I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David


The plug is 10-20 bucks at home depot or lowes, Scottys whatever you
have. It's a dryer plug basically... As to the wiring, I forget but I
have a book I always use when I do the wiring.. It was about 20 bucks at
home depot, I have had it for as long as I have owned a house...

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David

The ground is the outside metal band on the plug.

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David



My suggestion is to learn more about what you are thinking of doing. If
your boat is currently set up for a 30 amp, 120 volt service, there's
more to it than just replacing the plug to get 50 amps.

The 50 amp services are, as you stated, more like the power service to
your house. 240 volts between the hot legs and 120 volts between either
of them and neutral. There's 50 amps available for each of the
distributed legs or a total of 100 amps.

The power panel in a boat designed for a 50 amp service distributes the
two 120 volt legs equally to power the boat's electrical system. Any
240 volt items runs off a double pole breaker. Frankly, I've never seen
a 240 volt appliance on a recreational use boat. Not saying they don't
exist. I've just never seen one. The last boat I had had a 240 volt,
50 amp service. It had a washer and dryer. The dryer ran on 120 volts,
not 240.

The wiring on your 30 amp service is sized from the inlet jack to the
power panel for 30 amps. There should be a 30 amp main breaker in your
power panel that would trip if you draw over 30 amps, so there's no
benefit. If you replace the main breaker in the power panel with a 50
amp breaker, you run a risk of fire due to overloading the wiring
between the power inlet plug and the power panel, so you would need to
replace that wiring with a bigger gauge.

Some boats have *two* 30 amp services and power panels. That might be
an easier way to go if you are trying to add more available amps.

On 3/17/2014 7:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:19:42 -0400, KC wrote:

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David


The plug is 10-20 bucks at home depot or lowes, Scottys whatever you
have. It's a dryer plug basically... As to the wiring, I forget but I
have a book I always use when I do the wiring.. It was about 20 bucks at
home depot, I have had it for as long as I have owned a house...

Not true at all, sorry.

This is a non-NEMA twist lock 50a plug, that is corrosion resistant.

A dryer plug is a NEMA 14-30 straight blade that would go south pretty
quickly on a pier.



Yup. I think Scotty should stick to building websites and not wiring boats.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:01:06 -0400, david@righthere... wrote:

I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David

If you are currently getting 120 V on the 30 amp outlet, you should
get 120 V from each hot to neutral on the 50 amp outlet, and 240 volts
between the two hot wires.

If the dock outlets are supplied three-phase power, you may get 208
volts between the hot wires, but most marinas should provide single
phase 120/240 to the dock outlets, although the marina's main supply
will be three-phase.


--
Peter Bennett, VE7CEI Vancouver BC
peterbb (at) telus.net
Vancouver Power Squadron: http://vancouver.powersquadron.ca

On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:01:06 -0400, david@righthere... wrote:

I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office. I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than 250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3 poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that? So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail

Thank you for any help!
David

===

You've gotten some fairly good advice from most sources but let me
emphasize that this is not a job to be undertaken by an an amatuer DIY
electrician. A 50 amp shore power outlet is capable of delivering
about 12 kilowatts of electricity and that is way more than what is
needed to start a fire or electrocute someone. The parts are readily
available from West Marine or your local electrical distributor but
this is not a trivial project. In addition to rewiring your dock, you
also need to totally redo your boat's electrical system from the shore
power connectors right through to the breaker panel. You will totally
void your insurance policy if the job is not done to professional
standards.

If you'd like to learn more from a reliable source, I'd suggest you
start with this book by Nigel Calder:

http://www.amazon.com/Boatowners-Mechanical-Electrical-Manual-Essential/dp/0071432388

On 3/17/2014 7:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/17/2014 7:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:19:42 -0400, KC wrote:

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like
to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office.
I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than
250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot
legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and
Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3
poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do
we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that?
So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail


Thank you for any help!
David


The plug is 10-20 bucks at home depot or lowes, Scottys whatever you
have. It's a dryer plug basically... As to the wiring, I forget but I
have a book I always use when I do the wiring.. It was about 20 bucks at
home depot, I have had it for as long as I have owned a house...

Not true at all, sorry.

This is a non-NEMA twist lock 50a plug, that is corrosion resistant.

A dryer plug is a NEMA 14-30 straight blade that would go south pretty
quickly on a pier.



Yup. I think Scotty should stick to building websites and not wiring
boats.



Why, cause I took a quick look and made a mistake? I have done a lot of
wiring in my time including my whole house to code in Essex from moving
in with full Knob and Tube... I have done barns, and wells. When you
have a 100 year old house you tend to pick up stuff. You should see me
sweat a pipe.... even if I don't know all the right terminology. Either
way, that's why I always keep my electrical book with me to check my own
work as I go....

On Tue, 18 Mar 2014 00:22:52 -0400, KC wrote:

On 3/17/2014 7:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/17/2014 7:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:19:42 -0400, KC wrote:

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like
to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office.
I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than
250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot
legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and
Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3
poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do
we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that?
So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail


Thank you for any help!
David


The plug is 10-20 bucks at home depot or lowes, Scottys whatever you
have. It's a dryer plug basically... As to the wiring, I forget but I
have a book I always use when I do the wiring.. It was about 20 bucks at
home depot, I have had it for as long as I have owned a house...

Not true at all, sorry.

This is a non-NEMA twist lock 50a plug, that is corrosion resistant.

A dryer plug is a NEMA 14-30 straight blade that would go south pretty
quickly on a pier.



Yup. I think Scotty should stick to building websites and not wiring
boats.



Why, cause I took a quick look and made a mistake? I have done a lot of
wiring in my time including my whole house to code in Essex from moving
in with full Knob and Tube... I have done barns, and wells. When you
have a 100 year old house you tend to pick up stuff. You should see me
sweat a pipe.... even if I don't know all the right terminology. Either
way, that's why I always keep my electrical book with me to check my own
work as I go....

===

Scott, just my 2 cents worth, but when a guy is asking for advice on a
potentially critical/high powered electrical issue, I think it
deserves more than a quick look.

On 3/18/2014 12:22 AM, KC wrote:
On 3/17/2014 7:57 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 3/17/2014 7:14 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2014 18:19:42 -0400, KC wrote:

On 3/17/2014 6:01 PM, david@righthere... wrote:
I've been on 30A 120V power at the dock for years and would now like
to upgrade
to 50A 220V, or what they refer to as 50A 250V at the marina office.
I haven't
put a meter on it yet but so far suspect it's closer to 220 than
250. The socket
on the pedestal is like the one pictured he

http://www.catagle.com/68-153/CWD_Ar...uyersGuide.htm

They say it's 3-pole 4-wire. I'm guessing X and Y are the two hot
legs and W is
the neutral. Between X or Y and W would be 120V+/- and between X and
Y is the
220/250V. Right? How does the ground tie into it though? With only 3
poles do we
run a separate wire from the boat to the pedestal, and if so how do
we tie in?

Also can anyone suggest the cheapest place to get a plug like that?
So far the
best price I've found is $68.18 he

http://www.ktool.net/servlet/the-581...-63CR65/Detail



Thank you for any help!
David


The plug is 10-20 bucks at home depot or lowes, Scottys whatever you
have. It's a dryer plug basically... As to the wiring, I forget but I
have a book I always use when I do the wiring.. It was about 20
bucks at
home depot, I have had it for as long as I have owned a house...

Not true at all, sorry.

This is a non-NEMA twist lock 50a plug, that is corrosion resistant.

A dryer plug is a NEMA 14-30 straight blade that would go south pretty
quickly on a pier.



Yup. I think Scotty should stick to building websites and not wiring
boats.



Why, cause I took a quick look and made a mistake? I have done a lot of
wiring in my time including my whole house to code in Essex from moving
in with full Knob and Tube... I have done barns, and wells. When you
have a 100 year old house you tend to pick up stuff. You should see me
sweat a pipe.... even if I don't know all the right terminology. Either
way, that's why I always keep my electrical book with me to check my own
work as I go....


Scott, the OP didn't say if he was re-wiring his *boat* for a 50 amp,
240v marine split service. He might be just trying to use one leg of it
to supply 50 amps to his existing 30 amp, 120v boat panel. If so, he's
taking a big risk because it's not just the plug in question. The
primary feed wires in the boat that run from the power inlet to the
power panel needs to be changed at a minimum. Plus, if the existing
power panel has a 30 amp main, supplying it with 50 amps isn't going to
do him any good. If he changes that to a 50 amp breaker without doing
any changes to the wiring, he could overheat the primary feed wiring in
the boat, causing a fire.

My comment was more than pointing out that a split, 50 amp marine
service plug is not a dryer plug.

I did what I think he is trying to accomplish on the Grand Banks we had.
It had a standard, 30 amp, 120v service. I wanted to add two
air-conditioning units to the boat. Rather than change everything over
to a 50 amp, 240v split service I simply added another 30 amp, 120v
marine inlet connector, wiring (marine type) and a small, dedicated
breaker box with two 15 amp breakers in it, one for each of the AC units.

I don't know a lot about many things and nothing about some things
however electrical power distribution and wiring happens to be one thing
I *do* know something about. I'd hate to see someone hurt or killed
because they received bad input.

Now, I have a question for you. Let's say your house has a 200 amp
service. Your main breaker is a double pole, 200 amp per pole breaker.
There's 240vac between the two "hot" legs and 120vac between either of
them and neutral. Each hot leg from the utility pole is sized for 200
amps for each side of the service, yet the neutral is also only sized
for 200 amps. Why isn't it sized for 400 amps, the sum of both sides of
the total service?

See if the answer is in your "electrical" book.