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#12
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:16:55 -0400, John H.
wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:14:09 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:31:40 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 1 Oct 2015 07:38:54 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: On 10/1/15 2:12 AM, wrote: CNN had the Russian bomb sight photos of their Syrian air strikes. I guess we are used to seeing the thing in the cross hairs blow up. I saw one where they simply hit everything in the frame with something that looked like a cluster bomb. The second one blew a huge hole about 75 meters from the building they appeared to be aiming at. Maybe CNN just picked the misses but they certainly had some. Hopefully, Syria will turn into another Afghanistan for the Russkies. It is a different situation altogether. In Syria, Russia will have a willing partner on the ground. That is more than the US can say, unless you count a rabble of Kurdish fighters we can't really trust. It turns out our "allies" are giving some of the weapons we supply to ISIS. Personally I would just let the Russians deal with it, even if it means Assad stays. Every time we have deposed one of these dictators it turned out worse for us. I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. Russia is going to try to reach out and regain some of it's previous power. I doubt we will stop that. I am not even sure we want to. They have always wanted a have a base on the Med and Syria offers that opportunity. I suppose the foreign policy question for us is who is the most dangerous to us? A stronger Russia or a stronger ISIS? If Russia stabilized Iraq and Syria, I think I vote for Russia. We have never had a war with the Russians, we have been at war in Iraq for 25 years. Russia may well have oil in its sights. Russia has plenty of oil. |
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#13
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:50:32 -0400, wrote:
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:16:55 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:14:09 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:31:40 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 1 Oct 2015 07:38:54 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: On 10/1/15 2:12 AM, wrote: CNN had the Russian bomb sight photos of their Syrian air strikes. I guess we are used to seeing the thing in the cross hairs blow up. I saw one where they simply hit everything in the frame with something that looked like a cluster bomb. The second one blew a huge hole about 75 meters from the building they appeared to be aiming at. Maybe CNN just picked the misses but they certainly had some. Hopefully, Syria will turn into another Afghanistan for the Russkies. It is a different situation altogether. In Syria, Russia will have a willing partner on the ground. That is more than the US can say, unless you count a rabble of Kurdish fighters we can't really trust. It turns out our "allies" are giving some of the weapons we supply to ISIS. Personally I would just let the Russians deal with it, even if it means Assad stays. Every time we have deposed one of these dictators it turned out worse for us. I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. Russia is going to try to reach out and regain some of it's previous power. I doubt we will stop that. I am not even sure we want to. They have always wanted a have a base on the Med and Syria offers that opportunity. I suppose the foreign policy question for us is who is the most dangerous to us? A stronger Russia or a stronger ISIS? If Russia stabilized Iraq and Syria, I think I vote for Russia. We have never had a war with the Russians, we have been at war in Iraq for 25 years. Russia may well have oil in its sights. Russia has plenty of oil. It's about control of oil. -- Ban idiots, not guns! |
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#14
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 1 Oct 2015 17:18:22 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 10/1/15 5:15 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 10/2/2015 5:29 PM, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:18:28 -0400, wrote: If Assad was deposed, Syria would turn into the same black hole Iraq turned into when we killed Saddam. I know we are supposed to hate totalitarian dictators but they seem to be the only ones who can hold down the crazies in these places. === Sometimes the world is full of tough choices. Hindsight being 20/20, I'd vote for stability. The notion of democratic government is totally alien to the prevailing culture. They have no foundation for it unfortunately. Very true. Right, because our support of horrific right-wing dictators who eventually were deposed has worked out so well for us. You know, Battista, the Shah, the South Vietnamese generals, the wonderful guys in Nicaragua and Panama...et cetera. I am thinking more about things that happened in this century. Saddam, Q-daffy, Mubarak How did that work out? |
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#15
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:55:09 -0400, John H.
wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:50:32 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:16:55 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:14:09 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:31:40 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 1 Oct 2015 07:38:54 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: On 10/1/15 2:12 AM, wrote: CNN had the Russian bomb sight photos of their Syrian air strikes. I guess we are used to seeing the thing in the cross hairs blow up. I saw one where they simply hit everything in the frame with something that looked like a cluster bomb. The second one blew a huge hole about 75 meters from the building they appeared to be aiming at. Maybe CNN just picked the misses but they certainly had some. Hopefully, Syria will turn into another Afghanistan for the Russkies. It is a different situation altogether. In Syria, Russia will have a willing partner on the ground. That is more than the US can say, unless you count a rabble of Kurdish fighters we can't really trust. It turns out our "allies" are giving some of the weapons we supply to ISIS. Personally I would just let the Russians deal with it, even if it means Assad stays. Every time we have deposed one of these dictators it turned out worse for us. I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. Russia is going to try to reach out and regain some of it's previous power. I doubt we will stop that. I am not even sure we want to. They have always wanted a have a base on the Med and Syria offers that opportunity. I suppose the foreign policy question for us is who is the most dangerous to us? A stronger Russia or a stronger ISIS? If Russia stabilized Iraq and Syria, I think I vote for Russia. We have never had a war with the Russians, we have been at war in Iraq for 25 years. Russia may well have oil in its sights. Russia has plenty of oil. It's about control of oil. Everything is not about oil. The bases on the Med are a lot more important to the russians. They can get there from the black sea but it is a much harder route and easy to block off. There are two choke points. |
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#16
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:31:06 -0400, wrote:
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:55:09 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 19:50:32 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:16:55 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:14:09 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H. wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:31:40 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 1 Oct 2015 07:38:54 -0400, Keyser Söze wrote: On 10/1/15 2:12 AM, wrote: CNN had the Russian bomb sight photos of their Syrian air strikes. I guess we are used to seeing the thing in the cross hairs blow up. I saw one where they simply hit everything in the frame with something that looked like a cluster bomb. The second one blew a huge hole about 75 meters from the building they appeared to be aiming at. Maybe CNN just picked the misses but they certainly had some. Hopefully, Syria will turn into another Afghanistan for the Russkies. It is a different situation altogether. In Syria, Russia will have a willing partner on the ground. That is more than the US can say, unless you count a rabble of Kurdish fighters we can't really trust. It turns out our "allies" are giving some of the weapons we supply to ISIS. Personally I would just let the Russians deal with it, even if it means Assad stays. Every time we have deposed one of these dictators it turned out worse for us. I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. Russia is going to try to reach out and regain some of it's previous power. I doubt we will stop that. I am not even sure we want to. They have always wanted a have a base on the Med and Syria offers that opportunity. I suppose the foreign policy question for us is who is the most dangerous to us? A stronger Russia or a stronger ISIS? If Russia stabilized Iraq and Syria, I think I vote for Russia. We have never had a war with the Russians, we have been at war in Iraq for 25 years. Russia may well have oil in its sights. Russia has plenty of oil. It's about control of oil. Everything is not about oil. The bases on the Med are a lot more important to the russians. They can get there from the black sea but it is a much harder route and easy to block off. There are two choke points. Absolutely! That's a given. Just think how much they would enjoy a base in Bandar Abbas, Iran. And I'll be damned - Iran and Russia are doing some heavy hand-holding as we speak: http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2015/0...s-a-weak-hand/ -- Ban idiots, not guns! |
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#17
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Fri, 02 Oct 2015 10:38:32 -0400, John H.
wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 20:31:06 -0400, wrote: The bases on the Med are a lot more important to the russians. They can get there from the black sea but it is a much harder route and easy to block off. There are two choke points. Absolutely! That's a given. Just think how much they would enjoy a base in Bandar Abbas, Iran. And I'll be damned - Iran and Russia are doing some heavy hand-holding as we speak: http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2015/0...s-a-weak-hand/ Iran is not as friendly as Syria. The med is also a very attractive base for them if they are sailing east. |
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#18
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H.
wrote: I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. === We should be OK with that if it stabilizes the country and stops the ISIS plague from spreading further. Even if Assad is deposed Syria is not going to turn into a tourist mecca or bastion of Western style democracy. |
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#19
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:18:28 -0400, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Oct 2015 14:44:18 -0500, wrote: On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 11:44:34 -0400, John H. wrote: I think we're going to see a much bigger Russian presence in Syria than was ever imagined, and I'm not talking about a destroyer making a social visit. === We should be OK with that if it stabilizes the country and stops the ISIS plague from spreading further. Even if Assad is deposed Syria is not going to turn into a tourist mecca or bastion of Western style democracy. If Assad was deposed, Syria would turn into the same black hole Iraq turned into when we killed Saddam. I know we are supposed to hate totalitarian dictators but they seem to be the only ones who can hold down the crazies in these places. === Sometimes the world is full of tough choices. Hindsight being 20/20, I'd vote for stability. The notion of democratic government is totally alien to the prevailing culture. They have no foundation for it unfortunately. |
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#20
posted to rec.boats
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The gang that cabn't shoot straight
On Thu, 01 Oct 2015 16:16:55 -0400, John H.
wrote: Russia is going to try to reach out and regain some of it's previous power. I doubt we will stop that. I am not even sure we want to. They have always wanted a have a base on the Med and Syria offers that opportunity. I suppose the foreign policy question for us is who is the most dangerous to us? A stronger Russia or a stronger ISIS? If Russia stabilized Iraq and Syria, I think I vote for Russia. We have never had a war with the Russians, we have been at war in Iraq for 25 years. Russia may well have oil in its sights. === Frankly I doubt it since they have a lot of oil of their own. A naval base on the Med and keeping a long standing ally in power is more than enough incentive. I wish them well against ISIS. |
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