nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
"Bill wrote in message
m...

wrote in message
...
wrote in message
...
...will last until the union or the government figures out a way to
stop it.

" Ford is also running into resistance from its unionized work force
as it tries to cut costs further.

Its improving fortunes were the main reason cited by the United
Automobile Workers on Monday for rejecting another round of labor
concessions that would have roughly matched concessions that workers
at Chrysler and General Motors approved in the spring."

The U.A.W.'s president, Ron Gettelfinger, and its vice president in
charge of the Ford unit, Bob King, said in a statement that the
carmaker's third-quarter profit was "evidence of the contributions
that Ford workers have made.""

http://tinyurl.com/ya4pyay


Why should they cave to demands from management? How about producing
decent products that people want to buy?

--
Nom=de=Plume


They are decent products. But if you are paying some low skilled
laborer
excess money, then the decent product is priced out of the market.

Then, when the contract expires the company should seek to renegotiate.
It
takes two parties to make a contract. If there's good management in
place,
then the union members will feel better about consessions.


They should be at-will employees, each accountable for their hard work
and
dedication to the product they make and the company that employs them.
Union crap like seniority, and other entitlements, only penalize the
hard
workers. The payroll and overhead of the union organizers would land
right into the pockets of the workers if they had any self respect.
They
are ****ing away millions in dues in order for some to be slackers who
just happened to be on the job a few years earlier than the rest.

-S


I agree. They should be, but since management was so bad for so long,
that's
not going to happen any time soon.

As is the normal practice, they can and should attempt to renegotiate the
terms. You do believe in negotiation don't you? Or, do you think a lock
out
will work?


In a democratic society of people who can think for themselves, the
negotiation process typically takes place as a one-on-one interview - not
a wholesale demand for a pay increase without regard for individual
performance. In that case, the slackers win and the motivated lose.

-S


So, you're saying that each individual worker should negotiate with
management about health, safety, employment practices, benefits, etc.? Talk
about bringing a company to a standstill....

As with the rest of our country, the union members elected their leadership
for better or worse. This is called a representative democracy.



No. The process should take place like any other non-union company.
Salary is negotiated, the benefits are in the employee manual. There is
already government oversight for safety. If you have ever worked a
non-union job you understand.

-S

"Stevie" wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
"Bill wrote in message
m...

wrote in message
...
wrote in message
...
...will last until the union or the government figures out a way
to
stop it.

" Ford is also running into resistance from its unionized work
force
as it tries to cut costs further.

Its improving fortunes were the main reason cited by the United
Automobile Workers on Monday for rejecting another round of labor
concessions that would have roughly matched concessions that
workers
at Chrysler and General Motors approved in the spring."

The U.A.W.'s president, Ron Gettelfinger, and its vice president
in
charge of the Ford unit, Bob King, said in a statement that the
carmaker's third-quarter profit was "evidence of the contributions
that Ford workers have made.""

http://tinyurl.com/ya4pyay


Why should they cave to demands from management? How about
producing
decent products that people want to buy?

--
Nom=de=Plume


They are decent products. But if you are paying some low skilled
laborer
excess money, then the decent product is priced out of the market.

Then, when the contract expires the company should seek to
renegotiate.
It
takes two parties to make a contract. If there's good management in
place,
then the union members will feel better about consessions.


They should be at-will employees, each accountable for their hard work
and
dedication to the product they make and the company that employs them.
Union crap like seniority, and other entitlements, only penalize the
hard
workers. The payroll and overhead of the union organizers would land
right into the pockets of the workers if they had any self respect.
They
are ****ing away millions in dues in order for some to be slackers who
just happened to be on the job a few years earlier than the rest.

-S


I agree. They should be, but since management was so bad for so long,
that's
not going to happen any time soon.

As is the normal practice, they can and should attempt to renegotiate
the
terms. You do believe in negotiation don't you? Or, do you think a lock
out
will work?


In a democratic society of people who can think for themselves, the
negotiation process typically takes place as a one-on-one interview -
not
a wholesale demand for a pay increase without regard for individual
performance. In that case, the slackers win and the motivated lose.

-S


So, you're saying that each individual worker should negotiate with
management about health, safety, employment practices, benefits, etc.?
Talk
about bringing a company to a standstill....

As with the rest of our country, the union members elected their
leadership
for better or worse. This is called a representative democracy.



No. The process should take place like any other non-union company.
Salary is negotiated, the benefits are in the employee manual. There is
already government oversight for safety. If you have ever worked a
non-union job you understand.

-S


Look up the word union. The workers empower the union leadership to
negotiate on their behalf. That's how it works in a union shop.

If you ever worked in a union, you'd know this.


--
Nom=de=Plume

"Stevie" wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
wrote in message
...
nom=de=plume wrote:
"Bill wrote in message
m...

wrote in message
...
wrote in message
...
...will last until the union or the government figures out a way
to
stop it.

" Ford is also running into resistance from its unionized work
force
as it tries to cut costs further.

Its improving fortunes were the main reason cited by the United
Automobile Workers on Monday for rejecting another round of labor
concessions that would have roughly matched concessions that
workers
at Chrysler and General Motors approved in the spring."

The U.A.W.'s president, Ron Gettelfinger, and its vice president
in
charge of the Ford unit, Bob King, said in a statement that the
carmaker's third-quarter profit was "evidence of the contributions
that Ford workers have made.""

http://tinyurl.com/ya4pyay


Why should they cave to demands from management? How about
producing
decent products that people want to buy?

--
Nom=de=Plume


They are decent products. But if you are paying some low skilled
laborer
excess money, then the decent product is priced out of the market.

Then, when the contract expires the company should seek to
renegotiate.
It
takes two parties to make a contract. If there's good management in
place,
then the union members will feel better about consessions.


They should be at-will employees, each accountable for their hard work
and
dedication to the product they make and the company that employs them.
Union crap like seniority, and other entitlements, only penalize the
hard
workers. The payroll and overhead of the union organizers would land
right into the pockets of the workers if they had any self respect.
They
are ****ing away millions in dues in order for some to be slackers who
just happened to be on the job a few years earlier than the rest.

-S


I agree. They should be, but since management was so bad for so long,
that's
not going to happen any time soon.

As is the normal practice, they can and should attempt to renegotiate
the
terms. You do believe in negotiation don't you? Or, do you think a lock
out
will work?


In a democratic society of people who can think for themselves, the
negotiation process typically takes place as a one-on-one interview -
not
a wholesale demand for a pay increase without regard for individual
performance. In that case, the slackers win and the motivated lose.

-S


So, you're saying that each individual worker should negotiate with
management about health, safety, employment practices, benefits, etc.?
Talk
about bringing a company to a standstill....

As with the rest of our country, the union members elected their
leadership
for better or worse. This is called a representative democracy.



No. The process should take place like any other non-union company.
Salary is negotiated, the benefits are in the employee manual. There is
already government oversight for safety. If you have ever worked a
non-union job you understand.

-S

Unions have their place. But they have become extortionists. The worst are
the "Public Service Employee unions". A union dealing with a private
company has to weigh income and expenses of the company. Raise the cost of
labor too high, and the company fails. They have done that to a few
companies, and the union threw a party to celebrate. The workers were told
they won, but the workers were no longer workers. Public Service Employee
Unions do not give a crap about costs. They figure government can always
raise taxes to pay them. Prime examples are the Prison Guards in
California. Making 2-3x what a teacher makes. BART the Bay area transit
district. They were going on strike for more money earlier this year.
While ridership was falling because of unemployment, and getting cheaper
drive than take BART. They were not going to give up anything. $58k for a
janitor. And you have inside and outside janitors. And if the area is
clean, they do not go work on the other side. $80k for a train driver.
Plus excessive benefits.