On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 10:45:50 -0400, "Harold"
wrote:



It's guys like you who are dead set against the private sector succeeding.

we just give the private sector 30 years of one of the most
deregulated economies in history

how'd that work out?

The ability to conceive and deliver a product or service the consumer needs
or wants, leads to job creation and often great wealth to the creator of the
jobs. Win-Win for everyone. Until the union creeps in and removes the
incentive to work hard and EARN merit increases.

there are no unions in the US. you really DO believe all the right
wing bull**** don't you?

uh...let's see...was it unions or WALL STREET that destroyed 10
TRILLION DOLLARS in equity in the last 3 years?

WALLSTREET!

but the right wing still blames the easter bunny

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 11:58:29 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 11:02:09 -0400, "Harold"
wrote:




Health insurers do not deliver a product the consumer needs or wants.
Health care is already out there...it exists. Health insurance adds an
unnecessary middle-man factor.


You want to pay for your healthcare out of your own pocket? I suppose that's
fair.

I am curious, who's pocket do you think health care gets paid out of?

Do you really think it is sustainable to have an insurance premium or
tax that is less than the cost of care?
It is true that healthy people pay for the sick, the ones with
unhealthy lifestyles and the hypochondriacs but that is the plan isn't
it?
Medical insurance has been a huge loser for me. I suppose I will get
sick some day but so far I would have been a lot better off if I had
my premiums back and just paid my bills.

i was a hospice volunteer. you're whistling past the cemetery my
friend

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 12:23:08 -0400, "Harold"
wrote:



Now, thanks to Bam Bam, you get to pay for insuring the heretofore
uninsured and uninsurable.

yeah. we should have let 'em die. who needs the children of the poor
anyhow?

and it prevents the rich from making MORE money!

after all in the past 30 years the richest 1% have had a 500%
increase in income.

the poor deserve to die so the rich can get richer

Many of whom probably subscribe to unhealthy
lifestyles such as Alcohol-Tobacco-Drug-Firearm abuse and or obesity.

more blame the victim.

what an asshole

is any more proof needed tat the right wing HATES america?

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 11:43:16 -0400, wrote:

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 10:52:05 -0400, Harry ?
wrote:

Health insurers do not deliver a product the consumer needs or wants.
Health care is already out there...it exists. Health insurance adds an
unnecessary middle-man factor.

... and a huge government bureaucracy wouldn't?

we have the most expensive heatlthcare in the world

and it's all free market. how's that working out?

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 12:04:18 -0400, wrote:



I guess my problem with the government is their vulnerability to
fraud.

true. after all, wall street is immune to fraud isn't it?

wall street just blew away eleven trillion dollars in equity in this
country

but i'm sure fraud had nothing to do with it.

Medicare is the shining example of a low overhead way to pay
bills, when you ask but their fraud rate is a lot higher than the
private insurers.

yeah. after all we have the most expensive healthcare in the world

that shows how efficient we are, right?

For some reason our government is very susceptible
to getting robbed. (Medicare, DoD procurement, USDA programs,
whatever)

wall street however never robs anyone.

christ every time i see wall street, i think john dillinger was an
amateur

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 00:04:05 -0400, "D.Duck" wrote:


"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 22

in the last 10 years, productivity went up 30%. and NONE of that went
to the middle class

so you tell me: how does the middle class spend money it does not
have?

What is you job in the semi industry. Does it have anything at all to with
with increasing productivity or otherwise reducing cost?

yes to both. i'm a process engineer working in materials science for
equipment applications.

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 02:14:17 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 23:15:15 -0400, bpuharic wrote:

in the last 10 years, productivity went up 30%. and NONE of that went
to the middle class

Productivity went up because they laid off so many people

RING RING RING!!!

someone just rang the BULL**** ALARM!!!

uh no. for most of the last decade the economy was running at full
employment and even THEN the middle class didn't get an increase


so you tell me: how does the middle class spend money it does not
have?

You are starting to see why I fear for out future.
The idea that you can get employers to pay workers more when the
product cost can't go up is not going to happen.

and what happens when costs go DOWN? when productivity goes UP the
COGS goes DOWN.

yet NONE of that got passed to the middle class.

and the right thinks this is great

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 11:31:33 -0400, wrote:


That has not been the trend. The American public does not appreciate
quality, nor demand service.

well we DO but the right wing, under deregulation, allowed monopolies
like comcast, etc. to spring up with their '**** the consumer'
attitude.

and with 34% of americans being conservative, they're convinced that
god wants them to be poor so they can give their money to the rich


In the late 80s, IBM and most other
industries started a "quality quest" with quality circles, Six Sigma
and ISO 9000.

those programs are still active


The lesson was clear. The American public values a lower price more
than quality, service or even saving American jobs.

that's because the rich having taken ALL the increase in america's
wealth for themselves over the past 30 years, left NOTHING for the
middle class to spend.

where the hell do you get this stuff?

I ask you, do you go to Sam's/BJs/Costco? It is certainly not for the
service or even the quality. It is for the price.

yep. if i made more money i'd go elsewhere. but the right wing has
everyone convinced that the rich need to be protected and the middle
class needs to be starved into submission

you see it here with canuck telling us how worthless the middle class
is...

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 02:20:22 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 23:16:54 -0400, bpuharic wrote:

Yes I know it is different. Europe is figuring out they can't really
afford the welfare state they have created.

ROFLMAO!! and we DONT have their welfare state and are in the same
boat. japan, which has LESS govt spending than we do is in even WORSE
shape

so how does your right wing crystal ball spin THOSE facts?


Japan is easy, they never recovered from the 1990s tech bubble.

now let's see....

govt spending is wrong. proof of that is japan which has a lower govt
spending than the US and a worse economy

why am i not convinced


They also do have things like their cheap medical care program that
runs at a huge government deficit.

and we also have a large amount spent on medical care which crowds out
other spending. we are the only nation in the world to spend over 15%
on medical care

the free market has been VERY inefficient with medical care


The whole continent is looking at huge cuts in government welfare
programs.
Have you been following the news in UK? Parliament is more contentious
than it usually is.

gee. guess which country is LESS redistributionist than the US is?

could it be the UK?

Yet they are in the throws of a severe austerity program that may
become the model for the rest of the west.

ireland beat them to it.

and ireland's economy continues to collapse at a faster rate than ever

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 02:23:50 -0400, wrote:

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 23:18:00 -0400, bpuharic wrote:

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 22:53:40 -0400, wrote:




I am saying the same thing you just said. Taxes are going to go up. It
would behoove people to lock in their gains at the lower rate but if
many people try to do it, the gains will go away. That is the classic
game of chicken. I just think the cliff is in December so the question
is only, "when do you jump out of the car"?

in the last 30 years the richest 1% have had a 500% REAL increase in
income.

any reason they SHOULDNT pay more taxes?

I think they should but as long as they are pumping close to a billion
into an election cycle, the whores in DC are not going to do it.

dunno...the dems are pushing to keep the middle class tax cuts and
increase them on the rich. but the right isnt' buying it


I only have to point to the health care bill. After lots of promises
to help the little guy, the Senate let a couple of UHC lobbyists write
a bill that simply handed 20-30 million new customers into the
existing system ... at the point of a government gun.

yep. the price of closing off a right wing filibuster