On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.

Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.

It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.

Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 20:34:37 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 10:23:08 -0700, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.

Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.

It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.

Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.


The last time we had this much of a deficit we had just won WWII. The
rest of the world was a smoking hole in the ground and we owed most of
the money to ourselves. If people wanted to buy things, they had to
buy them from us.
That is not the case now. Other countries own a good chunk of our
debt, bought with dollars we paid for their goods. We are buying more
than we sell only making the problem worse.

Yes, and thanks GWB for getting us in this spot. Thank GOD Obama isn't
beholden to corps anywhere close to how he was..

Other countries have always owned a "good chunk" of our debt. They're
buying it because it's valuable. Don't you get that? They're not going
to cut off their nose to spite their face.

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 20:34:37 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 10:23:08 -0700, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.

Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.

It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.

Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.


The last time we had this much of a deficit we had just won WWII. The
rest of the world was a smoking hole in the ground and we owed most of
the money to ourselves. If people wanted to buy things, they had to
buy them from us.
That is not the case now. Other countries own a good chunk of our
debt, bought with dollars we paid for their goods. We are buying more
than we sell only making the problem worse.

Yes, and thanks GWB for getting us in this spot. Thank GOD Obama isn't
beholden to corps anywhere close to how he was..

Obama is closer. He gave them more financial assistance.

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 20:34:37 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 10:23:08 -0700, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In ,
says...

You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.
Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.
It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.
Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.

The last time we had this much of a deficit we had just won WWII. The
rest of the world was a smoking hole in the ground and we owed most of
the money to ourselves. If people wanted to buy things, they had to
buy them from us.
That is not the case now. Other countries own a good chunk of our
debt, bought with dollars we paid for their goods. We are buying more
than we sell only making the problem worse.
Yes, and thanks GWB for getting us in this spot. Thank GOD Obama isn't
beholden to corps anywhere close to how he was..

Obama is closer. He gave them more financial assistance.

Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex


We true realistic progressives would have preferred a single-payer,
government sponsored plan, such as the one offered federal employees.

My real preference, though, is for a plan that gets rid of for-profit
health insurers. But this isn't a progressive country.

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:13:46 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:


Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex

We true realistic progressives would have preferred a single-payer,
government sponsored plan, such as the one offered federal employees.

The federal plan is still privately managed health care. These are the
choices for Maryland


http://www.opm.gov/insure/health/pla.../states/md.asp


There are many plans and a number of underwriters, but FEHBA is still
managed overall by a federal agency. That was true when I was the
marketing director of a postal plan, and it is true now. Every word in
every document that related to benefits had to be approved by the feds,
and there were a number of federal changes and vetoes before every open
season. Even so, there was no shortage of plan offerings.

In article , payer3389
@mypacks.net says...

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:13:46 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:


Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex

We true realistic progressives would have preferred a single-payer,
government sponsored plan, such as the one offered federal employees.

The federal plan is still privately managed health care. These are the
choices for Maryland


http://www.opm.gov/insure/health/pla.../states/md.asp


There are many plans and a number of underwriters, but FEHBA is still
managed overall by a federal agency. That was true when I was the
marketing director of a postal plan, and it is true now. Every word in
every document that related to benefits had to be approved by the feds,
and there were a number of federal changes and vetoes before every open
season. Even so, there was no shortage of plan offerings.

It is no different than any large employer offering a benefit plan.

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:32 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:13:46 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:

Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex
We true realistic progressives would have preferred a single-payer,
government sponsored plan, such as the one offered federal employees.

The federal plan is still privately managed health care. These are the
choices for Maryland


http://www.opm.gov/insure/health/pla.../states/md.asp

There are many plans and a number of underwriters, but FEHBA is still
managed overall by a federal agency. That was true when I was the
marketing director of a postal plan, and it is true now. Every word in
every document that related to benefits had to be approved by the feds,
and there were a number of federal changes and vetoes before every open
season. Even so, there was no shortage of plan offerings.


They are competing with Blue Cross and the rest of the for profit
companies. I didn't look at the plans but I am betting the
differences are minimal.
The "government employee" thing doesn't impress me. I am old enough to
know what Geico stands for and now that is Warren Buffett


Back when I was marketing a plan, the differences between the plans were
substantial, and the plans themselves, the feds and the old Federal
Times published charts and other comparisons that made it fairly easy to
compare prices and coverage. Not so easy to do that in the so-called
private sector.

I don't get your GEICO connection. The FEHBA program is not operated
like a casualty insurance schema.

In article , payer3389
@mypacks.net says...

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:32 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:13:46 -0400,
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:

Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex
We true realistic progressives would have preferred a single-payer,
government sponsored plan, such as the one offered federal employees.

The federal plan is still privately managed health care. These are the
choices for Maryland


http://www.opm.gov/insure/health/pla.../states/md.asp

There are many plans and a number of underwriters, but FEHBA is still
managed overall by a federal agency. That was true when I was the
marketing director of a postal plan, and it is true now. Every word in
every document that related to benefits had to be approved by the feds,
and there were a number of federal changes and vetoes before every open
season. Even so, there was no shortage of plan offerings.


They are competing with Blue Cross and the rest of the for profit
companies. I didn't look at the plans but I am betting the
differences are minimal.
The "government employee" thing doesn't impress me. I am old enough to
know what Geico stands for and now that is Warren Buffett


Back when I was marketing a plan, the differences between the plans were
substantial, and the plans themselves, the feds and the old Federal
Times published charts and other comparisons that made it fairly easy to
compare prices and coverage. Not so easy to do that in the so-called
private sector.

I don't get your GEICO connection. The FEHBA program is not operated
like a casualty insurance schema.

Harry peddled insurance!!!

In article ,
says...

On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:


wrote:
On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 20:34:37 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 10:23:08 -0700, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.

Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.

It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.

Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.


The last time we had this much of a deficit we had just won WWII. The
rest of the world was a smoking hole in the ground and we owed most of
the money to ourselves. If people wanted to buy things, they had to
buy them from us.
That is not the case now. Other countries own a good chunk of our
debt, bought with dollars we paid for their goods. We are buying more
than we sell only making the problem worse.

Yes, and thanks GWB for getting us in this spot. Thank GOD Obama isn't
beholden to corps anywhere close to how he was..

Obama is closer. He gave them more financial assistance.

Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex

Well, what did you expect when the administration let the insurance
lobby groups write the frekin' bill. I think they paid about 100 dollars
a page towards Obama's constant re-election bid..

--
Team Rowdy Mouse, Banned from the Mall for life!

On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:09:06 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 20 Apr 2011 01:33:24 -0700 (PDT), TopBassDog
wrote:


wrote:
On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 20:34:37 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 19 Apr 2011 10:23:08 -0700, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 23:57:48 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 18 Apr 2011 22:05:47 -0500, Boating All Out
wrote:

In article ,
says...


You and the boater guy still confuse debt with an asset.

Nope. I understand exactly how SS and debt work.
And I believe debt should be repaid.
You're a welsher, but just won't admit it.
Dance, dance, dance.
Won't turn a con job into a ballet.

It isn't just me. Anyone who understands basic arithmetic knows you
can't pay out more than you make for very long.

Except this isn't your credit card. It's a very complex equation with
complex equation with lots of accounting variables. While it's
certainly true that one can't pay out more than one makes for very
long, "long" is a relative term. We've had deficits for decades and
the national debt has been around since the revolution.. something on
that order. There is absolutely no reason to start foaming at the
mouth and claiming it's near term crisis. Perhaps it's a mid-term
crisis. We can start by increasing taxes on the richest Americans,
reigning in corporate tax avoidance, reducing military spending,
dealing with fraud/abuse. We should not be starting with putting this
on the backs of a struggling middle class.


The last time we had this much of a deficit we had just won WWII. The
rest of the world was a smoking hole in the ground and we owed most of
the money to ourselves. If people wanted to buy things, they had to
buy them from us.
That is not the case now. Other countries own a good chunk of our
debt, bought with dollars we paid for their goods. We are buying more
than we sell only making the problem worse.

Yes, and thanks GWB for getting us in this spot. Thank GOD Obama isn't
beholden to corps anywhere close to how he was..

Obama is closer. He gave them more financial assistance.

Obamacare is a huge corporate welfare program to the medical and
insurance complex

Firstly, there is no such thing as Obamacare. Secondly, the reason the
insurance companies love it is because of two things. The
obstructionism by the right wing and the Democrats' inability to stand
up and be counted.