With all the armchair sailors here criticizing people who are actually out
sailing around in their boats, I think I'll take time for an account of a
sailor who is, or was, a real hazard to himself. I'm also doing some soul
searching about it.

I sailed my son around the Cape on Wednesday to drop him off for a hike back
through the towns' greenbelt trails. As we were leaving, we passed a fairly
competent looking double ender that was remarkable for jogging along under
only a half luffing staysail. I figured he was just getting started and
organized. The boat appeared well equipped and there was just one person on
deck.

On my return, I saw the boat again, still jogging along at about 1 knot
under just the staysail which appeared to be sheeted way too far aft so that
the foot was tight and the top half flogging. The boat had just crossed a
long dangerous ledge without running aground. It's a short cut I often take
but I know the waters and I don't do it when there is a sea running like
there was on Wednesday.

I thought briefly of going over to take a look but he was past the danger
and the occasional large seas breaking nearby certainly would have clued him
into not returning that way. It was one of those days that looks nasty but
generally doesn't have much wind. I decided he was just taking it easy and
enjoying the view. You could spend all afternoon sitting on a porch watching
the ocean so why not just jog along the coast at 1 knot if you felt lazy? I
also wanted to be home when my son returned and had another home alone.

This morning, I read in the paper that a disoriented sailor was brought in
by the Coast Guard about 25 miles south the next day. I did some checking
and it was the same boat with the sole POB suffering the effects of
diabetes. He's home now and the boat is safe. He had been out in the heavy
rain and weather that brought a rare tornado watch to Maine.

I'm kicking myself now because, thinking back on how the boat was being
sailed, I'm sure he was impaired at the time I saw him and I probably could
have detected it if I'd gone over to check him out or tried to raise him on
the radio. It never occurred to me though that he might actually be trying
to go somewhere instead of just being out for a slow daysail. If he had come
to grief, I would be pretty torn up about it today.

OTOH how often is there any upside to hailing someone by voice or radio and
pointing out that they are sailing like a bozo and are they all right? I
learned later that he was swearing on the radio at some charter fishing
boats that inquired about him and that this behavior played a part in
instigating the SAR which involved both boats and aircraft.

Next time I see something like this, I'm sure I'll take a closer look but I'm
still not sure of the best way to handle it. It's a miracle that he made it
past the ledges off the cape and as far as he did.

--
Roger Long

If you have doubts, then check it out. Nature is not kind and if you tend to
feel responsible for another man's actions then by all means.

Would you check out the obvious in this video if that person was alone far
offshore?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLNx2N0E8zw



"Roger Long" wrote in message
...
With all the armchair sailors here criticizing people who are actually out
sailing around in their boats, I think I'll take time for an account of a
sailor who is, or was, a real hazard to himself. I'm also doing some soul
searching about it.

I sailed my son around the Cape on Wednesday to drop him off for a hike
back through the towns' greenbelt trails. As we were leaving, we passed a
fairly competent looking double ender that was remarkable for jogging
along under only a half luffing staysail. I figured he was just getting
started and organized. The boat appeared well equipped and there was just
one person on deck.

On my return, I saw the boat again, still jogging along at about 1 knot
under just the staysail which appeared to be sheeted way too far aft so
that the foot was tight and the top half flogging. The boat had just
crossed a long dangerous ledge without running aground. It's a short cut I
often take but I know the waters and I don't do it when there is a sea
running like there was on Wednesday.

I thought briefly of going over to take a look but he was past the danger
and the occasional large seas breaking nearby certainly would have clued
him into not returning that way. It was one of those days that looks nasty
but generally doesn't have much wind. I decided he was just taking it easy
and enjoying the view. You could spend all afternoon sitting on a porch
watching the ocean so why not just jog along the coast at 1 knot if you
felt lazy? I also wanted to be home when my son returned and had another
home alone.

This morning, I read in the paper that a disoriented sailor was brought in
by the Coast Guard about 25 miles south the next day. I did some checking
and it was the same boat with the sole POB suffering the effects of
diabetes. He's home now and the boat is safe. He had been out in the heavy
rain and weather that brought a rare tornado watch to Maine.

I'm kicking myself now because, thinking back on how the boat was being
sailed, I'm sure he was impaired at the time I saw him and I probably
could have detected it if I'd gone over to check him out or tried to raise
him on the radio. It never occurred to me though that he might actually be
trying to go somewhere instead of just being out for a slow daysail. If he
had come to grief, I would be pretty torn up about it today.

OTOH how often is there any upside to hailing someone by voice or radio
and pointing out that they are sailing like a bozo and are they all right?
I learned later that he was swearing on the radio at some charter fishing
boats that inquired about him and that this behavior played a part in
instigating the SAR which involved both boats and aircraft.

Next time I see something like this, I'm sure I'll take a closer look but
I'm still not sure of the best way to handle it. It's a miracle that he
made it past the ledges off the cape and as far as he did.

--
Roger Long

"Thomas Flores" wrote in message
...

If you have doubts, then check it out. Nature is not kind and if you tend
to feel responsible for another man's actions then by all means.

Would you check out the obvious in this video if that person was alone far
offshore?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLNx2N0E8zw

I'd offer assistance to the "red jib" guy and wonder how he'd gotten that
far in the first place. I'd imagine that, unless he was impaired, he be
tired of drifting and happy to take any help he could get.
Merlin

On 2008-07-25 12:56:33 -0400, "Thomas Flores" said:

If you have doubts, then check it out. Nature is not kind and if you tend to
feel responsible for another man's actions then by all means.

I usually check, helping one or two boaters on average each season.

Would you check out the obvious in this video if that person was alone far
offshore?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLNx2N0E8zw

Why? All of them seemed to be doing just fine. If they're not moving or
I can't see the helmsperson, I'd check.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

Thinking about it for a day, I realize that this incident is largely about
intuition. Back when I was flying, several wise old pilots (the old ones
are usually wise becaue the Darwin effect is stronger in the air) told me
that, when you start rationalizing away the little voice that tells you that
you are in trouble, you probably really are in trouble.

I still couldn't make a rational case for intruding on this guy's sailing
based just on what I could see and describe. He was going slowly but under
control and on a straight course. Sail trim was sloppy but how unusual is
that? His course was over shoals but the same route I often follow.

But, I KNEW something wasn't right. I just let the fact that I couldn't
back up that intuition with hard observations keep me from diverting to take
a look. The boat was also a factor. If it had been your Catalina or Hunter
I probably would have been more likely to check it out. It looked like the
kind of long traveling boat owned by someone who knows what they are doing
so it was easier to convince myself that he had his reasons for sailing that
way.

More in the paper today. The operator was 68 years old and made a distress
call that his sails were torn and his engine disabled. Seas were 6 feet and
winds 20 plus. A Falcon jet did not locate him at his reported position but
they found him by his cell phone signal. The paper reports that it was the
third time he had required assistance in 36 hours so I don't feel quite so
bad about checking him out. If the USCG didn't notice something wrong the
first two times, I probably wouldn't have been able to justify getting them
involved just by making a close pass.

--
Roger Long

"Roger Long" wrote in
:

The paper reports that it was the
third time he had required assistance in 36 hours so I don't feel
quite so bad about checking him out. If the USCG didn't notice
something wrong the first two times, I probably wouldn't have been
able to justify getting them involved just by making a close pass.



CG screwed up. They should have confiscated his boat on the 2ND call and
put him before a judge to have his competency tested by a shrink.

Of course, we COULD have some SANE laws that says NOONE OVER 60 SAILS
ALONE......which is fairly obvious, but we'd rather risk CG sailor's lives
than screw with the elite's right to be stupid.

I'm 62. I don't give a **** how "fit" a 60-year-old is, in his
mind....Jack La Lane shouldn't be out sailing alone over 60....maybe over
50!

"Larry" wrote

Of course, we COULD have some SANE laws that says NOONE OVER 60 SAILS
ALONE......which is fairly obvious, but we'd rather risk CG sailor's lives
than screw with the elite's right to be stupid.


I can't believe you're suggesting someting so draconian and restrictive;
especially in view of other comments you have made about government
intrusion in our lives.

There are plenty of 20 year olds who shouldn't be sailing alone for medical
and other reasons and many 80 year olds who are safer than most sailors out
there. Long before an arbitrary cut off date for single handing like that,
I would advocate medical testing and licensing. I don't advocate either.
The FAA medical system for private pilots is a joke that wastes millions of
dollars a year, keeps healthy pilots out of the air, and lets dangerous ones
fly. I doubt the gubmint would do a better job with boaters.

If 60 plus citizens shouldn't be sailing alone, they shouldn't be driving
cars either.

I plan to be sailing well into my 80's, often alone.

--
Roger Long

On Sat, 26 Jul 2008 11:50:17 -0400, "Roger Long"
wrote:

"Larry" wrote

Of course, we COULD have some SANE laws that says NOONE OVER 60 SAILS
ALONE......which is fairly obvious, but we'd rather risk CG sailor's lives
than screw with the elite's right to be stupid.


I can't believe you're suggesting someting so draconian and restrictive;
especially in view of other comments you have made about government
intrusion in our lives.

There are plenty of 20 year olds who shouldn't be sailing alone for medical
and other reasons and many 80 year olds who are safer than most sailors out
there. Long before an arbitrary cut off date for single handing like that,
I would advocate medical testing and licensing. I don't advocate either.
The FAA medical system for private pilots is a joke that wastes millions of
dollars a year, keeps healthy pilots out of the air, and lets dangerous ones
fly. I doubt the gubmint would do a better job with boaters.

If 60 plus citizens shouldn't be sailing alone, they shouldn't be driving
cars either.

I plan to be sailing well into my 80's, often alone.


Ditto to everything Roger wrote.

I'm 62 and have been sailing since I was 8. Mostly single handed or
with another person who was really no help. Several years of longterm
live aboard cruising. I guess if you added them all up it'd be close
to 10 years.

Yes, I have "slowed down" a bit, but not all that much. The biggest
difference is that after a lot of physical effort and/or lack of
sleep, it takes a little longer to recover - like 2 or 3 days instead
of the next day.

Wife and I went out sailing last weekend. Almost record temperatures
of 101 deg. The main halyard fouled on a block up past the spreaders.
I had to go up and free it finally in about 15 kt winds. Now, when I
was 20 I probably would have gone up the mast steps like the
proverbial monkey. Now I just took my time going up, took my time
getting things free and took my time going down. Okay, so it took me a
few minutes longer but a lot less effort. Had I been as wise at age
20, I would have done it the same way.

To paraphrase some football player. In bad conditions offshore, it's
like fighting with a 600 lb gorilla. You don't stop when you get
tired, you stop when the gorilla gets tired. If you can't fight that
gorilla then you don't put yourself in a situation where you might
have to. I've fought that gorilla quite a few times over the years.
I've found it to be a lot less effort using my brain instead of my
brawn. For instance, see a squall line off in the distance that MIGHT
be heading my way. Reef now. Maybe 9 out of 10 times the storm went
on, but it's worth it for the 1 time it didn't. A lot easier, and
smarter, to easily reef than to fight it AFTER it hits you.

'Valkyrie' is our home and we plan on living aboard and cruising for
as long as we can, hopefully into the 80's.

Re flying. My dad rebuilt airplanes so got to fly all kinds of neat
old planes. He gave up flying at age 87. The only reason was his
vision was failing. He could still easily take and enjoy aerobatics
with me at the stick.

Rick
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Sat, 26 Jul 2008 11:50:17 -0400, "Roger Long"
wrote:

"Larry" wrote

Of course, we COULD have some SANE laws that says NOONE OVER 60 SAILS
ALONE......which is fairly obvious, but we'd rather risk CG sailor's lives
than screw with the elite's right to be stupid.


I can't believe you're suggesting someting so draconian and restrictive;
especially in view of other comments you have made about government
intrusion in our lives.

There are plenty of 20 year olds who shouldn't be sailing alone for medical
and other reasons and many 80 year olds who are safer than most sailors out
there. Long before an arbitrary cut off date for single handing like that,
I would advocate medical testing and licensing. I don't advocate either.
The FAA medical system for private pilots is a joke that wastes millions of
dollars a year, keeps healthy pilots out of the air, and lets dangerous ones
fly. I doubt the gubmint would do a better job with boaters.

If 60 plus citizens shouldn't be sailing alone, they shouldn't be driving
cars either.

I plan to be sailing well into my 80's, often alone.


Ditto to everything Roger wrote.

I'm 62 and have been sailing since I was 8. Mostly single handed or
with another person who was really no help. Several years of longterm
live aboard cruising. I guess if you added them all up it'd be close
to 10 years.

Yes, I have "slowed down" a bit, but not all that much. The biggest
difference is that after a lot of physical effort and/or lack of
sleep, it takes a little longer to recover - like 2 or 3 days instead
of the next day.

Wife and I went out sailing last weekend. Almost record temperatures
of 101 deg. The main halyard fouled on a block up past the spreaders.
I had to go up and free it finally in about 15 kt winds. Now, when I
was 20 I probably would have gone up the mast steps like the
proverbial monkey. Now I just took my time going up, took my time
getting things free and took my time going down. Okay, so it took me a
few minutes longer but a lot less effort. Had I been as wise at age
20, I would have done it the same way.

To paraphrase some football player. In bad conditions offshore, it's
like fighting with a 600 lb gorilla. You don't stop when you get
tired, you stop when the gorilla gets tired. If you can't fight that
gorilla then you don't put yourself in a situation where you might
have to. I've fought that gorilla quite a few times over the years.
I've found it to be a lot less effort using my brain instead of my
brawn. For instance, see a squall line off in the distance that MIGHT
be heading my way. Reef now. Maybe 9 out of 10 times the storm went
on, but it's worth it for the 1 time it didn't. A lot easier, and
smarter, to easily reef than to fight it AFTER it hits you.

'Valkyrie' is our home and we plan on living aboard and cruising for
as long as we can, hopefully into the 80's.

Re flying. My dad rebuilt airplanes so got to fly all kinds of neat
old planes. He gave up flying at age 87. The only reason was his
vision was failing. He could still easily take and enjoy aerobatics
with me at the stick.

Rick
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Jul 26, 7:09*am, Larry wrote:

I'm 62. *I don't give a **** how "fit" a 60-year-old is, in his
mind....Jack La Lane shouldn't be out sailing alone over 60....maybe over
50!


I can not disagree more! I am a liberal Democrate and belive that
govenment intrusion is not a good thing. To simply mandate an upper
age limitt is simply ignorant. I looked at the "special-better than
the rest of us" web page roger created for RBC. Looking at the pics of
the authors here Id say youre right. All over 50 ... white ..... and
pudgy to dangerously inable and feble. even though Roger claimes to
have the back of a 30 year old.

I say performance based licensing is the answer. Get an ocupational
theropist and a HRM guy to do a task analysist on sailing. Then create
a physial/mental agility test. In its most simple terms [eye test,
can you run 2 miles in 12 min, do 50 crunches, lift 80 lbs to yor
chest 30 times in 3 min. etc. that sorta stuff] Dont pass. Dont go to
sea.

But to say no sailing after 50 is bull****.... well that is unless you
live in select areas of the USA where 50% of the population is OBEASE!
Old fat ****s and people without a clue have no business off shore.
Keep them on inland and western rivers and let the county/city water
cops take care of them

Bob