Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:09:18 -0700, Stephen Trapani
said:

The economy is in shambles, in a large
measure because of the cost of the war and Bushco's stated agenda to
remove
Federal funding from just about every program including Social Security
and
Medicare.

Hilarious!

Jon's been saying the economy is in shambles constantly since 2001. Why
should he change now?


So, you think things are better now than in say 1998?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

wrote in message
...
On 29 Jul 2008 16:34:01 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:13:20 -0700, Stephen Trapani
said:

I'm an atheist. And one who believes in morality of a
higher sort. The sort where no religious belief gives anyone the right
to harm innocents.

Jeez, Steve, you didn't have to give up religion for that. There are
plenty
around that do not include a right to harm innocents in their catechism.

Steve has a very special and narrow view as to whom he considers
"innoncents". I
imagine it at least includes the Keating Five, and does not include
minority
children in poor surroundings.




Hey! Don't slam McCain. He only used "poor judgement," according to the
Ethics Committee.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/ar...scandals_stir/

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
Again, nothing new here. The economy goes up and down. We don't have
socialized medicine. What's new? I can't remember it ever being any
different, can you? Bush isn't to blame for any of it.
Again, you don't care. Got it. Butter wouldn't melt in his mouth or
yours I suppose.
Didn't say a word about caring or not. I said I can't remember the
economy not going up and down. Can you? We've also never had more
socialized medicine ever. How do you blame Bush for that? Did you change
the subject because these points are obvious and you don't want to admit
it?
What are you blathering about?
I thought you were old enough to remember that the economy goes up and
down. Remember the seventies? There were way worse than now. You're old
enough, you just don't want to remember, I guess.

So, what you're saying is that because the 70s were worse, then everything
is ok now. That makes a lot of sense to you I guess.

No, what I'm saying is that the economy has been going up and down for
as long as I can remember and it seems there is little any president can
ever do about it.

The economy is in shambles, in a large measure because of the cost of the
war and Bushco's stated agenda to remove Federal funding from just about
every program including Social Security and Medicare.
Hilarious! So, every war in US history has boosted the economy except this
one. And if there were more federal funding for Social Security, Medicare
and the like, the economy would be in better shape! Wow, hard to argue
with someone so far off the mark!

Huh? Where did I say that?

The economy is in shambles, in a large measure because of the cost
of the
war and Bushco's stated agenda to remove Federal funding from just
about
every program including Social Security and Medicare.

What I said was that we're spending $12B a month
on a war that didn't need to be fought,

But wars have always boosted the US economy. Why is this one any different?

that we were lied to about, instead
of helping people in this country. The neo-con agenda is pretty clear and
self-stated.

Here's a nice link for you, since you're an avowed athiest...

http://www.publicchristian.com/index.php?p=205

We should dominate any culture who seeks to prevent economic, cultural,
social and religious freedoms. We should dominate them only to the
extent that they can't *impose* their values on anyone. At the least,
let them talk about it and promote it all they want in a free speech
setting and the foolishness of their ideas will be illuminated. At the
most blow them to kingdom come if they won't stop their aggression
against innocents.

We should also fight these evil forces within our own society with
similar standars, including Christians who seek to impose their
stupidity (like creationism) on the rest of us.

Stephen

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Capt. JG wrote:
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
...
wrote:
On 29 Jul 2008 13:52:02 -0500, Dave wrote:

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:31:34 -0400, said:

"holy hell". Odd choice of words for
someone who claims to be an atheist.
And would you apply the same reasoning to someone who exclaims "holy
****?"
I might if the person had said other things that pointed in a
particular direction. I think Steve knew he was outed, and claiming to
be an atheist was his feeble attempt at shocking people into taking
his views more seriously. It didn't work, except on a gullible layer
or two.
You might trying thinking for a few seconds or so. Do you know any
Christians who would disavow their belief for the sake of a silly usenet
argument? No, I'm an atheist. And one who believes in morality of a higher
sort. The sort where no religious belief gives anyone the right to harm
innocents.

Stephen



A higher sort. That's rich. Someone who really doesn't care about other
people, especially those who are dying.

Who are you talking about? I care about people. I just don't think that
stealing money by force from people and giving it to someone else is the
way to solve peoples' problems.

Stephen

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Dave wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:13:20 -0700, Stephen Trapani
said:

I'm an atheist. And one who believes in morality of a
higher sort. The sort where no religious belief gives anyone the right
to harm innocents.

Jeez, Steve, you didn't have to give up religion for that. There are plenty
around that do not include a right to harm innocents in their catechism.

I gave up religious theories because I think they are false.

Stephen

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:13:20 -0700, Stephen Trapani
wrote:



You might trying thinking for a few seconds or so. Do you know any
Christians who would disavow their belief for the sake of a silly usenet
argument? No, I'm an atheist. And one who believes in morality of a
higher sort. The sort where no religious belief gives anyone the right
to harm innocents.

Stephen

Sounds like a 'religious' philosophy to me. Perhaps not a religion but
at least a religious belief.

Peter

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 17:36:36 -0700, Stephen Trapani
wrote:



A higher sort. That's rich. Someone who really doesn't care about other
people, especially those who are dying.

Who are you talking about? I care about people. I just don't think that
stealing money by force from people and giving it to someone else is the
way to solve peoples' problems.

Stephen

Stephen,

Rosseau's statement that "all taxation is theft" and its underlying
arguments does not apply in this age and has been largely discredited.
If you wish to belong to a particular herd and claim protection and
hearth warmth from that herd then you must pay the piper.

That is why you elect the people who decide how much the membership
fees are and how it is spent.

Apart from any moral or empathetic reasons that come with a supposedly
highly developed civilisation, to me it makes economic sense to
financially try to help one's less fortunate citizens.

There is also the law of economic returns and the money-go-round of a
one dollar note given to a beggar. Its spending power is amplified
many fold as it gets passed along and eventually reaches your pocket.

I give money away, not because I am enjoined to give away 10% by my
religion, but because I feel a moral duty and have a desire to help
some other poor sod who may not be the maker of his own misfortunes. I
also have the realisation that I could have been and still could be,
in that boat.

In history, even from the time of the 18th century BC Hammurabi,
societies have been judged by how well and how justly they treated
their citizens, including their disadvantaged such as children,
slaves, the infirm and widows.

As a New Zealander, a large proportion of my taxes goes on free public
education (including university if you cannot afford it), reasonable
welfare payments and health care. I who do not need these things, am
more than happy to pay as I believe in the morality of a safety net
for all.

Peter

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Herodotus wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 14:13:20 -0700, Stephen Trapani
wrote:


You might trying thinking for a few seconds or so. Do you know any
Christians who would disavow their belief for the sake of a silly usenet
argument? No, I'm an atheist. And one who believes in morality of a
higher sort. The sort where no religious belief gives anyone the right
to harm innocents.

Stephen

Sounds like a 'religious' philosophy to me. Perhaps not a religion but
at least a religious belief.

Morality is not exclusive to religion. My morality is based upon reason,
not because someone said it in a book. Religion is based upon faith.

Stephen

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Yes, that must be very frustrating for you. Nobody thinks what you say
has any gravitas. Maybe if you stamp your feet and hold your breath
someone will pretend to pay attention to your nonsense.

No, reason is always the first best answer for ignorance and falsehood.
I'll continue with that. I'm sure that even though you couldn't
understand it, there were plenty that read it here who could.

Stephen

My God! I am obviously not as perceptive and intelligent as I thought
I was. Thanks for making me feel an intellectual fraud.

I tried hard, but I could see no substance or reasoned truths in any
of your arguments. Just sounded like not very good rhetoric to me.

regards
Peter

Advice on refridgeration unit please
 

Herodotus wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2008 17:36:36 -0700, Stephen Trapani
wrote:


A higher sort. That's rich. Someone who really doesn't care about other
people, especially those who are dying.
Who are you talking about? I care about people. I just don't think that
stealing money by force from people and giving it to someone else is the
way to solve peoples' problems.

Stephen

Stephen,

Rosseau's statement that "all taxation is theft" and its underlying
arguments does not apply in this age and has been largely discredited.
If you wish to belong to a particular herd and claim protection and
hearth warmth from that herd then you must pay the piper.

That is why you elect the people who decide how much the membership
fees are and how it is spent.

Apart from any moral or empathetic reasons that come with a supposedly
highly developed civilisation, to me it makes economic sense to
financially try to help one's less fortunate citizens.
[...]

A more moral and effective way to help less fortunate citizens is with
better forms of voluntary private donation. A more moral and efficient
way to fund public services is with private companies competing in the
marketplace to provide them instead of dumping money into government
organizations with little to no accountability for how effectively they
use that money.

Stephen