wrote in message
...
"j" ganz wrote:

From what I've read, it's more about low expectations rather than a
"society worth living in" in combination with a responsible society. Not
to
discount the latter of course....

I suppose that, the fact that people have realistic expectations, are
part of beeing a good society. Don't you ?



Not sure... I suppose, since that's what seems to be the case. I prefer to
have unrealistic expectations. LOL

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 09:48:04 -0700, "Capt. JG"
said:

I suppose you think that $3-6 trillion spent on a war of
choice is preferrable to health care for all Americans... I know where
I'd
rather see my money going, and it isn't to Saudia Arabia.

This is an argument we see over and over ad nauseam--the guvmint should
spend money on the program I want because that's better than spending it
on
X.

The technique relieves that proponent of having to justify on its own the
program he wants, or to consider the possibility that perhaps we'd be
happier if the guvmint didn't spend the money on either program, and
didn't
take the money out of our pockets in the first place.


I don't think there's much in the way of argument about which is better to
spend money doing. Unless of course you think war is preferrable to
healthy citizens.


Tell me, please what's so healthy about citizens taking large doses of
LSD???

--
Gregory Hall

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
wrote in message
...
"j" ganz wrote:

From what I've read, it's more about low expectations rather than a
"society worth living in" in combination with a responsible society. Not
to
discount the latter of course....

I suppose that, the fact that people have realistic expectations, are
part of beeing a good society. Don't you ?



Not sure... I suppose, since that's what seems to be the case. I prefer to
have unrealistic expectations. LOL


Is that why you take large doses of LSD? Unrealistic expectations?

--
Gregory Hall

"Larry" wrote in message
...
Stephen Trapani wrote in news:ImxCj.11$_J2.2
@newsfe02.lga:

If you aimed
that same focus anywhere else you would see ten times the conspiracies
elsewhere and the US would look like a safe haven in comparison.


The "New World Order" is global in scope. Other nations are already in
the
process of being assimilated, such as the EU. The NAU will assimilate us
into a 3-country conglomeration of mindless peoples. If you haven't been
to the USA in the last 3 years, you need to come see it! Charleston, SC,
hardly a border town along the Rio Grande is SIMPLY OVERRUN with Mexicans,
Mexican Indians, Central Americans who came in with the Mexicans across
our
porous border to the South. Whole business that cater to the illegal
aliens have sprung up. Most places speak Spanish, now, just like Radio
Shacks. The country has been quite successfully invaded from the South
and
the results are BREEDING LIKE FLIES ON A **** PILE! Every illegal Mexican
woman is following her Catholic instructions by staying pregnant
continuously! Some are pushing 4 babies around, simultaneously! These,
of
course, are BORN IN THE USA, of illegal stock. I'm sure this breeding
program is supported by many politicians who hope to "cash in" at the
polls
on election day as soon as the babies are 18, natural citizens of voting
age. The indoctrination of them has already begun!

The new, diluted population of the USA will do what it's told when the 3
countries are melded into the North American Union. South America, Africa
and Asia are next. Once the regional mixing is complete, a generation or
two away, they will be, again, melded into the World Government with the
NWO elites at the top of the pyramid and the all seeing eye will have
completed the world's transition to world control.

This is no fantasy. It's all around us!

So..since there is no stopping this process, how can a person take
advantage of this situation?

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 14:19:06 -0700, "Capt. JG"
said:

The technique relieves that proponent of having to justify on its own
the
program he wants, or to consider the possibility that perhaps we'd be
happier if the guvmint didn't spend the money on either program, and
didn't
take the money out of our pockets in the first place.


I don't think there's much in the way of argument about which is better to
spend money doing. Unless of course you think war is preferrable to
healthy
citizens.

So you simply repeat the fallacious argument.


There's no difference between spending on war vs. spending on health? Ok. I
guess I just repeated it again!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Dave wrote:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:55:45 +0000, Larry said:

So, Larry, you think that if the VAT rate is 20%, and I buy parts for
$.80 and resell the assembled product for $1.00, I'm going to have to
collect and pay over to the guvmint $.20 in VAT?

Rolled into the price outside the USA. Every point on the chain from when
they dig it out of the ground where money changes hands, VAT is added and
rolled into the price when it goes up the chain.....

And now would you answer the question?

Clearly Larry does not understand VAT systems, (GST in some places).

Cheers
Marty

Dave wrote in
:

On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 20:55:45 +0000, Larry said:

So, Larry, you think that if the VAT rate is 20%, and I buy parts
for $.80 and resell the assembled product for $1.00, I'm going to
have to collect and pay over to the guvmint $.20 in VAT?


Rolled into the price outside the USA. Every point on the chain from
when they dig it out of the ground where money changes hands, VAT is
added and rolled into the price when it goes up the chain.....

And now would you answer the question?


Yes

Larry wrote:
Dave wrote in
:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 15:30:53 +0000, Larry said:
VAT is piled
upon EVERY link in the money exchange chain from the mine to the
consumer, multiplying its real percentage into the price the consumer
pays many times over.
So, Larry, you think that if the VAT rate is 20%, and I buy parts for
$.80 and resell the assembled product for $1.00, I'm going to have to
collect and pay over to the guvmint $.20 in VAT?
Rolled into the price outside the USA. Every point on the chain from when
they dig it out of the ground where money changes hands, VAT is added and
rolled into the price when it goes up the chain.....

I had hoped someone better versed in economics in general
and VAT in particular would correct this false premise - but
see that I will just have to step in ...

Each registered business does indeed pay VAT on its stage of
a product's path to final sale to the consumer but each
business is able to claim that payment back once it leaves
for the next stage, so in practice no payment is made.
Therefore, that payment is not reflected in the product's
cost of production, only the consumer pays the final VAT,
making it similar to a normal sales tax.

I have been reliably informed by those who understand these
things that this is the most equitable form of taxation that
is difficult to evade, although invoking a bureaucratic
overhead.

HTH.
BrianH.

BrianH wrote:
Larry wrote:
Dave wrote in
:
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 15:30:53 +0000, Larry said:
VAT is piled upon EVERY link in the money exchange chain from the
mine to the
consumer, multiplying its real percentage into the price the consumer
pays many times over.
So, Larry, you think that if the VAT rate is 20%, and I buy parts for
$.80 and resell the assembled product for $1.00, I'm going to have to
collect and pay over to the guvmint $.20 in VAT?
Rolled into the price outside the USA. Every point on the chain from
when they dig it out of the ground where money changes hands, VAT is
added and rolled into the price when it goes up the chain.....

I had hoped someone better versed in economics in general and VAT in
particular would correct this false premise - but see that I will just
have to step in ...

[snip VAT explanation]

Thanks Brian, I was afraid I'd have to do it. ;-o However it will not
assuage Larry's fears vis-a-vis Machiavellian monetary conspiracies.

Cheers
Marty

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 14 Mar 2008 18:01:23 -0700, "Capt. JG"
said:

There's no difference between spending on war vs. spending on health? Ok.
I
guess I just repeated it again!

Remember those multiple choice tests you took in HS, Jon? There was often
a
choice labeled "none of the above."

Jon and his liberal ilk have one-track minds bordering on the imbecile
level. They can no more envision a path with multiple inputs and outputs
than they can envision taking care of themselves. No! It DOES take a village
to raise and nurture the likes of dependent personalities such as Jon Boy.

Not a one of them can grasp a complicated thought such as healthy citizens
being rendered unhealthy by as little as one terrorist dirty bomb which
could easily be the consequence of failing to be aggressive and vigilant in
waging war on Islamic Fascists terrorists. And, yes, the war in Iran is part
of that world-wide war against the Islamic terrorist threat. We pull out,
the Islamic fascists flood in. It's that simple.

But, liberals such as Jon Boy see their selfish selves as the center of the
world. All needs to revolve around them. All needs to be ordered to fulfill
their needs. All needs to be bought and paid for by somebody other than
themselves. That's the liberal world outlook. Somebody else's has got to
produce and they've got to produce according to the liberals concept of what
production means. Jon Boy is a looter. He could not survive without those
who produce taking care of his every need. And, sadly, he and his ilk are
not capable of seeing the world as it exists. They would dictate, from a
standpoint of utter and ridiculous ignorance how it should work. If ever
they got their way they would still not see their stupidity even as the
world crumbled around their feet as they starved to death. With their very
last breath they would bemoan that it's all somebody else's fault. Never
would they ask what they produced. The concept of production eludes them.
They are the elite. They are entitled to consume without producing anything
other than complaints. This is why they are so loathsome.

Wilbur Hubbard