Situ: 6T full keel ketch with fouled or damaged mizzen halyard sheave,
air draft of main 50', same of mizzen approx 40'. I wish to incline
her alongside a high pier, for obvious reasons. I have done this with
a smaller sloop using a convenient mainmast halyard, but feel in this
situ that risks jamming another halyard (pulling it hard athwartships
off its sheave & creating 2 problems instead of solving one). There is
no spinnaker or other external-blocked halyard suitable for this.

If anyone has done this (only if you have, please!), I could use a
proven/practical rigging suggestion.

FWIW going aloft on the mizzen isn't an option view only a light
topping lift is available there.

Frank

In article .com,
wrote:

Situ: 6T full keel ketch with fouled or damaged mizzen halyard sheave,
air draft of main 50', same of mizzen approx 40'. I wish to incline
her alongside a high pier, for obvious reasons. I have done this with
a smaller sloop using a convenient mainmast halyard, but feel in this
situ that risks jamming another halyard (pulling it hard athwartships
off its sheave & creating 2 problems instead of solving one). There is
no spinnaker or other external-blocked halyard suitable for this.

If anyone has done this (only if you have, please!), I could use a
proven/practical rigging suggestion.

FWIW going aloft on the mizzen isn't an option view only a light
topping lift is available there.

Frank


Dock mates used a household ladder to get up their mast.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

In Jere Lull writes:

In article .com,
wrote:

Situ: 6T full keel ketch with fouled or damaged mizzen halyard sheave,
air draft of main 50', same of mizzen approx 40'. I wish to incline
her alongside a high pier, for obvious reasons. I have done this with
a smaller sloop using a convenient mainmast halyard, but feel in this
situ that risks jamming another halyard (pulling it hard athwartships
off its sheave & creating 2 problems instead of solving one). There is
no spinnaker or other external-blocked halyard suitable for this.

If anyone has done this (only if you have, please!), I could use a
proven/practical rigging suggestion.

FWIW going aloft on the mizzen isn't an option view only a light
topping lift is available there.

Frank


Dock mates used a household ladder to get up their mast.

If there is a topping lift in the mast, why not use this one to pull a
stronger hallyar/rope in the place of the topping lift and then go to
the top of the mast?

- Lauri Tarkkonen

Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:

If there is a topping lift in the mast, why not use this one to pull a
stronger hallyar/rope in the place of the topping lift and then go to
the top of the mast?

It's sheave isn't large enough to reave a sufficiently stronger line
(at least, if *I* am going take the chair at 150 lbs human live load,
and we have no 50 lb lad who is skilled). It's the first thing I
thought of.

ISTM a strategy is needed for rigging a line around the mainmast near
its top to shore, or other suitable means for safely inclining her
about 25 deg with minimal force for 1/2 hour or so, short of securing
massive deck ballast.

I'm sure this problem's been solved in a half-dozen ways for a few
thousand years...

wrote:
Lauri Tarkkonen wrote:


If there is a topping lift in the mast, why not use this one to pull a
stronger hallyar/rope in the place of the topping lift and then go to
the top of the mast?


It's sheave isn't large enough to reave a sufficiently stronger line
(at least, if *I* am going take the chair at 150 lbs human live load,
and we have no 50 lb lad who is skilled). It's the first thing I
thought of.

ISTM a strategy is needed for rigging a line around the mainmast near
its top to shore, or other suitable means for safely inclining her
about 25 deg with minimal force for 1/2 hour or so, short of securing
massive deck ballast.

I'm sure this problem's been solved in a half-dozen ways for a few
thousand years...

http://www.neropes.com/techdata/v12.htm

Vectran V12 5mm Tensile strength 4750 lbs
Derate 15% then apply factor of safety of 15 (reccomended for lifelines)
and you get 269 lbs safe working load assuming you can cleat it without
damaging it and secure it to your harness without using a known to be
weak knot. Even if you loose 40% of the strength in securing it if you
haven't 'underestimated' your weight you have about 10 lbs in hand for
clothing, tools etc.

Watch out, its fairly slippery and *will* slip on a cleat if you treat
it like a normal rope. Figure on needing about twice the turns for it to
grip compaired to a polyester rope. I'd trust an anchor bend with the
tail seized to the standing part to attach it to the harness or bosun's
chair. Anyone handling the tail for you should be wearing kevlar
gloves. I'd also rolling hitch a safety line round the mast and push it
up as you go.

As to your other idea, If you still want to heel her, Why not go up the
main mast and tie a sling securely round it with a substantial block on
it and a line through that block with a clear lead down to your anchor
windlass and also out to the quay?





--
Ian Malcolm. London, ENGLAND. (NEWSGROUP REPLY PREFERRED)
ianm[at]the[dash]malcolms[dot]freeserve[dot]co[dot]uk
[at]=@, [dash]=- & [dot]=. *Warning* HTML & 32K emails -- NUL:
'Stingo' Albacore #1554 - 15' Early 60's, Uffa Fox designed,
All varnished hot moulded wooden racing dinghy.

wrote:
Situ: 6T full keel ketch with fouled or damaged mizzen halyard sheave,
air draft of main 50', same of mizzen approx 40'. I wish to incline
her alongside a high pier, for obvious reasons. I have done this with
a smaller sloop using a convenient mainmast halyard, but feel in this
situ that risks jamming another halyard (pulling it hard athwartships
off its sheave & creating 2 problems instead of solving one). There is
no spinnaker or other external-blocked halyard suitable for this.

If anyone has done this (only if you have, please!), I could use a
proven/practical rigging suggestion.

FWIW going aloft on the mizzen isn't an option view only a light
topping lift is available there.

Frank


Inclining the boat to reach the masthead from a high pier does not
seem like a good idea to me. Maybe you should hire a cherry picker
with a man bucket to go up the twenty feet, whatever, difference?

You still have to worry about wakes, etc rolling the boat.

Climbing the mizzen can be accomplished using the main's halyard to
assist, if it is bridled around the mizzen and the man climbs from
abaft, using his grip to assist the ascent and a second bridle to
assist surmounting the spreaders. Suitable mountain gear carabiners
are safe. A topping lift on a boat that size should be strong enough
to safely support a crew member, or yourself. Mine, on a 29 footer,
is strong enough to lift a MOB easily, using the main sheet tackle
on the boom end. Test yours by hanging two or three men an inch or
two above the deck.

Ascender gear can reliably clutch a wire topping lift. A line taken
to the top can be secured to assist further in the descent, to be
lowered once the halyard works, or used if another trip be
neccessitated, perhaps by a lack of parts.

A bridle made from lines flipped over the shrouds above the
spreaders using the main halyard to lift them into flipping position
chould also assist getting part way up, or at least to slow the
descent of any otherwise unassisted descender, should ascencion
prove unnerving and the grip on the mast unbreakable. He will
eventually tire and start to slide down.

The sail track or luff groove is likely strong enough to support a
well engineered grip system for ascent and descent. An appropriate
bolt head twisted in the groove can hold an impressive weight.

Yes, I have climbed a mast using improvised means. Once you are
above 15 feet or so, the height doesn't matter any more, if the
rolling does. A couple of hundred bucks should be enough inducement
for any young buck, or even a scared girl to go up there, towing a
tool bucket line. A tether loop around the mast should be used to
prevent excessive excursion should the Bob detach from the mast and
threaten to ding it swinging with the rolls on the end of his
skyline, or cause excessive g loads on the rig, flogging in the breeze.

A comfortable bosun's chair with stirrups is a neccessity.

Be prepared to push the masthead fitting up using a lifted top mast
jack rig, if you will need to get at the sheave axels to replace a
sheave.

I'd offer, if I wasn't getting old with a bad back and wonky
shoulder. Hell, for enough money, I'd do it anyway.

You should be prepared to do all this at sea in heavy weather,
anyway. You could need it someday.

Next time, you should have a spare halyard rigged, damn the extra
weight, you want to fly a fisherman anyway, right?

Why not unstep the mast, using the main halyard to lower it?

Terry K

Ian Malcolm wrote:

Vectran V12 5mm Tensile strength 4750 lbs

Thank you for the pointer toward & brief education about hi-tech ropes!
NE Rope is only 3 hrs away & there are 2 distributors right on our
waterfront.

As to your other idea, If you still want to heel her, Why not go up the
main mast and tie a sling securely round it with a substantial block on
it and a line through that block with a clear lead down to your anchor
windlass and also out to the quay?

I had been trying to think of a way to sling the main high without
going up & already have the sling & snatchblock. If I have to go up
the main to do it, I may as well forget that & go aloft the mizzen with
adequate rope, & be done with it.

My only other idea was that she's berthed at a bulk cargo terminal
where there are cranes & a man lift, maybe a bottle of booze in the
right direction...evil look...

LL/whack forehead dep't: it's an item that got overlooked by both
surveyor & buyer/owner during the transaction; had it been checked, the
seller would've been responsible for it before she left the yard, or
adjustment would've been made at closing. During the brief survey sea
trial, only main & heads'l were flown due inclement weather. Surveyor
has 48 yrs experience & found everything else imagineable. (not my
boat)

Frank

Terry Spragg wrote:

(excellent input & reminders snipped)

You should be prepared to do all this at sea in heavy weather,
anyway. You could need it someday.

I'm not 20 & enroute to Bermuda in a lagging academy race with a
snapped headstay anymore. I am a chicken now & not sure if I've kept a
short enough account with God. :-)

Next time, you should have a spare halyard rigged, damn the extra
weight, you want to fly a fisherman anyway, right?

Ya think? Nottamybote - close friend's new buy. But he's a
professional ropechoker (deckie) & I'm sure he'll come around to such
things...sort of funny that as an engr I hung extra halyards on my own
the first week I had her, go figureg. Extra weight etc. no issue,
big heavy motorsailer. But some mods to masthead(s) needed to hang
anything else. Seems Fischer felt she'd only ever need minimum running
rigging (but robust).

Why not unstep the mast, using the main halyard to lower it?

Lots of interference at the stern to remove for a low enough DIY
routine to reach things w/o the same basic problems as inclining her.
Besides we are basically lazy. ;-) The manlift & a friendly bribe is
sounding better by the minute...

Much thx,
Frank
Chicken