On 5/8/13 12:38 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 12:09:38 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 12:01 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 08:12:55 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:


Might be a more fair trial if it were held in a state not so gun crazy.

Why do you think it won't be fair?
Don't you believe the defendant is innocent until proven guilty?


In the legal system, I believe defendants are innocent unless proved
guilty. I don't have much confidence, however, in the legal system in a
state that encourages and sanctions "stand your ground" homicides, as
Florida does.

So you think someone should take a potentially deadly beating and not
be able to defend himself?

Instead you live in a "retreat" state where you could be charged for
shooting an intruder in your own home if there was any possibility
that you might have been able to escape.
Before you opine, know that a friend of mine did 7 years in the
Maryland prison system for killing an intruder ... because he had an
opportunity to run out the door.


I believe Zimmerman initiated the fight and when it got out of hand, he
ran to his truck and got his pistol.

On 5/8/13 12:45 PM, F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 5/8/13 12:38 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 12:09:38 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 12:01 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 08:12:55 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:


Might be a more fair trial if it were held in a state not so gun
crazy.

Why do you think it won't be fair?
Don't you believe the defendant is innocent until proven guilty?


In the legal system, I believe defendants are innocent unless proved
guilty. I don't have much confidence, however, in the legal system in a
state that encourages and sanctions "stand your ground" homicides, as
Florida does.

So you think someone should take a potentially deadly beating and not
be able to defend himself?

Instead you live in a "retreat" state where you could be charged for
shooting an intruder in your own home if there was any possibility
that you might have been able to escape.
Before you opine, know that a friend of mine did 7 years in the
Maryland prison system for killing an intruder ... because he had an
opportunity to run out the door.


I believe Zimmerman initiated the fight and when it got out of hand, he
ran to his truck and got his pistol.

Oh, part the second:

I'm not concerned about being prosecuted for shooting a home invader.

If some psychoscotty breaks in here at night, the break-in will be on
video, and the intruder will get exactly what he deserves.

I'm not concerned about being attacked while I walk through the
neighborhood. I do it all the time, day and night, and I've even seen
teen-agers I don't actually know walking around, too. Some of them are
racial minorities and some are carrying snacks. I say "hi," and they say
"hi," back. I don't carry my concealed firearm during these walks.

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 08 May 2013 08:12:55 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 7:45 AM, Tim wrote:
On May 8, 12:45 am, wrote:

At this point we should just let the court decide this.

That's what I've been saying all along.



Might be a more fair trial if it were held in a state not so gun crazy.

Why do you think it won't be fair?
Don't you believe the defendant is innocent until proven guilty?

Doesn't matter. The gun crazies are just that. They will do what it
takes to make Zimmerman look like the innocent victim whether he is or
isn't. It's called having an agenda, just like the far left wingers have
one as well, and that's to make Zimmerman look like a cold hearted
killer at all costs.

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 08 May 2013 12:09:38 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 12:01 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 08:12:55 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:


Might be a more fair trial if it were held in a state not so gun crazy.

Why do you think it won't be fair?
Don't you believe the defendant is innocent until proven guilty?


In the legal system, I believe defendants are innocent unless proved
guilty. I don't have much confidence, however, in the legal system in a
state that encourages and sanctions "stand your ground" homicides, as
Florida does.

So you think someone should take a potentially deadly beating and not
be able to defend himself?

You have NO idea whether that is what happened or not. You are going to
say what FOX tells you to say, that Zimmerman was a darling, great
citizen and that Martin no business being there, despite the truth.

Instead you live in a "retreat" state where you could be charged for
shooting an intruder in your own home if there was any possibility
that you might have been able to escape.
Before you opine, know that a friend of mine did 7 years in the
Maryland prison system for killing an intruder ... because he had an
opportunity to run out the door.

On Wed, 8 May 2013 10:10:49 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 7 May 2013 14:50:04 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

Was it profiling or common sense that drew Zimms attention to the young
fella peering into car windows.

Common bigotry. It's the right wing way!

====

I disagree with that. I have called the cops on white kids who were
acting in exactly the same way. Suspicious behavior is what it is
and totally color blind.

Yeah, you did the right thing, you called the cops, you didn't kill the
kids.

===

Yes, but it's easy to envision a scenario where things could have gone
down quite differently. Suppose one of the kids had started to
physically break into a car and the police had not yet arrived. Would
you stand by passively or would you attempt to intervene? If you
intervene in any way you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would
you defend yourself?

On 5/8/13 1:25 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Wed, 8 May 2013 10:10:49 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 7 May 2013 14:50:04 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

Was it profiling or common sense that drew Zimms attention to the young
fella peering into car windows.

Common bigotry. It's the right wing way!

====

I disagree with that. I have called the cops on white kids who were
acting in exactly the same way. Suspicious behavior is what it is
and totally color blind.

Yeah, you did the right thing, you called the cops, you didn't kill the
kids.

===

Yes, but it's easy to envision a scenario where things could have gone
down quite differently. Suppose one of the kids had started to
physically break into a car and the police had not yet arrived. Would
you stand by passively or would you attempt to intervene? If you
intervene in any way you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would
you defend yourself?


In the civilized world, you're not supposed to use deadly force to stop
property damage or theft. The best thing to do when someone is stealing
a car and you are observing the theft is to get a terrific description
of the perpetrator so you can give it to the police.

On 5/8/13 2:15 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 12:45:56 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 12:38 PM, wrote:


So you think someone should take a potentially deadly beating and not
be able to defend himself?

Instead you live in a "retreat" state where you could be charged for
shooting an intruder in your own home if there was any possibility
that you might have been able to escape.
Before you opine, know that a friend of mine did 7 years in the
Maryland prison system for killing an intruder ... because he had an
opportunity to run out the door.


I believe Zimmerman initiated the fight and when it got out of hand, he
ran to his truck and got his pistol.

It is clear that you have not actually been paying much attention to
it then. That is inconsistent with every version of the story that is
out there. (The girl friend, the police and Zimmerman himself)



Fights can be initiated with words.

On Wed, 08 May 2013 14:06:39 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 1:25 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Wed, 8 May 2013 10:10:49 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 7 May 2013 14:50:04 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

Was it profiling or common sense that drew Zimms attention to the young
fella peering into car windows.

Common bigotry. It's the right wing way!

====

I disagree with that. I have called the cops on white kids who were
acting in exactly the same way. Suspicious behavior is what it is
and totally color blind.

Yeah, you did the right thing, you called the cops, you didn't kill the
kids.

===

Yes, but it's easy to envision a scenario where things could have gone
down quite differently. Suppose one of the kids had started to
physically break into a car and the police had not yet arrived. Would
you stand by passively or would you attempt to intervene? If you
intervene in any way you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would
you defend yourself?


In the civilized world, you're not supposed to use deadly force to stop
property damage or theft. The best thing to do when someone is stealing
a car and you are observing the theft is to get a terrific description
of the perpetrator so you can give it to the police.


====

That's not the scenario I raised. If you observed someone breaking
into your house or vehicle, would you confront them? If you do
confront them, you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would you
defend yourself?

On 5/8/13 2:22 PM, wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 12:56:08 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 12:45 PM, F.O.A.D. wrote:


Oh, part the second:

I'm not concerned about being prosecuted for shooting a home invader.

I hope you can raise the $200 grand Zimmerman needed


If some psychoscotty breaks in here at night, the break-in will be on
video, and the intruder will get exactly what he deserves.

You better hope the cops don't see an escape route you could have
taken.


I'm not concerned about being attacked while I walk through the
neighborhood. I do it all the time, day and night, and I've even seen
teen-agers I don't actually know walking around, too. Some of them are
racial minorities and some are carrying snacks. I say "hi," and they say
"hi," back. I don't carry my concealed firearm during these walks.

Same here. The big difference everyone here still keeps ignoring is
you and I are on a public street. Zimmerman was on private property
where the owner (the HOA) had given some authority to ask questions
and he had every right to question a stranger being there.
Would you be as calm about asking those teenagers why they were
hanging around in your back yard? What if one attacked you when you
asked "what are you doing here"? That was supposed to be the last
words spoken by Zimmerman before the fight started if you believe the
girl friend.



Actually, my little street is a non-county, "private" street. The street
leading to it is public. The land developer got away with this so he
wouldn't have to pave it, but everyone agreed to stall the closings
until he agreed to pay to pave it. Our street is a bit narrower than the
county street. Ahh, local politics.

I've seen teenagers in our backyard, trying to chase down their
"escaped" dog.

At one point I talked to the actual sheriff and a county prosecutor
about home invaders. I wasn't told anything about defending us here that
conflicted with their statements. This isn't one of your ultra-rich,
ultra-white SW Florida enclaves...if someone breaks in at night, it
either is a psychoscotty or a druggie looking for goods to sell.

On 5/8/13 2:23 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Wed, 08 May 2013 14:06:39 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 5/8/13 1:25 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Wed, 8 May 2013 10:10:49 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 7 May 2013 14:50:04 -0400, iBoaterer wrote:

Was it profiling or common sense that drew Zimms attention to the young
fella peering into car windows.

Common bigotry. It's the right wing way!

====

I disagree with that. I have called the cops on white kids who were
acting in exactly the same way. Suspicious behavior is what it is
and totally color blind.

Yeah, you did the right thing, you called the cops, you didn't kill the
kids.

===

Yes, but it's easy to envision a scenario where things could have gone
down quite differently. Suppose one of the kids had started to
physically break into a car and the police had not yet arrived. Would
you stand by passively or would you attempt to intervene? If you
intervene in any way you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would
you defend yourself?


In the civilized world, you're not supposed to use deadly force to stop
property damage or theft. The best thing to do when someone is stealing
a car and you are observing the theft is to get a terrific description
of the perpetrator so you can give it to the police.


====

That's not the scenario I raised. If you observed someone breaking
into your house or vehicle, would you confront them? If you do
confront them, you run the risk of attack. If attacked, would you
defend yourself?



If my car was in the driveway, I'd call the police and spent my time
getting a good description of the perp. If someone was breaking into the
house and we were home, I'd consider the perp a home invader and act
accordingly.