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headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
RichH brought forth on stone tablets:
This somewhat depends on halyard geometry. You see some setups where the halyard leads at an angle from the foil. This is good for minimizing halyard wraps but pulls the end of the foil against the stay. ........ *******Not talking about lead angles of the top swivel to halyard sheeve.... but the deflection of the torlon bealls under extreme compressive load from extreme halyard tension; hence, the tendency to begin to jam or add a lot of friction. My recent Harken starts to jam when at extreme halyard loads. But then again 'kroozers' have no idea that it takes halyard strain to 'shape' a sail so its probably a non-issue for those who simply 'just raise' a sail. I release the tension on my new sail ********Damn good idea as 'creep' (permanent elastic deformation) is what eventually 'kills' the shape of a sail. I had luff foam put in which I'm told has gone out of style but does seem to do a good job of increasing the amount that can be rolled up. I will probably switch to the working jib if knowingly facing a long beat in 25 knot plus conditions but I wouldn't make the switch just for traveling. With the third reef I had put in the main and a touch of power, I should be able to handle anything with the 135% that is likely to come up unexpectedly. ******* The newer modern cutting programs (with "S" curve luff hollow profiles) have mostly obsoleted the need for foam luffs ... although on a BIG sail you still sometimes need a wee bit of foam luff to 'help' the partly furled shape - still 30% reduction is about as good as it gets; and, that assumes that one knows how to set the correct backstay/headstay tension to match the actual 'luff hollow' that is cut into the headsail when its fully wind-loaded BTW I had a dock neighbor very interested in my fuel system yesterday. He takes fishing parties out so is one of the few people still using much fuel. He said that so few people are buying fuel that lots of people are getting poor fuel because the long hoses are sitting out in the sun for much longer periods. The fuel polisher in Portland evidently is no longer in business this year. Yup, the higher hose temps are good breeding grounds for those fungals that thrive in #2. Those 'filters' on the delivery hoses do nothing to stop the 'spores' and 'buds' of the fungals/bacteria. The filters there are mostly for 'rocks, sticks and feathers'. If possible, I only buy fuel from a marina as the very last resort; Id rather 'jug it' from a truck stop as the chances of fresh uncontaminated fuel is much much less. :-) It's also almost universally cheaper. Here in Seattle, I am saving more than $1/gallon by jugging it. bob s/v Eolian Seattle |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
"RichH" wrote
If possible, I only buy fuel from a marina as the very last resort; Id rather 'jug it' from a truck stop as the chances of fresh uncontaminated fuel is much much less. :-) That's what I'm doing. I've got enough on board to motor for 75% of my planned route so I shouldn't need to re-fuel this cruise. -- Roger Long |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.
Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is usually in front of the mast. |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
On 2008-08-11 13:22:54 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said:
In article , Dave wrote: That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking a second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in. Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward. Typically, it improves the boat's balance and unloads the helm somewhat. If a particular boat picks up lee helm, the rules are different of course. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
In article ,
Dave wrote: On Mon, 11 Aug 2008 12:22:54 -0500, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said: That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking a second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in. Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward. Not really. With an outboard rudder, the boat has a bit of weather helm when seriously heeled. Reefing the main gets it back on its feet with a fairly balanced helm. I've never sailed a boat this size with an outboard rudder. Is that what's doing it (or preventing it)? I would think that most boats when seriously heeled have weather helm. I was out today in 20 kts with 25 gusts. My boat is fairly well balanced and takes minimal effort. It's a masthead rig. We sailed with a small working jib and one reef in the main. She would heel, give some slight weather helm, start to round up, then correct and get back in the groove without helm intervention (or at least not much.. two finger control). |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
In article ,
RichH wrote: Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward. Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is usually in front of the mast. With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm. This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of weather helm vs. lee helm. |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
In article 2008081121315716807-jerelull@maccom,
Jere Lull wrote: On 2008-08-11 13:22:54 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said: In article , Dave wrote: That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking a second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in. Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward. Typically, it improves the boat's balance and unloads the helm somewhat. If a particular boat picks up lee helm, the rules are different of course. It sure wouldn't on my boat, especially in 20+ air. I typically sail with a single reef in the main and a full masthead (working) jib (it has a high foot). |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
On 2008-08-12 01:14:53 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said:
In article , RichH wrote: Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward. Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is usually in front of the mast. With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm. This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of weather helm vs. lee helm. As I recall, cutter rigs place the the mast further aft. What's determines "helm" is the balance among the CEs of the sails, keel, and hull. -- Jere Lull Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/ Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/ |
headsail furlers -the good, the bad and the ugly...sound off!
With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm.
This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of weather helm vs. lee helm. On most 'true' cutters (not double headed sloops where the mast is further forward) the combined CE is properly located above the CLR ..... But then again the CE is a static (necessary) concept and can be **dynamically** changed by how one 'shapes' the sails (sum or all vectors). All depends on the design and how it performs when heeled etc. |
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