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Okay, so here's what happened.
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Okay, so here's what happened.
|
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Steve B" wrote in message
... "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H Good on you for getting your boat back. Bad on you for taking yourself so damn long. You're lucky you got it back at all, as in that much time, it could have floated out of there, never to be seen again. A good deed to those people who were losing their business, yet had enough decency not to sell your boat for parts to the first scavenger who came along. Steve Yes. Good for being persistent and not breaking the law. You never know what really happened with those people... They may very well have intended to make things right. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:35:01 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote: "jps" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message om... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message news:cmjog5pf3q1n5mf5nongv4l517jtd4m6so@4ax .com... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. I expect, given the circumstances, the judge would be pretty lenient. If the Bigot Herring's story is accurate, he did put a lot of effort into trying to contact the shop, including two trips. If Bigot Herring's boat was on unsecured property, I think most city attorneys would think no harm, no foul. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Nov 24, 11:39*pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote:
"I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me.. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"jps" wrote in message
... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:35:01 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "jps" wrote in message . .. On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message m... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message news:2ksog59uigvdmlrfvm4eufm24srkhcq5m0@4ax. com... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message news:cmjog5pf3q1n5mf5nongv4l517jtd4m6so@4a x.com... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. I expect, given the circumstances, the judge would be pretty lenient. If the Bigot Herring's story is accurate, he did put a lot of effort into trying to contact the shop, including two trips. If Bigot Herring's boat was on unsecured property, I think most city attorneys would think no harm, no foul. Probably. I read it over again, and I didn't see a mention of it being behind a gate, so they're probably let it go. Just remember though, trespass is valid even if there's no gate. You just have to be careful. If someone saw him cutting a lock and the police showed, he'd better be able to prove it's his boat. They might let him split, but you never know. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message
... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 21:34:21 -0800, "nom=de=plume"
wrote: "jps" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:35:01 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "jps" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message om... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message news:2ksog59uigvdmlrfvm4eufm24srkhcq5m0@4ax .com... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message news:cmjog5pf3q1n5mf5nongv4l517jtd4m6so@4 ax.com... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. I expect, given the circumstances, the judge would be pretty lenient. If the Bigot Herring's story is accurate, he did put a lot of effort into trying to contact the shop, including two trips. If Bigot Herring's boat was on unsecured property, I think most city attorneys would think no harm, no foul. Probably. I read it over again, and I didn't see a mention of it being behind a gate, so they're probably let it go. Just remember though, trespass is valid even if there's no gate. You just have to be careful. If someone saw him cutting a lock and the police showed, he'd better be able to prove it's his boat. They might let him split, but you never know. Think I'd do the same thing under those circumstances but would think twice about breaking into a secured lot to recover my property. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:10:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message . .. On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:01:48 -0500, Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message om... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... I figured possession was nine-tenths and all that. I'd have felt much better getting hassled about cutting the lock off while the boat was in *my* driveway. They would have had the keys, but I could get more made. -- John H You'd be wrong. If you remove something from someone else's property without their permission, you're subject to arrest. Not when that "something" is YOUR property..... This nine-tenths business gets a lot of people in trouble who wouldn't have been if they just had some patience. Bull$hit... patience will only co$t you MANY dollar$ to recover that which i$ ALREADY YOUR$...... You can't "steal" something that you OWN...... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta You could be charged with trespassing, but unless you are a total asshole, and show the business is closed for good, and your property is there in the yard, the cop is going to go have coffee for at least 10 minutes. If it is inside a garage, he most likely will not be so accommodating. There have been a couple cases here in California, where it took up to a year go recover their property. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "jps" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message om... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message news:cmjog5pf3q1n5mf5nongv4l517jtd4m6so@4ax .com... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. -- Nom=de=Plume Judge, the property was abandoned, I could not contact the business and my very valuable boat was sitting there with electronics, etc. ripe to be looted. Since there has been no one there during business hours and the phone was disconnected, I was protecting my property. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message ... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume Tell them it was your lock and no spare key. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Bill McKee" wrote in message
... "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "jps" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message m... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message news:2ksog59uigvdmlrfvm4eufm24srkhcq5m0@4ax. com... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message news:cmjog5pf3q1n5mf5nongv4l517jtd4m6so@4a x.com... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. -- Nom=de=Plume Judge, the property was abandoned, I could not contact the business and my very valuable boat was sitting there with electronics, etc. ripe to be looted. Since there has been no one there during business hours and the phone was disconnected, I was protecting my property. Like I said, maybe. Clearly, the property wasn't abandoned, since someone was there at the end of John's story. Of course, without the complete facts, it's hard to know what would happen. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m... "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message ... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume Tell them it was your lock and no spare key. Sure thing. I've seen cases where they take the suspect in anyway. It's not uncommon. They haul in anyone and everyone, then sort it out later. I'm not sure it's worth spending the afternoon or perhaps night in common lockup. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m... "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "I am Tosk" wrote in message ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume Just state they said to come get your boat. And since the business has a phone disconnected, and no one was available during normal business hours or could be contacted, I did what they said to do. Picked up my boat. They would have to prove you were not told to pick up your own boat. The DA's have enough cases, they do not want to screw around with this crap. And also if in Calif, they have to release people from jail to reduce numbers and cost. You think the DA is going to spend any time or money on a case like this? So, you're willing to sit in jail... well, ok. Sure, you'll get out (maybe) after a hearing. With the docket crowded as it is, I'm sure you'd get out by February. -- Nom=de=Plume |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:45:42 -0500, Rob wrote:
I am Tosk wrote: In , om says... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. Have you contacted the local news and papers. This sounds like something that needs to be brought to the attention of the locals. If they are going under (sounds like it), folks should know like you to go get their boats, or any other assets they people are holding... If they file Chapter 7, the boats in the yard can be quickly returned to the owners. If they are torn apart, in the middle of a service, you are out of luck and will have to pay someone else to finish the job. If they have an account started with you, with a balance, the bankruptcy court can attempt to make you pay for the benefit of the trust. Rob - Been there, different circumstances. The guy said they'd put the stabilizer in the tank, but nothing else. If they push for it, I'll give them the $10 or whatever. No problem. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:36:24 -0500, Rob wrote:
Don White wrote: "John wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:51:38 -0600, Vic Smith wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:40:21 -0500, John wrote: Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. Sounds like they're goners anyway. Looks like you were just in time. Good move. Better see if they actually winterized your boat. --Vic I'm not taking any chances. I took it to another Yamaha guy a little further down the road, Stafford Marine. Told them what happened. Told them to winterize it, even if it had already been done. I hadn't given the Dumfries folks any money, so I'm not out anything. It just takes an extra half-hour of driving to get to this place. But, that's OK. -- John H Read that manual and winterize it yourself....... oh wait...you don't read manuals. He has a big boy outboard that they don't sell at Toys R Us. Rob And a *new* big boy outboard. Once the warranty has expired, *then* I'll start doing this stuff myself. Up until then I figure I'll help out the local marina economy. When you've got all the money I have (~snerk~), a hundred bucks once a year isn't going to hurt anything! -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:47:29 -0500, Gene
wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:37:45 -0500, Rob wrote: Personal property that is in for repair is always released prior to the auction Only so far as it is "free and clear." A less than honest mechanic can create a very convincing labor lien based on services not performed. If he is *really* clever he knows how to perfect a labor lien... if not, he'll threaten and cajole. Your MilkToast position would make you ripe for picking......... man up, dude...... again..... this isn't opinion.... I have battle scars.... I'm glad you two had this discussion. It lets me know my initial inclination was correct - to cut the damn lock and take the boat home. You know, I'm wondering now if the guy felt threatened by the bolt cutter I was carrying. That damn thing had three foot handles. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:48:07 -0500, Rob wrote:
John H wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:01:48 -0500, Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... I figured possession was nine-tenths and all that. I'd have felt much better getting hassled about cutting the lock off while the boat was in *my* driveway. They would have had the keys, but I could get more made. In this case, they had possession of the boat - not you. Under bankruptcy law, they couldn't keep it for too long. Rob No, if the guy hadn't been there to unlock the hitch lock, I'd have cut off the lock and brought it home. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:28:18 -0500, Gene
wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:13:15 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message . .. On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:48:07 -0500, Rob wrote: John H wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:01:48 -0500, Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... I figured possession was nine-tenths and all that. I'd have felt much better getting hassled about cutting the lock off while the boat was in *my* driveway. They would have had the keys, but I could get more made. In this case, they had possession of the boat - not you. Under bankruptcy law, they couldn't keep it for too long. Rob You Sooooooooo don't get it. While they held the boat, John had to sue for possession. Once he had regained possession, they had to perfect a claim on HIS boat..... Maybe you think they could get the DA to arrest John for "stealing" his own property, I think not.... You would think wrong then. Well, I'll qualify that and say the police would for sure make an arrest if there were witnesses. The DA might drop the charges, but I wouldn't want to bet on it. We'll let me assure you this..... having been there? I'll be wrong, take my chances.... and feel very sure that I'll be fine..... Now you see why I can pay no attention to her vacuous, space-cadet responses. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:43:26 -0500, Rob wrote:
Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:28:18 -0500, Gene wrote: You would think wrong then. Well, I'll qualify that and say the police would for sure make an arrest if there were witnesses. The DA might drop the charges, but I wouldn't want to bet on it. Let point to why I think you are wrong: "In criminal law, theft is the illegal taking of another person's property without that person's freely-given consent." Note: NOT " another person's property." Therefore, Not Theft! The boat wasn't on the street, it was in a locked, private, area. Rob No it wasn't. The area it was in was not fenced or locked. It was behind the back row of a strip mall. That was one of my worries, that the boat could be pilfered. I wouldn't have had to break into anything to get it. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:41:12 -0500, Rob wrote:
Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:48:07 -0500, wrote: John H wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:01:48 -0500, Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... I figured possession was nine-tenths and all that. I'd have felt much better getting hassled about cutting the lock off while the boat was in *my* driveway. They would have had the keys, but I could get more made. In this case, they had possession of the boat - not you. Under bankruptcy law, they couldn't keep it for too long. Rob You Sooooooooo don't get it. While they held the boat, John had to sue for possession. Once he had regained possession, they had to perfect a claim on HIS boat..... Maybe you think they could get the DA to arrest John for "stealing" his own property, I think not.... Wrong - unless the law varies by state (I don't believe it does). I've witnessed this first-hand. There is a designated time frame where the owners of property that is in for repair can claim it, and take it, with proper documentation. Rob I had the title with me, just in case. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"John H" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:36:24 -0500, Rob wrote: Don White wrote: "John wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:51:38 -0600, Vic Smith wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:40:21 -0500, John wrote: Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. Sounds like they're goners anyway. Looks like you were just in time. Good move. Better see if they actually winterized your boat. --Vic I'm not taking any chances. I took it to another Yamaha guy a little further down the road, Stafford Marine. Told them what happened. Told them to winterize it, even if it had already been done. I hadn't given the Dumfries folks any money, so I'm not out anything. It just takes an extra half-hour of driving to get to this place. But, that's OK. -- John H Read that manual and winterize it yourself....... oh wait...you don't read manuals. He has a big boy outboard that they don't sell at Toys R Us. Rob And a *new* big boy outboard. Once the warranty has expired, *then* I'll start doing this stuff myself. Up until then I figure I'll help out the local marina economy. When you've got all the money I have (~snerk~), a hundred bucks once a year isn't going to hurt anything! -- John H Yup...Uncle Sam has always taken good care of you and what thanks does he receive in return??? |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 22:45:38 -0800, "Bill McKee"
wrote: "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "I am Tosk" wrote in message ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume Just state they said to come get your boat. And since the business has a phone disconnected, and no one was available during normal business hours or could be contacted, I did what they said to do. Picked up my boat. They would have to prove you were not told to pick up your own boat. The DA's have enough cases, they do not want to screw around with this crap. And also if in Calif, they have to release people from jail to reduce numbers and cost. You think the DA is going to spend any time or money on a case like this? Damn. I can't believe y'all stayed up until 1:45 AM arguing (discussing) my boat problems. If I'd been here, I could have corrected a couple assumptions. I would not have 'broken and entered' anyplace. The boat was accessible to the public, if the public drove behind the shop. No gate, no chain, no nothing. The only thing preventing the removal of the boat was a Master padlock on the hitch, which I was about to cut. I suppose, if a cop had come by, he could have hassled me. That's why I took the title of the boat with me, and the extra set of keys. I don't think the cop would have said much. I find it hard to believe that *anyone* would waste time discussing this issue with the Plum. WAFJ! -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:39:20 -0800, "Steve B"
wrote: "John H" wrote in message .. . On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H Good on you for getting your boat back. Bad on you for taking yourself so damn long. You're lucky you got it back at all, as in that much time, it could have floated out of there, never to be seen again. A good deed to those people who were losing their business, yet had enough decency not to sell your boat for parts to the first scavenger who came along. Steve I'm just a nice guy who believes in supporting the local economy. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:40:27 -0800, "Steve B"
wrote: "Don White" wrote Read that manual and winterize it yourself....... oh wait...you don't read manuals. Probably doesn't have the thirty minutes it takes to "winterize". Steve Explained above, although the little guy has no business commenting on it. He should be spending his time in a worthwhile engagement, like this: http://tinyurl.com/o42at Maybe he could get the Plum to join him. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"John H" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:43:26 -0500, Rob wrote: Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:28:18 -0500, Gene wrote: You would think wrong then. Well, I'll qualify that and say the police would for sure make an arrest if there were witnesses. The DA might drop the charges, but I wouldn't want to bet on it. Let point to why I think you are wrong: "In criminal law, theft is the illegal taking of another person's property without that person's freely-given consent." Note: NOT " another person's property." Therefore, Not Theft! The boat wasn't on the street, it was in a locked, private, area. Rob No it wasn't. The area it was in was not fenced or locked. It was behind the back row of a strip mall. That was one of my worries, that the boat could be pilfered. I wouldn't have had to break into anything to get it. -- John H Well this is a different scenario that we were led to believe. In this case I would have gone in and recovered my property too...assuming it was on 'common tenant ground' behind a mall. I'd claim they abandoned it. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Bill McKee" wrote in message m... "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message ... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message .. . On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume Tell them it was your lock and no spare key. So.. Kalif Swill advocates lying to the police. That's a good way to get yourself shoved down a staircase....right Snotty? |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On 11/25/09 7:52 AM, Don White wrote:
"John wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:43:26 -0500, wrote: Gene wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 20:28:18 -0500, Gene wrote: You would think wrong then. Well, I'll qualify that and say the police would for sure make an arrest if there were witnesses. The DA might drop the charges, but I wouldn't want to bet on it. Let point to why I think you are wrong: "In criminal law, theft is the illegal taking of another person's property without that person's freely-given consent." Note: NOT " another person's property." Therefore, Not Theft! The boat wasn't on the street, it was in a locked, private, area. Rob No it wasn't. The area it was in was not fenced or locked. It was behind the back row of a strip mall. That was one of my worries, that the boat could be pilfered. I wouldn't have had to break into anything to get it. -- John H Well this is a different scenario that we were led to believe. In this case I would have gone in and recovered my property too...assuming it was on 'common tenant ground' behind a mall. I'd claim they abandoned it. So...there's no chance herring might be arrested? Too bad. -- If you are flajim, herring, loogy, GC boater, johnson, topbassdog, rob, achmed the sock puppet, or one of a half dozen others, you're wasting your time by trying to *communicate* with me through rec.boats, because, well, you are among the permanent members of my dumbfoch dumpster, and I don't read the vomit you post, except by accident on occasion. As always, have a nice, simple-minded day. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
|
Okay, so here's what happened.
|
Okay, so here's what happened.
JustWaitAFrekinMinute! wrote:
On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? Ridiculous scenario, remember? |
Okay, so here's what happened.
Bill McKee wrote:
"nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message ... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume Tell them it was your lock and no spare key. The lock on the hitch was, most likely John's property. This plume character is getting dippier by the minute. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Gene" wrote in message It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Thomas Sowell must have been aquainted with Em, AKA Nom-Duh-Plume. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
Bill McKee wrote:
"nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "jps" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 18:22:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Here's a thought exercise for you... DA: Did you or did you not enter SoSo's property without permission? He didn't respond to my phone calls and during three visits to the property during business hours, he was not on the premises. The premises appeared to have been abandoned and I didn't want my boat to be interpretted as abandoned. Gene: It was my boat. DA: Non-responsive. Would the court please direct the witness to answer the question. Judge: Answer the question. Gene: Yes. DA: Did you damage SoSo's property in the act of removing the boat from said property? I had full intention of reimbursing SoSo's cost of the security device, if I could *find a way to get a hold of him.* Judge: Well Gene, seems like you took matters into your own hands and normally we'd frown on such an act. But under the circumstances I understand your concern and think you conducted yourself in a reasonable manner. We'll drop all charges when you've made restitution to the scum bag who didn't bother to call you to let you know they were going under. Maybe... it would have to be pretty obviously abandoned property. A few calls and a few tries probably wouldn't be enough. You can't break laws to prevent someone else from breaking the law. Also, using "intention" as a defense might work, but lots of people claim that... it wasn't my "intention" to kill him, but my hand slipped and the gun went off. -- Nom=de=Plume Judge, the property was abandoned, I could not contact the business and my very valuable boat was sitting there with electronics, etc. ripe to be looted. Since there has been no one there during business hours and the phone was disconnected, I was protecting my property. If Nom is such a hot shot legal advisor, why is he/she/it selling used clothing over the internet for a living. If she is the advocate of the down trodden, that she says she is, she would be walking the streets handing out the stuff to those that need it. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
Bill McKee wrote:
"nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "I am Tosk" wrote in message ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume Just state they said to come get your boat. And since the business has a phone disconnected, and no one was available during normal business hours or could be contacted, I did what they said to do. Picked up my boat. They would have to prove you were not told to pick up your own boat. The DA's have enough cases, they do not want to screw around with this crap. And also if in Calif, they have to release people from jail to reduce numbers and cost. You think the DA is going to spend any time or money on a case like this? Exactly. Bill, You sure do have your share of quacks over in the Quake state and "thereabouts". (Can't leave out JPS) |
Okay, so here's what happened.
John H wrote:
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:36:24 -0500, Rob wrote: Don White wrote: "John wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:51:38 -0600, Vic Smith wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:40:21 -0500, John wrote: Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. Sounds like they're goners anyway. Looks like you were just in time. Good move. Better see if they actually winterized your boat. --Vic I'm not taking any chances. I took it to another Yamaha guy a little further down the road, Stafford Marine. Told them what happened. Told them to winterize it, even if it had already been done. I hadn't given the Dumfries folks any money, so I'm not out anything. It just takes an extra half-hour of driving to get to this place. But, that's OK. -- John H Read that manual and winterize it yourself....... oh wait...you don't read manuals. He has a big boy outboard that they don't sell at Toys R Us. Rob And a *new* big boy outboard. Once the warranty has expired, *then* I'll start doing this stuff myself. Up until then I figure I'll help out the local marina economy. When you've got all the money I have (~snerk~), a hundred bucks once a year isn't going to hurt anything! When it comes time to DIY be sure to consult with Donnie and the Plum. Donny has a little rope pull kicker and the plum once owned half interest in a 14 ft hobie. Glad you got your boat back without undue problems. |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 08:15:27 -0500, Jim wrote:
Bill McKee wrote: "nom=de=plume" wrote in message ... "JustWaitAFrekinMinute!" wrote in message ... On Nov 24, 11:39 pm, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "I am Tosk" wrote in ... In article , says... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:09:12 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "Gene" wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:34:53 -0800, "nom=de=plume" wrote: "John H" wrote in message ... On 27 October I took my boat in to get the oils changed and engine winterized. Also wanted them to check the alternator. Told them, Dumfries Marine, that they could take their time as I'd be out of town for a few days. I got back in town after a trip to NC, and saw no message on the machine from them. Didn't worry. Waited another week, but still had heard nothing. Finally, around 9 November, I'm thinking they should have called, so I call them. No answer. Leave a message. Next day same thing. I call, no answer, leave message. I did this every day that week. I try over the weekend - nothing. The next week comes and I start by calling them on Monday, that's 16 Nov. No answer. Tuesday AM I drive to Dumfries to see what the hell is happening. No one around (at about 10:30), no sign on door, no nothing. My boat is behind the building with a padlock on the hitch, but other than that there is no security. Wednesday I call again, nothing. I drive down Thursday, and again on Saturday morning. Nothing. Yesterday AM I call and get a recording that the phone's been disconnected. ****. I call the Dumfries Police. Explain what's happened. They try to call and get the answer machine. The 'disconnected' recording was a fluke, or I misdialed. Don't know. The police said they'd check things out and get back to me. They also said I might have to take the matter to civil court as they have no report of a crime. I tell them that as far as I'm concerned my boat's been stolen. They never got back to me. This morning I rent the biggest bolt cutter the rental place can provide. Costs me ten bucks. I'm off to get my damn boat. When I get there I see a pickup backed up to the door and a bunch of stuff loaded in the back. I try the door and it's open. I yell and someone replies. Turns out to be one of the two brothers who run the place. I ask what the hell's going on. He shrugs, but doesn't answer. I ask if they're still in business. Another shrug. Finally I tell him I want my damn boat. He hands me the keys. When I ask him why he hasn't called, his response is, "Personal problems." Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. -- John H It's probably pretty good that you didn't act on getting your boat with the bolt cutters. Even though it was your boat, you could be charged with trespass, breaking/entering, perhaps property damage, and God knows what else. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt. John's actions were BY FAR the best approach. To assume that our court system works is to engage in a fool's errand. You will spend forever engaged in placating the system and paying obscene amounts to attorneys.... with unpredictable results, at best. When faced with this sort of issue.... a wise individual seeks forgiveness, NOT permission..... -- It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance. -Thomas Sowell Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC. Homepage http://pamandgene.tranquilrefuge.net/boating/the_boat/my_boat.htm Forté Agent 6.00 Build 1186 Beta No problem if you don't mind spending a couple of days in jail while they sort it out, and it's still illegal to damage property, trespass, etc. Been there, done that..... by the rules..... (which in hindsight and with knowledge of the law) was really stupid. Knowing what I know, now..... and with previous counsel of attorneys..... John was prepared to take the ONLY sane WISE course of action available to him. Pretend you are the DA.... tell me why you are arresting me for "stealing" property for which I have a Certificate of Title. Want to try to make that breaking and entering charge stick without proof? Try me, I'll have your ass...... Really. John didn't get any information from them telling him not to take his boat. He just went to grab his boat, that's all. Nope... Permission needs to be explicit. Not giving permission is implied by said lock. -- Nom=de=Plume- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Uh, what lock? The lock on the hitch I believe. -- Nom=de=Plume Tell them it was your lock and no spare key. The lock on the hitch was, most likely John's property. This plume character is getting dippier by the minute. No, it was their lock. But, your statement stands. Dippier is a good description. A real lippy, dippy lib. -- John H |
Okay, so here's what happened.
"Rob" wrote in message
... If they file Chapter 7, the boats in the yard can be quickly returned to the owners. If they are torn apart, in the middle of a service, you are out of luck and will have to pay someone else to finish the job. If they have an account started with you, with a balance, the bankruptcy court can attempt to make you pay for the benefit of the trust. Rob - Been there, different circumstances. It depends on what you consider to be "quickly". In many cases a Chapter 7 filing ... voluntary or involuntary ... results in all the assets and property (owned by the business or not) being held until the bankruptcy court plows through all the records. It can take months. I had a similar experience to John's a few years back in Florida. I had a Scout stored at a boat yard storage and repair place. The bank called a note on them and they were forced into Chapter 7. There was no direct notice to those of us with boats at the yard. Similar to John, I became suspicious when I could no longer contact them. I took a ride to the yard only to find it locked up with a steel gate that was padlocked. I sat there for a while in my truck and noticed a van pull up, unlock the gate and pulled into the yard. I quickly pulled up behind him and entered as well. The guy in the van got out and started yelling at me that they were "closed". By this time the situation was clear in my mind, so I pulled my truck around him and backed it up to my boat and trailer. Told him I was taking my boat. He said I couldn't .. they were "bankrupt" and everything in the yard had been frozen by the court. He ran into the building to call somebody. Meanwhile, I noticed that the trailer had a flat tire. Another guy came out and helped me put a little air in the tire and he then got the keys to the van and moved it. Apparently he didn't realize what was going on. I dragged the boat/trailer out of the yard to the nearest gas station to fill up the tire and then headed home. Checked the local "legal notices" for the town and discovered they were in bankruptcy. Never heard from them again. Eisboch |
Okay, so here's what happened.
On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 08:38:45 -0500, Jim wrote:
John H wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 19:36:24 -0500, Rob wrote: Don White wrote: "John wrote in message ... On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 15:51:38 -0600, Vic Smith wrote: On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:40:21 -0500, John wrote: Anyway, I get my boat and go. Last time I go there for anything. Sounds like they're goners anyway. Looks like you were just in time. Good move. Better see if they actually winterized your boat. --Vic I'm not taking any chances. I took it to another Yamaha guy a little further down the road, Stafford Marine. Told them what happened. Told them to winterize it, even if it had already been done. I hadn't given the Dumfries folks any money, so I'm not out anything. It just takes an extra half-hour of driving to get to this place. But, that's OK. -- John H Read that manual and winterize it yourself....... oh wait...you don't read manuals. He has a big boy outboard that they don't sell at Toys R Us. Rob And a *new* big boy outboard. Once the warranty has expired, *then* I'll start doing this stuff myself. Up until then I figure I'll help out the local marina economy. When you've got all the money I have (~snerk~), a hundred bucks once a year isn't going to hurt anything! When it comes time to DIY be sure to consult with Donnie and the Plum. Donny has a little rope pull kicker and the plum once owned half interest in a 14 ft hobie. Glad you got your boat back without undue problems. Thanks, and I'll be sure to do that. I think, between them, they've got all the sense God gave one goose - and a Canada goose at that. -- John H |
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