On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 07:23:35 -0800 (PST), wrote:

Are there really that many parents that will drop $500 on a drone for their kid?

Yes. I see kids with $600 I-phones all the time.
$500 isn't really that much money, particularly for the kids who think
they are "entitled".

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:26:28 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


I was just thinking about a by-gone era. I lived in the small city of
Quincy, MA as a youngster in the 1950's. They had a program in which
kids under a certain age were required to get a "license plate" for
their bicycles. I remember getting one ... small, vertical plate that
you attached to the rear fender of the bicycle. The plates were issued
at the police station and they had a cop give a short driver's "course"
to the kids about safety, rules of the road for bicycles, etc., before
the license plate was issued.

The whole purpose of this program was to introduce youngsters to safety
issues. It was effective.


The closest thing I ever saw to that was a sticker the cops gave you
for a bike and it was only to get it back easier if it was stolen ...
or so the story went. I am not sure how many ever made it home.
The thief just scraped the sticker off and you were not required to
have a sticker.

On 12/15/2015 11:03 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 08:20:20 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article Oo6dnX9gZfcDgO3LnZ2dnUU7-
, says...

The concern is that a million or more inexpensive "drones" will be given
as Christmas presents next week and the FAA anticipates many potential
problems with people using them who are not familiar with their
operation or restrictions. The FAA isn't the only government agency
who is concerned. British Columbia has also issued concerns due to
several close calls involving aircraft and drones in Canada. Similar
regulations are in the works there.

Did you happen to hear Joe Scarborough this morning,
saying the Republican base have been "whiners" for at
least the past 20 years?
This is good example of that.
The government reacts to the threat of commercial
aircraft being brought down, with 100's of deaths.
"Republicans" and libertarians whine about it.
And so it goes.

The complaint is about ineffective bureaucracy. How does sending the
government $5 and getting a registration number prevent someone from
flying a drone near the airport? Even if the person did put the number
somewhere on the drone and it survived the crash in a condition that
it could still be read (the method of numbering is up to the owner),
the fine is $5000 and the plane still crashed.

That is a huge bureaucracy that did absolutely nothing to advance
safety.



I don't think you are correct about the "$5,000" fine.
The penalties can be much higher than that, including criminal prosecution.

Here's the link to the FAQ's again regarding this new regulation:

https://www.faa.gov/uas/registration/faqs/

On 12/15/2015 11:11 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:26:28 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


I was just thinking about a by-gone era. I lived in the small city of
Quincy, MA as a youngster in the 1950's. They had a program in which
kids under a certain age were required to get a "license plate" for
their bicycles. I remember getting one ... small, vertical plate that
you attached to the rear fender of the bicycle. The plates were issued
at the police station and they had a cop give a short driver's "course"
to the kids about safety, rules of the road for bicycles, etc., before
the license plate was issued.

The whole purpose of this program was to introduce youngsters to safety
issues. It was effective.


The closest thing I ever saw to that was a sticker the cops gave you
for a bike and it was only to get it back easier if it was stolen ...
or so the story went. I am not sure how many ever made it home.
The thief just scraped the sticker off and you were not required to
have a sticker.


Like I said, this was from a by-gone era when cops walked a beat
twirling a nightstick and wore uniforms like you see in the famous
Norman Rockwell paintings. The bicycle plate looked like this, except
it said "Quincy" instead of Concord:

http://platevault.com/uploads/86/ee/thumbs/6155832592bee86.jpg

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 06:23:50 -0800 (PST), True North
wrote:

The John got his......to 'ell with anyone else.

===

Merry Christmas to you also.

On 12/15/2015 11:24 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/15/2015 11:11 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:26:28 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


I was just thinking about a by-gone era. I lived in the small city of
Quincy, MA as a youngster in the 1950's. They had a program in which
kids under a certain age were required to get a "license plate" for
their bicycles. I remember getting one ... small, vertical plate that
you attached to the rear fender of the bicycle. The plates were issued
at the police station and they had a cop give a short driver's "course"
to the kids about safety, rules of the road for bicycles, etc., before
the license plate was issued.

The whole purpose of this program was to introduce youngsters to safety
issues. It was effective.


The closest thing I ever saw to that was a sticker the cops gave you
for a bike and it was only to get it back easier if it was stolen ...
or so the story went. I am not sure how many ever made it home.
The thief just scraped the sticker off and you were not required to
have a sticker.


Like I said, this was from a by-gone era when cops walked a beat
twirling a nightstick and wore uniforms like you see in the famous
Norman Rockwell paintings. The bicycle plate looked like this, except
it said "Quincy" instead of Concord:

http://platevault.com/uploads/86/ee/thumbs/6155832592bee86.jpg


Should have kept it. I see old bicycle plates like this are selling on
eBay for $45 and up. Probably cost 50 cents when issued in 1955.

wrote:
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:26:28 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


I was just thinking about a by-gone era. I lived in the small city of
Quincy, MA as a youngster in the 1950's. They had a program in which
kids under a certain age were required to get a "license plate" for
their bicycles. I remember getting one ... small, vertical plate that
you attached to the rear fender of the bicycle. The plates were issued
at the police station and they had a cop give a short driver's "course"
to the kids about safety, rules of the road for bicycles, etc., before
the license plate was issued.

The whole purpose of this program was to introduce youngsters to safety
issues. It was effective.


The closest thing I ever saw to that was a sticker the cops gave you
for a bike and it was only to get it back easier if it was stolen ...
or so the story went. I am not sure how many ever made it home.
The thief just scraped the sticker off and you were not required to
have a sticker.


We actually got a ticket if no sticker. Got one at school one time. Had
to go to a bicycle court on Saturday. Run by students from the high
school. Do not know the criteria for court service.

On 12/15/2015 10:38 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 12/15/15 7:36 AM, John H. wrote:
On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 05:52:36 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 12/14/15 8:32 PM, John H. wrote:
Today the FAA announced plans for a model aircraft registration
process to begin next
week. The new federal requirements:

All aircraft that are flown using a ground control system, such
as a
transmitter, are required to participate. This includes fixed-wing
aircraft, not just
multirotors or drones.
Any pilot flying models weighing between .55 pounds (or 250
grams) and 55 lbs
is required to register.
You will not be required to register every aircraft
individually. You only
need to register yourself and can affix one registration number to
all your aircraft.
You must mark all aircraft with your registration number. The number
can be inside
the aircraft, such as a battery hatch - but should not require tools
to access.
The FAA plans to launch the online registration website on
Monday, December
21.
There is a $5 fee to register, which is waived if you register
within the
first 30 days.
You only need to register once every 3 years.

The above was copied from an email from the AMA today. Note the
minimum size, and the
fact that every aircraft is included. So if I buy a baby model that
weighs over a
half pound, and give it to a grandkid, the grandkid must be a
registered operator.

How friggin' stupid are the assholes running this government. I
guess they're pretty
smart, they just made the AFGE a lot bigger.
--

Ban idiots, not guns!


Why are you whining about government employment? Weren't you a
government employee most of your working life? Wasn't your wife? Didn't
your wife get health plan benefits from an employee union? You're biting
the hands that fed you, eh?

Waste is waste, Krause.

Attempting to solve the drone problem by forcing responsible operators
to register
and then needing a bureaucracy to track the process is stupid.

As usual, you can't discuss the topic without changing the subject.
--

Ban idiots, not guns!


If the subject is overreacting government and waste, then your
involvements as a government employee in the war against Vietnam
qualifies as both, and to a much greater degree than an effort to help
control what might be a toy that interferes with safe air travel.


You certainly didn't waste any of your hard earned cash on taxes, didja
sport?

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:44:48 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/15/2015 10:40 AM, John H. wrote:

Any parent could bring their kids to an RC field and get a 'quickie' course for their
kids, along with some buddy-boxed 'stick time'. Responsible parents, buying for their
kids, might do so.

But again, we're not talking responsible adults here.

The FAA agrees with you.



The FAA is used to dealing with professionals and dedicated amateurs.
They are unprepared to deal with the rabble that is buying the drones.
I am still reminded of the CB radio craze and the FCC's inability to
really regulate much of any of it. They finally just walked away. CB
pretty much just died from it's own weight. It became unusable.
I don't see that happening with drones although some of the novelty
might wear off after you have seen all of your neighbors naked.

Oh the horror!

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:46:53 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Tue, 15 Dec 2015 10:08:41 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" wrote:


Again, the concern is a 50% increase of drones, RC aircraft, etc.,
starting to be used within the next couple of months.

I also realize that enforcement of the registration requirement is
difficult. It probably would have made more sense to require
registration at the time of sale.

Or have the seller check for an AMA card prior to the sale. But, the AMA card is free
to those under 19, and there is no requirement that the kid knows any flight rules or
safety measures.

Then we would have the "drone show" loophole ;-)

These days anyone who can put am Ikea table together can make a drone
from parts and I already know a guy who is making money doing it. (he
works for my wife). Some of these are pretty sophisticated and still
less than $500 to build. (more properly "assemble" since it is all off
the shelf parts)