Fortunately my daughter is working on a 2 year masters program which is about 30 grand a year. She's working a trade off which entails making almost nothing but some pocket monies. Though her tuition is paid for by working at the college, When she's done she'll have a masters in "coaching" which will pay her about 22,000 a year as their assistant vollyball coach.

Yeah, my wife and I are still paying 'child support' lol!

On 2/10/15 11:20 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 09:48:39 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/10/15 7:53 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:27:36 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/8/15 11:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Feb 2015 18:17:15 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Seems like *everyone* is bipolar now-a-days.

There is a lot of money in mental illness so it does get diagnosed
more than it may actually exist.


So, you and Greg feel that a person who kills someone but is determined
to be insane should just automatically to to the chair ... or lethal
injection gurney?

It would depend on the depth of the "mental defect" (the legal term)
and the severity of the crime but if it was a capital case and
abhorrent enough to survive all of the mandatory appeals, why not
execute them just like you would anyone else?

I also see little difference between life in prison and life in a
correctional mental facility. It is just a prison with a prescription
drug plan. They keep the inmates drugged into submission. Is that a
life? (yes I have been in one in my job)



The greatest living expert…

…in rec.boats has to be Greg Fretwell…

…because in catching up on the last few days of posts, I read that he
has *all* the answers on:

* capital punishment

* mental illness

* physicians and their motivators

* snow

* prisons and inmates

* labor unions

* the Middle East

* drone warfare

* politics

This is an absolutely amazing accomplishment for a fellow who has *no*
college degrees in anything, no expertise in the criminal justice
system; no decade of education, training, examination and certification
in treating mental illnesses; no medical degree; no experience in
diplomacy; no experience in high level politics, et cetera, et cetera,
et cetera.

Greg, you're just amazing. If there's ever a call for another
all-seeing, all-knowing oracle, you're the man. No need for anyone to
spend decades of their lives learning and perfecting a high-level skill
set. Just seek out *The Greg*.

===

In between your sarcasm I detect a touch of envy. It's important to
remember that it's not what you've been taught that counts, it's how
you use what you know. In that respect I regard you as an educated
fool.



Envy of what?

And of course I shall give your comment all the attention I give to your
genomate Slammer's posts.

===

Your problem Harry is that you don't know what you don't know, coupled
with an overdose of arrogance. You're blind to it. Perhaps you need
another degree to up your educated fool ante.



Such childish name calling on your part.

--
Proud to be a Liberal.

On 2/10/15 11:32 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:58:40 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

A secondary motivator is to make himself feel better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.

I don't have to do that. Simply looking at BAs with $30k a year jobs
and $150,000 in student debt is sufficient.

I am retired making a fairly nice living and you are still going to
work every day, trying to pay down your debt. Nuff said



As far as I can tell from your posts here. your life consists of make-do
home repairs and projects on your house and taking your wife and dog out
on pontoon rides in the adjacent swamp.

I work when I want to work. Fortunately, I still feel like working, and
still am able to contribute. I spent Monday at a client's office in
Baltimore helping several of its employees put together still and video
presentations on their work last fall helping villagers in Africa plan
and build potable water projects.

To my way of thinking, that beats pool maintenance and rebuilding a pool
bar.

--
Proud to be a Liberal.

On 2/10/15 1:52 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 9:47 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 7:46 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 7:26 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 7:21 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 6:58 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 6:50 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 6:27 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/8/15 11:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Feb 2015 18:17:15 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"

wrote:


Seems like *everyone* is bipolar now-a-days.

There is a lot of money in mental illness so it does get diagnosed
more than it may actually exist.


So, you and Greg feel that a person who kills someone but is
determined
to be insane should just automatically to to the chair ... or
lethal
injection gurney?

It would depend on the depth of the "mental defect" (the legal
term)
and the severity of the crime but if it was a capital case and
abhorrent enough to survive all of the mandatory appeals, why not
execute them just like you would anyone else?

I also see little difference between life in prison and life in a
correctional mental facility. It is just a prison with a
prescription
drug plan. They keep the inmates drugged into submission. Is
that a
life? (yes I have been in one in my job)



The greatest living expert…

…in rec.boats has to be Greg Fretwell…

…because in catching up on the last few days of posts, I read
that he
has *all* the answers on:

* capital punishment

* mental illness

* physicians and their motivators

* snow

* prisons and inmates

* labor unions

* the Middle East

* drone warfare

* politics

This is an absolutely amazing accomplishment for a fellow who has
*no*
college degrees in anything, no expertise in the criminal justice
system; no decade of education, training, examination and
certification
in treating mental illnesses; no medical degree; no experience in
diplomacy; no experience in high level politics, et cetera, et
cetera,
et cetera.

Greg, you're just amazing. If there's ever a call for another
all-seeing, all-knowing oracle, you're the man. No need for
anyone to
spend decades of their lives learning and perfecting a high-level
skill
set. Just seek out *The Greg*.




You forgot "keeper of the keys" for Windows 95. :-)



Ah, yes. Well, as I am not "the expert" in everything, I hope you'll
excuse that memory lapse.

It is obvious that Greg's primary motivator is $$$. He doesn't give a
**** about capital punishment, beyond the fact that handing a
murderer a
suicide pill is cheaper than housing him for life, that he doesn't
give
a rat's ass about the Middle East beyond cutting military aid
($$$) to
Israel, et cetera. A secondary motivator is to make himself feel
better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.





I would argue that you tend to put too much emphasis on why a degree
is required to be qualified in any particular subject or discipline.
There are plenty of examples of degree-less, self-taught and educated
people who have made major contributions to society (or simply had
successful careers in their chosen field of work). There are also
many examples of highly educated people holding multiple degrees who
are total failures or represent warped views that affect society.

I think the problem in a discussion group like rec.boats is how
information and opinions are presented. An "IMO" or "I think" before
stating a belief takes the edge off of what seems to bother you
regarding Greg. He posts his views as if they are certain fact, but
most are simply opinions that are viewed differently by others.

BTW ... you often post in the same manner, especially when it comes
to politics.



I think Greg is qualified to discuss snow and politics.


I have a hard won degree in engineering with a focus on communication
electronics and systems. Greg is far more knowledgeable of past and
current electronic communication systems (computers, etc.) than I ever
was or will ever be because I never used the formal education in the
field I ended up in. I don't even know how to program a DVR although
that's mainly because I have no interest in using them.

The field I worked in almost 40 years is heavy in physics backed with
mechanical and electrical engineering. There is no college level
degree program (at least there wasn't when I was still attending
school) in the technology I was involved with. A working understanding
of the technology requires self education, drawing from other fields
of study.





I didn't comment on Greg's knowledge of electronics communications
systems. I don't disagree that a lot of knowledge can come from being
self-taught but in a lot of cases, that knowledge needs the refinement
that only comes from an environment that includes formal education,
training, certification.



"Lot of cases"? That's where I think you are wrong. The degree may
qualify you ... it's the main reason I pursued one ... in the eyes of
others but it doesn't mean you don't have the knowledge or expertise
to do your job. College doesn't teach that ... I know that for a fact.




Uh, let's try that again: Formal education, training, certification.
Got it?


--
Proud to be a Liberal.

On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:08:02 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/10/15 11:20 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 09:48:39 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/10/15 7:53 AM, Wayne.B wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:27:36 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/8/15 11:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Feb 2015 18:17:15 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:


Seems like *everyone* is bipolar now-a-days.

There is a lot of money in mental illness so it does get diagnosed
more than it may actually exist.


So, you and Greg feel that a person who kills someone but is determined
to be insane should just automatically to to the chair ... or lethal
injection gurney?

It would depend on the depth of the "mental defect" (the legal term)
and the severity of the crime but if it was a capital case and
abhorrent enough to survive all of the mandatory appeals, why not
execute them just like you would anyone else?

I also see little difference between life in prison and life in a
correctional mental facility. It is just a prison with a prescription
drug plan. They keep the inmates drugged into submission. Is that a
life? (yes I have been in one in my job)



The greatest living expert…

…in rec.boats has to be Greg Fretwell…

…because in catching up on the last few days of posts, I read that he
has *all* the answers on:

* capital punishment

* mental illness

* physicians and their motivators

* snow

* prisons and inmates

* labor unions

* the Middle East

* drone warfare

* politics

This is an absolutely amazing accomplishment for a fellow who has *no*
college degrees in anything, no expertise in the criminal justice
system; no decade of education, training, examination and certification
in treating mental illnesses; no medical degree; no experience in
diplomacy; no experience in high level politics, et cetera, et cetera,
et cetera.

Greg, you're just amazing. If there's ever a call for another
all-seeing, all-knowing oracle, you're the man. No need for anyone to
spend decades of their lives learning and perfecting a high-level skill
set. Just seek out *The Greg*.

===

In between your sarcasm I detect a touch of envy. It's important to
remember that it's not what you've been taught that counts, it's how
you use what you know. In that respect I regard you as an educated
fool.



Envy of what?

And of course I shall give your comment all the attention I give to your
genomate Slammer's posts.

===

Your problem Harry is that you don't know what you don't know, coupled
with an overdose of arrogance. You're blind to it. Perhaps you need
another degree to up your educated fool ante.



Such childish name calling on your part.

'Dimples' isn't childish name-calling?
--

Guns don't cause problems. The behavior
of certain gun owners causes problems.

On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:13:20 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 2/10/15 11:32 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:58:40 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

A secondary motivator is to make himself feel better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.

I don't have to do that. Simply looking at BAs with $30k a year jobs
and $150,000 in student debt is sufficient.

I am retired making a fairly nice living and you are still going to
work every day, trying to pay down your debt. Nuff said



As far as I can tell from your posts here. your life consists of make-do
home repairs and projects on your house and taking your wife and dog out
on pontoon rides in the adjacent swamp.

I work when I want to work. Fortunately, I still feel like working, and
still am able to contribute. I spent Monday at a client's office in
Baltimore helping several of its employees put together still and video
presentations on their work last fall helping villagers in Africa plan
and build potable water projects.

To my way of thinking, that beats pool maintenance and rebuilding a pool
bar.

Perhaps Greg doesn't have the need to pat himself on the back continuously?
--

Guns don't cause problems. The behavior
of certain gun owners causes problems.

wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:13:20 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/10/15 11:32 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:58:40 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

A secondary motivator is to make himself feel better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.

I don't have to do that. Simply looking at BAs with $30k a year jobs
and $150,000 in student debt is sufficient.

I am retired making a fairly nice living and you are still going to
work every day, trying to pay down your debt. Nuff said



As far as I can tell from your posts here. your life consists of make-do
home repairs and projects on your house and taking your wife and dog out
on pontoon rides in the adjacent swamp.

I work when I want to work. Fortunately, I still feel like working, and
still am able to contribute. I spent Monday at a client's office in
Baltimore helping several of its employees put together still and video
presentations on their work last fall helping villagers in Africa plan
and build potable water projects.

To my way of thinking, that beats pool maintenance and rebuilding a pool
bar.

Yeah, just a few little make do home repair

http://gfretwell.com/ftp/house%2010%...rogression.jpg

Nice lawn. 😳
--
Sent from my iPhone 6+

wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:57:13 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

Fortunately my daughter is working on a 2 year masters program which is
about 30 grand a year. She's working a trade off which entails making
almost nothing but some pocket monies. Though her tuition is paid for by
working at the college, When she's done she'll have a masters in
"coaching" which will pay her about 22,000 a year as their assistant vollyball coach.

Yeah, my wife and I are still paying 'child support' lol!

My son in law has a masters in "beach" (environmental) something and
he ended up being a park ranger for $25k. It took him quite a while
before he could move up and he still topped out around $50k at Florida
water management.
Then he went to law school, passed the bar and he is still looking for
another job, without as much luck as he expected.
Student debt is now over $200k now with 20 years of accrued interest
on the original loan and subsequent ones.

That is the insidious trap in student loans. As long as you are taking
"something" you can defer the payments so kids keep going back for
more and piling on the debt.

I do think it is funny that a quarter century ago the scandal was
banks giving college students credit cards and then the colleges saw
the gravy train and jumped on it themselves. Now the student loans are
much bigger than a bank would ever let a credit card debt get before
they shut them down.

The other problem with student loans is the government. Why do the Fed's
set an 8% rate on student loans, when they are loaning money to the FED and
zero interest rate?

"Mr. Luddite" wrote:
On 2/10/2015 9:47 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 7:46 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 7:26 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 7:21 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 6:58 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/10/15 6:50 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 2/10/2015 6:27 AM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 2/8/15 11:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Feb 2015 18:17:15 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"

wrote:


Seems like *everyone* is bipolar now-a-days.

There is a lot of money in mental illness so it does get diagnosed
more than it may actually exist.


So, you and Greg feel that a person who kills someone but is
determined
to be insane should just automatically to to the chair ... or
lethal
injection gurney?

It would depend on the depth of the "mental defect" (the legal
term)
and the severity of the crime but if it was a capital case and
abhorrent enough to survive all of the mandatory appeals, why not
execute them just like you would anyone else?

I also see little difference between life in prison and life in a
correctional mental facility. It is just a prison with a
prescription
drug plan. They keep the inmates drugged into submission. Is that a
life? (yes I have been in one in my job)



The greatest living expert…

…in rec.boats has to be Greg Fretwell…

…because in catching up on the last few days of posts, I read
that he
has *all* the answers on:

* capital punishment

* mental illness

* physicians and their motivators

* snow

* prisons and inmates

* labor unions

* the Middle East

* drone warfare

* politics

This is an absolutely amazing accomplishment for a fellow who has
*no*
college degrees in anything, no expertise in the criminal justice
system; no decade of education, training, examination and
certification
in treating mental illnesses; no medical degree; no experience in
diplomacy; no experience in high level politics, et cetera, et
cetera,
et cetera.

Greg, you're just amazing. If there's ever a call for another
all-seeing, all-knowing oracle, you're the man. No need for
anyone to
spend decades of their lives learning and perfecting a high-level
skill
set. Just seek out *The Greg*.




You forgot "keeper of the keys" for Windows 95. :-)



Ah, yes. Well, as I am not "the expert" in everything, I hope you'll
excuse that memory lapse.

It is obvious that Greg's primary motivator is $$$. He doesn't give a
**** about capital punishment, beyond the fact that handing a
murderer a
suicide pill is cheaper than housing him for life, that he doesn't
give
a rat's ass about the Middle East beyond cutting military aid ($$$) to
Israel, et cetera. A secondary motivator is to make himself feel
better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.





I would argue that you tend to put too much emphasis on why a degree
is required to be qualified in any particular subject or discipline.
There are plenty of examples of degree-less, self-taught and educated
people who have made major contributions to society (or simply had
successful careers in their chosen field of work). There are also
many examples of highly educated people holding multiple degrees who
are total failures or represent warped views that affect society.

I think the problem in a discussion group like rec.boats is how
information and opinions are presented. An "IMO" or "I think" before
stating a belief takes the edge off of what seems to bother you
regarding Greg. He posts his views as if they are certain fact, but
most are simply opinions that are viewed differently by others.

BTW ... you often post in the same manner, especially when it comes
to politics.



I think Greg is qualified to discuss snow and politics.


I have a hard won degree in engineering with a focus on communication
electronics and systems. Greg is far more knowledgeable of past and
current electronic communication systems (computers, etc.) than I ever
was or will ever be because I never used the formal education in the
field I ended up in. I don't even know how to program a DVR although
that's mainly because I have no interest in using them.

The field I worked in almost 40 years is heavy in physics backed with
mechanical and electrical engineering. There is no college level
degree program (at least there wasn't when I was still attending
school) in the technology I was involved with. A working understanding
of the technology requires self education, drawing from other fields
of study.





I didn't comment on Greg's knowledge of electronics communications
systems. I don't disagree that a lot of knowledge can come from being
self-taught but in a lot of cases, that knowledge needs the refinement
that only comes from an environment that includes formal education,
training, certification.



"Lot of cases"? That's where I think you are wrong. The degree may
qualify you ... it's the main reason I pursued one ... in the eyes of
others but it doesn't mean you don't have the knowledge or expertise
to do your job. College doesn't teach that ... I know that for a fact.

When I was doing hiring interviews, there were degreed and non degreed
engineers. I would hire a degreed engineer over an equal non degreed
engineer, for the simple reason, they proved they could stick to something
for the duration.

On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 19:53:09 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:13:20 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 2/10/15 11:32 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 10 Feb 2015 06:58:40 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

A secondary motivator is to make himself feel better
about never getting a college degree by putting down those who did.

I don't have to do that. Simply looking at BAs with $30k a year jobs
and $150,000 in student debt is sufficient.

I am retired making a fairly nice living and you are still going to
work every day, trying to pay down your debt. Nuff said



As far as I can tell from your posts here. your life consists of make-do
home repairs and projects on your house and taking your wife and dog out
on pontoon rides in the adjacent swamp.

I work when I want to work. Fortunately, I still feel like working, and
still am able to contribute. I spent Monday at a client's office in
Baltimore helping several of its employees put together still and video
presentations on their work last fall helping villagers in Africa plan
and build potable water projects.

To my way of thinking, that beats pool maintenance and rebuilding a pool
bar.

Yeah, just a few little make do home repair

http://gfretwell.com/ftp/house%2010%...rogression.jpg

Nice paint job on that shed.
--

Guns don't cause problems. The behavior
of certain gun owners causes problems.