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#21
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
What do you mean, "change and mean just the opposite"? The buoys in
the Woods Hole are absolutely consistent and perfectly easy to understand just by looking at the chart before hand. Have you ever looked at a chart? http://mapserver.maptech.com/homepag...latlontype=DMS -- Roger Long "richard" wrote in message oups.com... It still amazes me that there is no better system than red and green bouys that change and mean just the opposite halfway thru a difficult channel. I have seen this in a number of places such as Woods Hole or the Coast of Maine or Boston and nearby harbors. I use charts more often than not and almost always in unfamilar waters, but I hope that I will live to see the day when one can look at the navigational aids and know right away what they mean. Actually, I do kind of like to figure them out as we are going along. Adds excitment to the day. and I do own a power boat so I tend to have less time to figure it out than a sail boat, but I don't draw as much and I can hit reverse pretty hard if I needed to. |
#22
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
The colors don't reverse at Wood's Hole, or any of the nearby Holes. The do reverse in the Cape Cod Canal, but there are no buoys in the canal itself so it isn't very confusing. I'm sure there a few reverses left in Maine, but I think most were "fixed" back around 1993, to the annoyance of those of use who were there that summer! richard wrote: It still amazes me that there is no better system than red and green bouys that change and mean just the opposite halfway thru a difficult channel. I have seen this in a number of places such as Woods Hole or the Coast of Maine or Boston and nearby harbors. I use charts more often than not and almost always in unfamilar waters, but I hope that I will live to see the day when one can look at the navigational aids and know right away what they mean. Actually, I do kind of like to figure them out as we are going along. Adds excitment to the day. and I do own a power boat so I tend to have less time to figure it out than a sail boat, but I don't draw as much and I can hit reverse pretty hard if I needed to. |
#23
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 11:19:53 GMT, "Roger Long"
wrote: Have you ever looked at a chart? http://mapserver.maptech.com/homepag...latlontype=DMS =================================== I like this view better: http://tinyurl.com/de2wo I agree that the buoys are consistent (no reversal), but somehow the chart does not adequately prepare you for what you are about to encounter. I've been through the "hole" many times in different boats and I still find it to be one of the most intimidating places I've ever negotiated. Things happen really quickly and there's barely enough time to sort out the conflicting visual images that present themselves, sort out the cross currents pulling you sideways, avoid the locals fishing in mid passage, and select the correct channel. |
#24
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
The possible confusion for those using the WH passage, is that for those
entering the passage from the Buzzards Bay side might be expecting to see the normal "Red Right Returning", but obviously, the opposite applies. My best suggestion for solving this is to look at a small scale chart of the area to get an overall view of the general direction of the buoys, since the "N-S" "E-W" for the East Coast, coming from sea can lead to confusion. Since the main entrance to WH is from the Nantucket/Vineyard sound, all the buoys associated with that and/or any side channels, reflect that direction.........G clear as mud. otn "richard" wrote in message oups.com... It still amazes me that there is no better system than red and green bouys that change and mean just the opposite halfway thru a difficult channel. I have seen this in a number of places such as Woods Hole or the Coast of Maine or Boston and nearby harbors. I use charts more often than not and almost always in unfamilar waters, but I hope that I will live to see the day when one can look at the navigational aids and know right away what they mean. Actually, I do kind of like to figure them out as we are going along. Adds excitment to the day. and I do own a power boat so I tend to have less time to figure it out than a sail boat, but I don't draw as much and I can hit reverse pretty hard if I needed to. |
#25
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
No terribly clear but, buoys were never intended to be used without
charts. -- Roger Long |
#26
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
"Roger Long" wrote in news:qPkjf.51442$uC3.511
@twister.nyroc.rr.com: No terribly clear but, buoys were never intended to be used without charts. I would disagree with that statement, to a point. The general flow of buoys (sticking to the East Coast,USA) is North to South, East to West (E-W is "old school") coming from sea. What this meant was that if you should see a buoy while moving along the coast and for whatever reason, you didn't have a chart/chart out of date/you're lost, based on the "N-S", you would know which side to pass. With out a doubt, a chart is your best bet to see and understand what the buoys mean, but be sure you look at the "BIG" picture of an area to check the overall direction the system is taking. otn |
#27
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
A basic principle of buoy philosophy that is often overlooked is that
they mark what is safe; not what is dangerous. There may be a buoy by an isolated shoal but it is there to show you where the deep water is on the preferred side. A patch of water isn't safe just because there is no buoy. That's why you need charts. NO navigational aid or device is intended to be used alone. The essence of my point is that the buoy arrangement in a place like Woods Hole is not deficient just because some navigators will need a chart to understand it readily or to orient themselves when they get there. With a smidgen of understanding, Woods Hole is a piece of cake, even with the current behind you. You just go straight through into the harbor and then head out into the sound. I've done it many times even in a kayak and mostly just gone with the flow. It's when people without sufficient understanding of current, rudders, boats, and water, try to turn into the other channel because it's the shorter and seems the obvious thing to do that the Coast Guard gets called out. -- Roger Long "otnmbrd" wrote in message 25.201... "Roger Long" wrote in news:qPkjf.51442$uC3.511 @twister.nyroc.rr.com: No terribly clear but, buoys were never intended to be used without charts. I would disagree with that statement, to a point. The general flow of buoys (sticking to the East Coast,USA) is North to South, East to West (E-W is "old school") coming from sea. What this meant was that if you should see a buoy while moving along the coast and for whatever reason, you didn't have a chart/chart out of date/you're lost, based on the "N-S", you would know which side to pass. With out a doubt, a chart is your best bet to see and understand what the buoys mean, but be sure you look at the "BIG" picture of an area to check the overall direction the system is taking. otn |
#28
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
I'll intersperse some comments......
"Roger Long" wrote in message news A basic principle of buoy philosophy that is often overlooked is that they mark what is safe; not what is dangerous. G Point of view..... I'd say they do both to varying degrees. There may be a buoy by an isolated shoal but it is there to show you where the deep water is on the preferred side. A patch of water isn't safe just because there is no buoy. That's why you need charts. No argument. NO navigational aid or device is intended to be used alone. No argument. The essence of my point is that the buoy arrangement in a place like Woods Hole is not deficient just because some navigators will need a chart to understand it readily or to orient themselves when they get there. Would agree ..... however EG having discussed this channel with a number of people who are approaching from Buzzards Bay, I can understand their initial confusion and reason for it. With a smidgen of understanding, Woods Hole is a piece of cake, even with the current behind you. You just go straight through into the harbor and then head out into the sound. I've done it many times even in a kayak and mostly just gone with the flow. G I always preferred "Broadway". It's when people without sufficient understanding of current, rudders, boats, and water, try to turn into the other channel because it's the shorter and seems the obvious thing to do that the Coast Guard gets called out. Reminds me of another incident ..... was coming through from Buzzards Bay and made my turn down "Broadway" followed by a larger sloop than mine. After settling myself out on course, looked back at other sloop only to see him doing circles at the corner. He finally followed the main route after coming too close to one buoy. otn |
#29
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
You are right Roger, I was thinking of another place and yes, I have
looked at a chart. Do it all the time. Actually love charting. When I bought my first GPS I would not let myself use it until I took a course related to reading charts. (Paper charts, that is). I think that maybe you missed my point. I am sure that you have been cruising at some point in your life, where you were leaving one harbor and entering another and the "red on right" changed to "green on right" becuase you were changing from "leaving" to "returning". If that make sense. and I am sure that some times a bouy or nav aid does not make sense to you right away. My point is that it is not a perfect system and will keep improving. I am sure that you have been to places where one time the markers were one way, and then they changed them and maybe years later they changed them again anyway safe cruising to us all. my boat goes out of the water tomorrow for the season. we had to cut it a little shorter this year. we usally go from April to Dec or Jan. Not to bad for a pleasure boat from chilly Boston. |
#30
posted to rec.boats.cruising
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On serious bilge pumping........
otnmbrd wrote:
"Roger Long" wrote in news:qPkjf.51442$uC3.511 @twister.nyroc.rr.com: No terribly clear but, buoys were never intended to be used without charts. I would disagree with that statement, to a point. The general flow of buoys (sticking to the East Coast,USA) is North to South, East to West (E-W is "old school") coming from sea. What this meant was that if you should see a buoy while moving along the coast and for whatever reason, you didn't have a chart/chart out of date/you're lost, based on the "N-S", you would know which side to pass. With out a doubt, a chart is your best bet to see and understand what the buoys mean, but be sure you look at the "BIG" picture of an area to check the overall direction the system is taking. otn That wouldn't work around Vancouver Island. I think your N-S, E-W premise is wrong. The buoyage system is meant to relate to the direction of flooding tides and around here it is very difficult, without a chart and/or tide table, to know which direction the flood goes. |
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