On Nov 11, 10:12 pm, Bob wrote:
On Nov 11, 5:30 pm, Joe wrote:





On Nov 11, 2:00 pm, Bob wrote:

On Nov 11, 11:38 am, Joe wrote:

Well Greg.. better than Wilbur, but a puppet anyhow.
Plonk

Hi Joe:

Aside from the proliferation of personal attacks here, I would like to
add one more thought before I drop this futile thread.

Like Joe, and I suspect many others before us, I had visions of making
my boat pay for its self. Some of the "projects" I researched were the
following:

Sailing lessons: Sole Proprietor Schedule C. I did this and did not
make a profit for three consecutive years. As such I was violating the
SPIRIT of the IRS Hobby Loss condition.

Unispected Passenger Vessel CFR Sub Chapter T and of course 6
passengers Charter Boat: Same problem plus even more regs/insurance.......

I even considered buying one of the 80' Katrina gulf shrippers that
were going for $100k. Now that's a lot of boat for the bucks! Oh, then
haul Christmas trees from PNW down to So Cal.

Don't forget, since my daughter was going to school at U of Hawaii I
thought I would just pack some of my daughters things and "move her to
college" via sailboat. But of course pack in some "extra stuff" that
she could sell at a "yard sale" later. That is even more "legal" than
your project. As you belive, "hey... its MY stuff! I cna do anything I
want to with it!" Very Nieve to belive that.

After reading CFR, IRS, USCG, Customs etc, TO BE SAFE I then went and
talked to: 1) USCG Enforcement, 2) an Admiralty Attorney ($190/hr),
and 3) a CPA who specialized in marine business.

The bottom line I learned is: when that 28 year old in charge of a
USCG boarding party hops aboard your boat its up to her to interpret
the law. They will ALWAYS error on the side of conservative
interpretations. In other words, "if walks like a duck, and quacks
like a duck.... Youre screwed. Cause, your boat is seized, you go to
jail, and you of course loose your coffee. Now you get to fight the
court system to prove your innocence and get the boat back.

It wasn't worth the risk losing the boat I worked my ass off to get.

Dear Joe, you said that you did not know the definition of the IRS
term "Hobby Loss" that means you have many more lessons to learn and
many more land mines to avoid. Another telling statement you made to
me was, "Im on vacation... gonna buy some souvenirs... an take it home..."

BUT other places you are claiming to be a COMPANY and will sell your
beans on e-bay and are seeking donations for poor children. With those
statements on the web you already screwed yourself. You blabbed your
plan on the web! That is evidence fool!

You can not have it both ways......... you re either using 10,000 lbs of
beans for personal use, which is a ridiculous amount for personal use,
or you're a full on coastwise vessel transporting cargo for your
company. You can not have it both ways!

Besides do you really think Foss, Crowley, Tidewater, Hornbeck,
Chouest, Sause, Seacor, SIU, SUP, and IBU are going to let some JIPO
hippy boat wannabe undercut their business?!?!?!? Your dealing with
Tony Sopranno only here the law and USCG are his Paulie Walnuts.

Do it right or don't do it..........................

Bob

Bob the point I'm making is the boat is not for hire, as I'm carrying
my own cargo. The vessel is un-inspected and the crew is not paid.

I did heed your message and went ahead and applied for a cargo
freight endorsement on my USCG documentation, my vessel was only
registered in the state. The freight endorsement was 29 bucks.

http://www.uscg.mil/hq/g-m/vdoc/fees2.htm

Sorry about the Capt Kangaroo remark.. I thought you were another of
Wilbur's puppets.

Joe- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

HI Joe:

thanks for the appoogy. Around here not really needed. HOwever, I do
beg your attention! Once you pack stuff on a boat, any boat, with the
intent (or implied) to sell the stuff you are conducting commerce on a
vessel. Just think quacking ducks. Enough said............

I agree, and as long as the items you are selling are cleared in and
out of customs, you have the proper receipts, and a safe vessel I can
not see what would be considered a problem or illegal. I've spoke with
the USCG Public releations officer and have messages into District 8
command, and the MSO Galveston to make sure all is OK and have them
over to see the boat and sample some coffee if they can make it. I
have the Customs transponder decal, FDA approval, a customs agent,
state documentation, and will have federal documentation with a cargo
endorsement.



Before I end I support your search for profit. Sitting in every galley
of every stinking rig/osv/processor or F/T ive been on the top topic

Well one of our expressed goals is to be a model of Profit and
Substainability for others to follow. I like you.. have done my hitch
in the oilfield and have always looked for a way to make a profit with
a boat on my schedule and nickle. I've decided I like doing that more
than anything. They say if you want to be successful in a career find
one you have a passion for and will enjoy.

With this type of info in the news every day IMO we can not wait to
switch to sail. With public support and the proper product to make a
profit with we can force or user in a new way of doing things..sail..
profit and public demand for greener products will be the only way to
change to sail (that a 300 dollar drums of oil) . BTW or local gulf is
the dirtiest and most polluted by ships.

Click or cut and paste to read the rest of the story:

http://www.thestar.com/sciencetech/article/274399

Ship pollution kills 60,000 yearly: Study

"The sludgy fuel is "basically the dregs of the oil refining process,"
and contains nearly 2,000 times as much sulphur as the diesel fuel
burned in trucks in North America and Europe, says David Marshall, of
the Clean Air Task Force, one of the groups that commissioned the
study."

Best Regards,
Joe





Good luck....................
Bob- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Nov 12, 7:25 am, Joe wrote:


Hello Eco-Joe:

When I considered a similar effort while in pursuit of profit on the
west coast I kept running into a wall. I may have missed something or
not asked the right questions. I hope that you would make a brief list
of the organizations/departments and any permits, licenses,
documentation needed to make your plan work. The second Rule of
Acquisition states Never Give Up... Never Surrender! So, would you mind
summarizing what you have already posted other places below? For
example, how is your vessel Registered or Documented? You also
mentioned USDA, US Customs, Bill of Laden etc.

Bob

On Nov 13, 10:40 am, Bob wrote:
On Nov 12, 7:25 am, Joe wrote:

Hello Eco-Joe:

When I considered a similar effort while in pursuit of profit on the
west coast I kept running into a wall. I may have missed something or
not asked the right questions. I hope that you would make a brief list
of the organizations/departments and any permits, licenses,
documentation needed to make your plan work. The second Rule of
Acquisition states Never Give Up... Never Surrender! So, would you mind
summarizing what you have already posted other places below? For
example, how is your vessel Registered or Documented? You also
mentioned USDA, US Customs, Bill of Laden etc.

Bob

Coonass Bob;

If you buy food from overseas it has to be registered with the FDA,
and the seller facility(me) also has to be registered. This is under
the bio-terrorism act of 2002

http://www.fda.gov/oc/bioterrorism/bioact.html

Then you need a customs agent..This is where your Hawaii bound
daughters plan went wrong, you were thinking about cheating the Govt
out of a tarriff. The reason we chose coffee to import is that is is a
tarriff free import under the free trade agreement. No Tarriff ...no
customs bond. You also have to report your arrival 24hr before
reaching port.. We are in the process of declaring our cargo now. Your
cargo has to meet import standards...I lost the link, but is not to
complicated with coffee, and easy with roasted coffee..no mold
worries. There is a standard for green beans.

It's all he

http://help.cbp.gov/cgi-bin/customs....i=&p_topview=1

I used a customs agent who's been here 20+ years and walks the cargo
clearling process many times every day...you could do it yourself but
for a very resonable fee you can get an expert who knows all the steps
and the players who approve everything. 100's of people here in
Houston import coffee every day. After all it is a coffee green
port...do you know what that means? (No inventory taxes)

A bill of laiden is a manifest of cargo that shows the owner (me).

Again my vessel is un-inspected with no paid crew or passengers.

http://www.unols.org/publications/ma...m/03Safety.pdf

The boat is registered with the state and federal documented with a
cargo endorsement.

http://www.uscg.mil/hq/g-m/vdoc/nvdc.htm

Then when Roger says you better double check you call Galveston MSO,
and the 8th district command and ask for a courtesy inspection and a
letter of introduction from the area command.. That's all ...Oh and
you have to find something to import that offers enough profit to make
it worth the effort.

Then work your butt off 16 hrs a day for a couple years while jumping
through hoops.

Hope this helps.

Joe