or others." He then went out with an AR-15
and killed 17 people, most of them children.

Are you really saying any box, magazine fed SA auto?
Also you are showing how much you are affected by the Acela corridor
bubble. How about that guy in Wyoming who is nowhere near a range but
he can shoot in the forest behind his house?
This is where an old states rights guy like me can compromise. If you
are living in Manhattan or Boston, it makes perfect sense that you
store your gun where you shoot it, assuming home defense is a throw
away right. If that is what law you want, go for it. Just don't get
the idea this should be a federal law.

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.



No, I am not talking about any box, magazine fed SA auto rifle used for
hunting or recreational target practice.

I am talking about the models that are basically copies of military
style weapons. For some reason people, including some mentally unstable
people have a fascination with them as evidenced by the number of times
they are used in these mass shootings. Maybe it's because we've see
newscasts and videos of military personnel in Iraq or Afghanistan using
them on a daily basis for the last 17 years or maybe it's because we
see police departments being supplied with surplus military weapons and
gear. It's a cultural thing, not a gun thing.

Think back. When you were a kid how many policemen did you see walking
around in helmets, bullet proof vests and carrying a military style
weapon? You didn't. Cops wore blue uniforms, twirling a night stick
and carrying an inconspicuous sidearm.

Again you are describing a mental problem. Maybe we should disarm
Hollywood. If you think it is a gun problem, any box fed SA is pretty
much like any other. They pretty much all take hi cap magazines.
OTOH people have caused plenty of damage with less capable fire arms.
The guy who shot up the Navy Yard used a pump shotgun. Ft Hood was a
handgun.



Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?



Many reasons, but one is that for a high-powered easy to customize
semi-auto rifle that shoots a high speed round, they are...cheap when
new and even cheaper used, and in many states you can buy one privately
without any background check.


Didn't you put one of those together? Do you still have it?
--
x


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 09:47:45 -0500, Keyser Soze
wrote:

Of course, my .357 MAG revolver can't be suppressed, but I don't take it
to the range that often. It's my home defense firearm. As in, home
invader breaks in, comes after us, no way to escape, "Bang, you're dead."

The rest of your life you will be saying "huh" a lot. Do you have any
idea how loud a .357 is inside the house? My ex used to complain when
I was shooting hot rounds at the other end of the house, doors closed
and a floor down.
I really got a giggle about Dirty Harry shooting his 29 Smith in that
stadium tunnel. His ear drums would pop and his nose would be
bleeding. When we fired my buddy's 29 in the basement it was like
getting hit in the face with a wet towel, pictures came off the wall
and that was paneling, carpet and more open area, not concrete.
This was ear plugs and muffs sort of thing.

Mr. Luddite
- show quoted text -
Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?

......

Because they “play the part�. Light and accurate.

Though I consider my Steyr AUG a superior weapon, nobody wants one of those Star Wars looking things. But the ease of disassembly and barrel interchange is attractive if you wanna be “tactical�. I like it...

But the AR is “Made in USA “ and the platform for a host of different cartridges. And they look way cool compared to an AK-47/74

Anyhow, back to the Steyr...

https://sofrep.com/68224/steyr-aug-m...odular-rifles/

On 2/22/18 11:44 AM, justan wrote:
Keyser Soze Wrote in message:
On 2/22/18 11:25 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/22/2018 11:18 AM, wrote:
On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 07:09:45 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 2/21/2018 9:51 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 21 Feb 2018 17:01:58 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Before the 2nd Amendment advocates jump all over me for this, please
hear me out and give it consideration.

I think AR-15 and other "military like" rifles that resemble assault
rifles should be allowed but only at licensed shooting ranges. They
cannot be removed from the range. Owners should be required to store
the rifles *at* the range when not using them.

I realize other types of guns, cars, trucks, knives, etc. can also be
used in these mass killings in schools but for some reason the people
that do this seem to have a fascination with military type assault
weapons.

It's not a 2nd Amendment thing. It's a mental attitude and perception
thing and it needs to be addressed. As a country, we need to do
something, not just talk about it like a bunch of politicians.


And contrary to Harry's claims, mental health professionals need
to pay
closer attention to their patients and not hesitate to report
anyone who
even remotely appears to be a potential threat. The mental health
people at the out-patient facility who treated Cruz reported him to be
of "no danger to himself or others." He then went out with an AR-15
and killed 17 people, most of them children.

Are you really saying any box, magazine fed SA auto?
Also you are showing how much you are affected by the Acela corridor
bubble. How about that guy in Wyoming who is nowhere near a range but
he can shoot in the forest behind his house?
This is where an old states rights guy like me can compromise. If you
are living in Manhattan or Boston, it makes perfect sense that you
store your gun where you shoot it, assuming home defense is a throw
away right. If that is what law you want, go for it. Just don't get
the idea this should be a federal law.

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.



No, I am not talking about any box, magazine fed SA auto rifle used for
hunting or recreational target practice.

I am talking about the models that are basically copies of military
style weapons. For some reason people, including some mentally unstable
people have a fascination with them as evidenced by the number of times
they are used in these mass shootings. Maybe it's because we've see
newscasts and videos of military personnel in Iraq or Afghanistan using
them on a daily basis for the last 17 years or maybe it's because we
see police departments being supplied with surplus military weapons and
gear. It's a cultural thing, not a gun thing.

Think back. When you were a kid how many policemen did you see walking
around in helmets, bullet proof vests and carrying a military style
weapon? You didn't. Cops wore blue uniforms, twirling a night stick
and carrying an inconspicuous sidearm.

Again you are describing a mental problem. Maybe we should disarm
Hollywood. If you think it is a gun problem, any box fed SA is pretty
much like any other. They pretty much all take hi cap magazines.
OTOH people have caused plenty of damage with less capable fire arms.
The guy who shot up the Navy Yard used a pump shotgun. Ft Hood was a
handgun.



Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?



Many reasons, but one is that for a high-powered easy to customize
semi-auto rifle that shoots a high speed round, they are...cheap when
new and even cheaper used, and in many states you can buy one privately
without any background check.


Didn't you put one of those together? Do you still have it?


I lightly modified a Colt HBAR with a different handguard, gas block,
and an ambi safety, but I traded that rifle in years ago to an FFL
dealer. My changes did not change the function of the firing mechanisms.

Keyser Soze wrote:
On 2/21/18 9:51 PM, wrote:

Everyone still seems to avoid the fact that this is a kid problem, not
a gun problem. When I was in K-12 lots of kids had easy access to
guns. We were hunting at 14 and this was within a mile of the DC line,
not wyoming. Nobody shot anyone. It was not even in our wildest scope
of thought.


It is a societal problem, exacerbated by the easy availability of most
high-powered firearms. Even in Maryland, there is no state background
check for a long gun, or even a waiting period. You just have to be 21.
And, of course, a long gun sale from one private owner to another in
this state doesn't require any state paperwork.

Tell you a secret. I got rid of my "high-powered" rifles, the Colt and
the Ruger, because they bored me. Basically, my target shooting is
limited to 100 yards unless I want to take a 2-1/2 hour drive out to the
Shenandoah. I don't need superfast, superloud .223 rounds and their
expense and noise to hit easily hit dead .targets at 100 yards or less.
A .22LR, a 9 mm, or a .357 MAG will do that job nicely.


Years ago, there was not a waiting period for long guns in California.
There is now. I remember getting my Remington 1100 at San Francisco Gun
Exchange, On 2nd street, just off market. Bought the 1100, they wrapped
it in brown paper, and I walked out the door. Yes, there were actual gun
stores in San Francisco years ago. My Ithaca 20 gauge, from Monkey Wards,
the guy tossed in box of ammo. As Greg points out. Is a cultural problem
these days. Same culture problem that has violent to others and women as
a main theme. Same cultural problem where doing good in school is
selling out. How many of those shootings in Chicago are by a legally
owned firearm?

On Thu, 22 Feb 2018 11:25:24 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

Why are the AR-15 style rifles the most popular weapon being sold in the
USA today?

Cheap, reliable, customizable, lots of cheap ammo and great marketing.