In article ,
says...

On Sun, 3 Feb 2013 20:09:47 -0800 (PST), Tim
wrote:

Dick Durbin says- "Background checks will stop criminals from buying
weapons in the first place."

If they want to test the water on this, they could just open the
background check up to the public and see what response they get.
After all, if I want to sell a gun, nobody knows I have, to my
neighbor, compliance would be voluntary anyway.


Since when did following the law becomes "voluntary?"
Is that a gun nut precept?

Right now I have no way of submitting a background check even if I
wanted to. That is the loophole in the current law.

This brings up another issue. Is there a privacy issue of opening up
criminal and mental health records to any curious person who says he
might want to sell a gun to someone?
If you wanted to dig some dirt on your neighbor, just submit a
firearms background check. You could always say the sale fell through
after you got the information.

Plain ignorance there. A NICS check requires the purchaser to fill out
ATF form 4473. The only "dirt" that comes back from NICS is "Proceed,"
"Deny," or "Delay."
And if they require background checks on the federal level, they'll
probably use a version of California's example, where a trip to a FFL
and a NICS check are already required for ALL gun sales. It's a simple
matter of seller and buyer showing up at any FFL, filling out the form,
and the FFL runs the NICS check. The FFL charges 10 bucks.
There's only one problem with that. NRA and you gun nuts don't like it.
Because it makes you take responsibility for not selling your gun to a
criminal or crazy.
That removes criminals and crazy folks from you buyer pool.
Not good for sales.
Nothing to do with keeping guns away from criminals.
You gun nuts aren't fooling anybody except the gullible.
But checking all guns sales through NICS is a small part and won't
happen anyway. Need some more mass shootings and much more gun violence
to get folks irritated enough.
Might happen, might not. I suspect when and if decent folks gets fed up
with you gun nuts they will demand registration + NICS.

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 10:21:13 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

checking all guns sales through NICS

===

There are a number of problems with checking all gun sales through
NCIS:

1. Over time it becomes comparable to a national gun registration
system which is not what the founding fathers intended when they wrote
the constitution.

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

On 2/4/13 11:40 AM, Wayne B wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 10:21:13 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

checking all guns sales through NICS

===

There are a number of problems with checking all gun sales through
NCIS:

1. Over time it becomes comparable to a national gun registration
system which is not what the founding fathers intended when they wrote
the constitution.


There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents a national gun
registration system.

On Mon, 04 Feb 2013 11:44:57 -0500, ESAD wrote:

There's nothing in the Constitution that prevents a national gun
registration system.

===

Why would I want to discuss anything with someone named ESAD?

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 10:21:13 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

checking all guns sales through NICS

===

There are a number of problems with checking all gun sales through
NCIS:


That sounds like commie talk to me.
Americans overcome problems, not lay down and die.

1. Over time it becomes comparable to a national gun registration
system which is not what the founding fathers intended when they wrote
the constitution.


The Supreme Court decides that. Not you and the other gun nuts.
Registration in no way violates "keep and bear arms."
Hey....wait. The FF said nothing about keeping guns out of the hands of
murderers and psychos either.
How dare the NRA stand by and allow that travesty to occur.

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

Yeah, like the huge black market in automobiles.
Puke out that NRA kool-ade and smarten up.
Jesus Christ, since black market means illegal sales, and criminals are
illegally buying all the guns they need right now, the "thriving black
market" already exists - big time. And NRA and gun nuts refusing
tracking of guns are a big part of it.
Where on earth do you buy your logic?

On 2/4/13 1:00 PM, Boating All Out wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 10:21:13 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

checking all guns sales through NICS

===

There are a number of problems with checking all gun sales through
NCIS:


That sounds like commie talk to me.
Americans overcome problems, not lay down and die.

1. Over time it becomes comparable to a national gun registration
system which is not what the founding fathers intended when they wrote
the constitution.


The Supreme Court decides that. Not you and the other gun nuts.
Registration in no way violates "keep and bear arms."
Hey....wait. The FF said nothing about keeping guns out of the hands of
murderers and psychos either.
How dare the NRA stand by and allow that travesty to occur.

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

Yeah, like the huge black market in automobiles.
Puke out that NRA kool-ade and smarten up.
Jesus Christ, since black market means illegal sales, and criminals are
illegally buying all the guns they need right now, the "thriving black
market" already exists - big time. And NRA and gun nuts refusing
tracking of guns are a big part of it.
Where on earth do you buy your logic?





Indeed, there is NO Constitutional restriction against the registration
of firearms. If there is, show it to us. It's not there.

There is no problem with requiring that ALL gun sales of any sort be run
through NCIS. You should not be able to buy or transfer a firearm to
anyone without a background check. If more help is needed at the state
and federal level to do this, so be it. The registration fees will cover
the governmental costs, and the FFL's charge a fee to handle the paperwork.

On 2/4/2013 1:07 PM, ESAD wrote:
On 2/4/13 1:00 PM, Boating All Out wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 10:21:13 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

checking all guns sales through NICS

===

There are a number of problems with checking all gun sales through
NCIS:


That sounds like commie talk to me.
Americans overcome problems, not lay down and die.

1. Over time it becomes comparable to a national gun registration
system which is not what the founding fathers intended when they wrote
the constitution.


The Supreme Court decides that. Not you and the other gun nuts.
Registration in no way violates "keep and bear arms."
Hey....wait. The FF said nothing about keeping guns out of the hands of
murderers and psychos either.
How dare the NRA stand by and allow that travesty to occur.

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

Yeah, like the huge black market in automobiles.
Puke out that NRA kool-ade and smarten up.
Jesus Christ, since black market means illegal sales, and criminals are
illegally buying all the guns they need right now, the "thriving black
market" already exists - big time. And NRA and gun nuts refusing
tracking of guns are a big part of it.
Where on earth do you buy your logic?





Indeed, there is NO Constitutional restriction against the registration
of firearms. If there is, show it to us. It's not there.

There is no problem with requiring that ALL gun sales of any sort be run
through NCIS. You should not be able to buy or transfer a firearm to
anyone without a background check. If more help is needed at the state
and federal level to do this, so be it. The registration fees will cover
the governmental costs, and the FFL's charge a fee to handle the paperwork.
How did you dispose of the bulk of your collection? You had quite the
armament at one time.

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 12:00:28 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

Yeah, like the huge black market in automobiles.

Yep that would be one and these are huge highly regulated chunks of
metal, not something that fits in your pocket.
They still disappear without a trace, get loaded into shipping
containers for the 3d world and Russia or simply get cut up for parts.


So you're saying cars should not have VIN numbers and should not be
traceble from owner to owner through registration, because they get
stolen anyway?
Go for it. BTW, guns can't be cut up for parts.
I know, I know, you always confuse guns with cars. And saw blades.
Gun nut logic.

In article ,
says...

In article ,
says...

On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 12:00:28 -0600, Boating All Out
wrote:

2. Only law abiding citizens who have no intention of abusing their
gun rights will comply. For those with criminal intent it will still
be business as usual and a thriving black market will come into
existence.

Yeah, like the huge black market in automobiles.

Yep that would be one and these are huge highly regulated chunks of
metal, not something that fits in your pocket.
They still disappear without a trace, get loaded into shipping
containers for the 3d world and Russia or simply get cut up for parts.


So you're saying cars should not have VIN numbers and should not be
traceble from owner to owner through registration, because they get
stolen anyway?
Go for it. BTW, guns can't be cut up for parts.
I know, I know, you always confuse guns with cars. And saw blades.
Gun nut logic.

The parts of a gun can be disassembled and redistributed.

On 2/4/13 8:51 PM, wrote:
On Mon, 4 Feb 2013 18:58:31 -0500, BAR wrote:

Go for it. BTW, guns can't be cut up for parts.

The parts of a gun can be disassembled and redistributed.

Yeah, that certainly screws up all of that firearm fingerprinting
doesn't it?


So, let's not do anything because, well, it isn't easy. D'oh.