On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 11:20:02 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 22 Jul 2010 23:09:40 -0700, "nom=de=plume"
wrote:

It was an education. I went to several Joint Council 65 summer outings
at the Lake of the Ozarks. Seeing these old guys who were building a
union during a depression talk about "old times" will really give you
perspective. That was when unions actually dealt with employer abuses
of the employees instead of the other way around.

You don't believe that there are major employer abuses still going on?
Perhaps they're not clubbing people, but bad things still go on.

I certainly think the unions abuse the American public and business
more than business abuses employees

since there are no unions n the US this is simply wrong

and given the fact companies regularly kill their workers...for
example, BP just killed 15 workers in houston 3 years ago...where's
your proof?

.. There are plenty of laws to
protect employees these days.

bull****. like what?

Unions tend to drive up cost and lower quality.

gee. the germans have a world class export based economy that's
HEAVILY unionized.

the US, with NO unions, is not.

more right wing bull****

These days the
strongest unions are in government and education and that is very
apparent when you see how that is working out.

like I said there are no unions in the US

We spend more on education than any other country in the world with
some of the worst outcomes. K-12 in my county spends almost $20,000
per student.

gee. we spend more on healthcare too, and it's non unionized yet you
think it's perfect because it's free market.

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 15:45:47 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 15:13:42 -0400, bpuharic wrote:


. There are plenty of laws to
protect employees these days.

bull****. like what?

For your example above OSHA

which, i suppose, is why companies can kill workers and get a slap on
the wrist.

funny how companies destroyed unions in the US and we have the most
inequitable income structure in the industrialiized world.

doesnt do much for the right wing bull**** that american workers earn
the fruits of their labors

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:38:36 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:27:19 -0400, bpuharic wrote:


doesnt do much for the right wing bull**** that american workers earn
the fruits of their labors



OSHA is far from a slap on the wrist.

really? what was the fine for the workers BP killed in houston? what
was the fine for the mine workers killed in WVA?

What would a union do?

unions were the driving force behind most worker protection
legislation of today. that includes vacations and weekends. if you
ever had a vacation or a weekend

thank the unions

On 7/23/10 5:21 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:38:36 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:27:19 -0400, wrote:


doesnt do much for the right wing bull**** that american workers earn
the fruits of their labors



OSHA is far from a slap on the wrist.

really? what was the fine for the workers BP killed in houston? what
was the fine for the mine workers killed in WVA?

What would a union do?

unions were the driving force behind most worker protection
legislation of today. that includes vacations and weekends. if you
ever had a vacation or a weekend

thank the unions


The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers. Many modern
European nations provide far more protection for their workers.

Another failure is workers' comp. Employers hide behind it, knowing the
amount of money they'll have to pay out in case fo worker injury is not
substantial. It's not easy to pursue tort cases against employers when
workers' comp is involved.

Employers consider their employees just another cheap commodity when it
comes to their safety.

From Reuters, today:

Key rig alarm disabled before blast -rig worker



Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:07pm EDT

* Alarm could have alerted crew to dangerous gas buildup

* Some key rig witnesses decline to appear before panel

By Chris Baltimore and Alyson Zepeda

HOUSTON, July 23 (Reuters) - An emergency alarm that could have warned
workers aboard the doomed Deepwater Horizon Gulf of Mexico drilling rig
was intentionally disabled, a rig engineer told U.S. investigators on
Friday.

Mike Williams, chief engineer technician aboard Swiss-based Transocean
Ltd's RIGN.S (RIG.N) rig, said the general alarm that could have
detected the cloud of flammable methane gas that enveloped the rig's
deck on April 20 was "inhibited."

"They (rig managers) did not want people woke up at three o'clock in the
morning from false alarms," Williams told a six-member federal board in
the New Orleans suburb of Kenner, Louisiana.

In article ,
says...

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:28:39 -0400, Harry ?
wrote:

The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers.

How did they do that?
I know OSHA scares the hell out of the people around here. When a "go
team" shows up in an area they inspect every job site they see and the
fines start at $1000 going up to $10,000 per violation and they always
find violations, no matter how trivial they may be.
If a guy on the job has an "expired" hard hat ... $1000. Stuff like
that. (yes hard hats have a date on them).

Harry is trying real hard to justify Unions, and deflect from the fact
that Corps need more protection from Unions than Workers need from
Corps. This is a fact he really can't dispute so he keeps throwing up
whatever talking point he thinks will stick!

--
Rowdy Mouse Racing - We race for cheese!

On 7/23/10 5:45 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:28:39 -0400, Harry
wrote:

The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers.

How did they do that?
I know OSHA scares the hell out of the people around here. When a "go
team" shows up in an area they inspect every job site they see and the
fines start at $1000 going up to $10,000 per violation and they always
find violations, no matter how trivial they may be.
If a guy on the job has an "expired" hard hat ... $1000. Stuff like
that. (yes hard hats have a date on them).


You can start he

Controversies
OSHA Under Bush
Investigations by the New York Times and Washington Post have pointed
out that the Bush administration has consistently scaled back OSHA
regulations and enforcement efforts during this decade. The changes
reflect President Bush’s vow to limit new rules and roll back what it
considered cumbersome regulations that imposed unnecessary costs on
businesses.

According to the New York Times, OSHA has issued the fewest significant
standards in its history during Bush’s two terms in office. It has
imposed only one major safety rule, and the only significant health
standard it issued was ordered by a federal court.

http://allgov.com/agency/Occupationa...ation__OSH A_


There are many well-researched articles on how the Bush Admin gutted
agencies that were supposed to help protect workers and consumers. Bush
made OSHA into a "business friendly" outfit.

On 7/23/10 5:48 PM, I am Tosk wrote:
In ,
says...

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:28:39 -0400, Harry
wrote:

The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers.

How did they do that?
I know OSHA scares the hell out of the people around here. When a "go
team" shows up in an area they inspect every job site they see and the
fines start at $1000 going up to $10,000 per violation and they always
find violations, no matter how trivial they may be.
If a guy on the job has an "expired" hard hat ... $1000. Stuff like
that. (yes hard hats have a date on them).

Harry is trying real hard to justify Unions, and deflect from the fact
that Corps need more protection from Unions than Workers need from
Corps. This is a fact he really can't dispute so he keeps throwing up
whatever talking point he thinks will stick!



You're a funny guy. You don't know your ass from a hole in the ground on
just about any matter relating to politics, history, or current events,
and you keep on proving it, over and over and over, ad nauseum.

You're an uneducated, ignorant, easily manipulated dumb****, Scotty.
You're precisely the sort of viewer that Fox News loves. Hell, you
parrot its lies and made up stories here.

You're just another right-wing, unemployed, racially stirred up bum. If
you lived in Montana or Wyoming, you'd be on a white man's hate
compound, holding up a semi-auto weapon and fornicating with sheep, just
like the rest of those boys.

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:45:03 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:28:39 -0400, Harry ?
wrote:

The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers.

How did they do that?

how about the NLRB? reagan stuffed it with right wing cronies who
destoyed ANY ability of people to fight corporations.

I know OSHA scares the hell out of the people around here.

gee. i dont know of anyone who's afraid of OSHA. certainly not BP.
they kill on a regular bassi.

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:48:02 -0400, I am Tosk
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 17:28:39 -0400, Harry ?
wrote:

The Bush Administration almost totally destroyed OSHA in terms of its
ability to go after employers in order to protect workers.

How did they do that?
I know OSHA scares the hell out of the people around here. When a "go
team" shows up in an area they inspect every job site they see and the
fines start at $1000 going up to $10,000 per violation and they always
find violations, no matter how trivial they may be.
If a guy on the job has an "expired" hard hat ... $1000. Stuff like
that. (yes hard hats have a date on them).

Harry is trying real hard to justify Unions, and deflect from the fact
that Corps need more protection from Unions than Workers need from
Corps. This is a fact he really can't dispute so he keeps throwing up
whatever talking point he thinks will stick!

gee. is that why the germans have such a competiive economy even
though thier workforce is heavily unionize? and the US has no
unions...

and what protection do companies need from unions? unions have NO
power at all. none.

corporations run the govt.

let's see...who destroyed wall street...corporations like lehman bros
or unions??

bpuharic wrote:
On Thu, 22 Jul 2010 20:05:43 -0400, wrote:


bpuharic wrote:

On Thu, 22 Jul 2010 06:42:56 -0400, wrote:



INFLATION ADJUSTED wages have not risen in 30 years

are you naturally stupid or do you practice?



Wow! You finally caught on about the "adjusted for inflation" part of
the graph you posted a dozen times


gee. so did you.. more backpedaling?



You really are dumb. Based on that graph the middle class had a rather
large increase in income.