wrote:
On Wed, 09 Sep 2009 15:05:53 -0400, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote:

The left has taken to calling Afghanistan "Obama's Vietnam." Well, if
we're going to let troops die as part of a PR stunt, then yes, it does
begin to resemble Vietnam.

Either we're going to give our troops every advantage in an effort to
allow them to win or we should, in fact, get out. If Obama has in mind
a Nixon-style "decent interval" where we are going to let troops be
killed in an effort not to win a war but to simply contrive a
politically-palatable "defeat with honor," then get them out of there.


I say, get them out of there. We have nothing to gain by staying.

If we really wanted to get Bin Laden the best way would have been to
ignore him until he stuck his head up and then just send in a small
team to shoot him.
We should have bombed Afghanistan with school supplies and other aid
after the Soviets left. They would have handed Bin Laden's head to us
on a plate.

I really wonder how much of this is driven by women's rights groups
and drug warriors.

Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:01:05 -0700, Jim wrote:



Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

Sounds interesting. Ever hear of "The Ugly American?"
Read that in the early '60's.
Basically about the commie threat in VN and playing local culture in a
human, understanding way.
One part I remembered being impressed with was how the hero American
noted that the village women got hunchbacks as they aged - because
they were using short reed brooms to sweep.
He attached long sticks to the reeds to modernize their cleaning
habits and prevent future hunchbacking.
Though ugly physically, the hero was beautiful in thought and motive.
Later as I became educated I saw that though there are different
cultures, most humans are pretty much the same.
Thinking back to that book I realized the broom stuff was pure
bull**** - and condescending.
In the theme of the book it wasn't meant to be.
But it was.
The biggest danger in trying to change a culture is condescension.
Folks don't take kindly to that. And arrogance can make it hard to
recognize in oneself.
That's why I stay away from interfering or resisting other cultures,
but just try to appreciate what I can.
Maybe it can work when the locals go outside and come back to do it
themselves.
But I'm not much for nation building. Except by example.

--Vic

Vic Smith wrote:
On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:01:05 -0700, Jim wrote:


Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

Sounds interesting. Ever hear of "The Ugly American?"
Read that in the early '60's.
Basically about the commie threat in VN and playing local culture in a
human, understanding way.
One part I remembered being impressed with was how the hero American
noted that the village women got hunchbacks as they aged - because
they were using short reed brooms to sweep.
He attached long sticks to the reeds to modernize their cleaning
habits and prevent future hunchbacking.
Though ugly physically, the hero was beautiful in thought and motive.
Later as I became educated I saw that though there are different
cultures, most humans are pretty much the same.
Thinking back to that book I realized the broom stuff was pure
bull**** - and condescending.
In the theme of the book it wasn't meant to be.
But it was.
The biggest danger in trying to change a culture is condescension.
Folks don't take kindly to that. And arrogance can make it hard to
recognize in oneself.
That's why I stay away from interfering or resisting other cultures,
but just try to appreciate what I can.
Maybe it can work when the locals go outside and come back to do it
themselves.
But I'm not much for nation building. Except by example.

--Vic

Since you can buy a used one for $4.85, I'd say it was money well spent.
This book IS about defeating the Taliban and how to actually win in
Afghanistan.

http://www.amazon.com/Three-Cups-Tea...2624677&sr=1-1

On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:01:05 -0700, Jim wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 09 Sep 2009 15:05:53 -0400, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote:

The left has taken to calling Afghanistan "Obama's Vietnam." Well, if
we're going to let troops die as part of a PR stunt, then yes, it does
begin to resemble Vietnam.

Either we're going to give our troops every advantage in an effort to
allow them to win or we should, in fact, get out. If Obama has in mind
a Nixon-style "decent interval" where we are going to let troops be
killed in an effort not to win a war but to simply contrive a
politically-palatable "defeat with honor," then get them out of there.


I say, get them out of there. We have nothing to gain by staying.

If we really wanted to get Bin Laden the best way would have been to
ignore him until he stuck his head up and then just send in a small
team to shoot him.
We should have bombed Afghanistan with school supplies and other aid
after the Soviets left. They would have handed Bin Laden's head to us
on a plate.

I really wonder how much of this is driven by women's rights groups
and drug warriors.

Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

Could easily defeat the Taliban and al Qaeda with this method. But we
don't make any money if we don't sell bombs and bullets. It's our
national franchise!

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:57:09 -0700, jps wrote:

If we really wanted to get Bin Laden the best way would have been to
ignore him until he stuck his head up and then just send in a small
team to shoot him.
We should have bombed Afghanistan with school supplies and other aid
after the Soviets left. They would have handed Bin Laden's head to us
on a plate.

I really wonder how much of this is driven by women's rights groups
and drug warriors.

Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

Could easily defeat the Taliban and al Qaeda with this method. But we
don't make any money if we don't sell bombs and bullets. It's our
national franchise!

These days, arms are about the only thing we build here for export.
Hell, the Chinese are even knocking off our M-14s and M-16s.


?? Something has changed..

$1.283 trillion f.o.b. (2008)

industrial supplies, 29.8%; production machinery, 29.5%; non-auto consumer
goods, 12.4%; motor vehicles and parts, 9.3%; food, feed and beverages,
8.3%; aircraft and parts, 6.6%; other, 4.1%. (2008)

--
Nom=de=Plume

"Jim" wrote in message
m...
wrote:
On Wed, 09 Sep 2009 15:05:53 -0400, Tom Francis - SWSports
wrote:

The left has taken to calling Afghanistan "Obama's Vietnam." Well, if
we're going to let troops die as part of a PR stunt, then yes, it does
begin to resemble Vietnam.

Either we're going to give our troops every advantage in an effort to
allow them to win or we should, in fact, get out. If Obama has in mind
a Nixon-style "decent interval" where we are going to let troops be
killed in an effort not to win a war but to simply contrive a
politically-palatable "defeat with honor," then get them out of there.


I say, get them out of there. We have nothing to gain by staying.

If we really wanted to get Bin Laden the best way would have been to
ignore him until he stuck his head up and then just send in a small
team to shoot him.
We should have bombed Afghanistan with school supplies and other aid
after the Soviets left. They would have handed Bin Laden's head to us
on a plate.

I really wonder how much of this is driven by women's rights groups
and drug warriors.

Ever read the book, "Three Cups of Tea?" That's exactly what the author
did, bomb them with schools and supplies.

A well worth read. Should be read by those who disagree, though.

Friend and sorority sister of my wife started and runs
http://www.wwwunited.org/
Send some support to them. Josie has had some interesting experiences
Middle East.