Marc Auslander wrote:

I have read, and it seems plausible, that in bad enough conditions, a
kellet does no good because it can't really deflect the rode very
much. And it may cause trouble if it starts to bounce up and down -
pulling up on the rode on the upswings. I would think a mooring ball
would similarly fail under extreme load.


Strange how similar in effect kellet and float are, and how different.

The ball sinks, deflecting the snubbing chain / painter junction to
a degree adjustable at the painter end. Once it floats, it implies
that mooring forces are minimalised. Any tangle occurs at the surface.

A kellet can only effect snubbing to one degree, unless it slides
and is adjustable. Once it rests on the bottom, it implies that the
mooring forces are minimalised. There is also a tangle possible, at
the bottom.

A longer float painter can produce a larger and more gentle
anti-snubbing force in either analysis.

Under the most demanding conditions, both a kellet and a float with
a long painter totalling sufficient scope are best, wether at
anchor or mooring weight. A strong nylon painter is preferrable to a
light floating painter, except if the tide and wind conspire, until
the floating painter is wound around the keel root. That is probably
easier to clean up than is a tangle on the bottom.

Perhaps a cart before the horse? A float with a long painter and a
kellet on the painter between the float and the boat? Perhaps a
daisy chain of floats with kellets suspended barely above the
bottom? Perhaps even a clothesline or string, with which to bring
the moored boat's stern within wading distance of the shore, or
floating dock out to the boat? (I draw 2'-10".) I presently can draw
the dinghy out to the mooring using a messenger cable instead of
oars, but the dinghy is too small for that to be really convenient.
Cable ferries are common out here.

We do get some medium sized wakes.

This ties in with a desire to provide isolated bifilar hydro to my
moored boat, perhaps via a mooring raft made of tires on wheels?
That would require a swivel above the float and a strong stainless
steel messenger wire to the shore, such as I presently use to
retrieve the sunken mooring chain after the ice goes out. A two wire
extension cord, isolated, in fresh water, may work out well. How
much current would you expect a similar circuit to draw if the
outlet was dropped in salt water? How dangerous would you expect
such a mishap to be?

I get a feeling that might not be a bad plan, and see that there may
be no tangle, despite wind and tide conspiracies, except I cannot
really trust what such a daisy chain might do under Murphy's
influence. I'm gonna give it a try. Any experiences? Any bets?

Perhaps pennant is a better word?

Terry K


(Steve Smith) writes:


Hi all

Having looked at Chapman's 'Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat
Handling' (now available in your local library for UK readers), I was
a bit surprised to see recommended that a mooring-type buoy be used
rather than attaching some other flotation to the intact anchor chain
(one more link to go wrong). I think Hinz discusses this in his books
but I haven't managed to get hold of any in the UK.

I know this method of anchoring is for extreme conditions but has
anyone any experience with it or the alternative method of using
weights slid down the rode. I would guess there is a better argument
for avoiding shock loading than there is for anchor dragging and that
the buoy method is better at doing this.
I am assuming all chain here due to chafe resistance.

Regards

Steve

Remove defcv if etc.

Terry, don't confuse these guys with facts. They were going off in all
directions at one time and here you come along and make sense. You will have
them spinning in circles for weeks.

From: Terry Spragg
Date: 11/5/2004 2:37 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id:

Marc Auslander wrote:

I have read, and it seems plausible, that in bad enough conditions, a
kellet does no good because it can't really deflect the rode very
much. And it may cause trouble if it starts to bounce up and down -
pulling up on the rode on the upswings. I would think a mooring ball
would similarly fail under extreme load.


Strange how similar in effect kellet and float are, and how different.

The ball sinks, deflecting the snubbing chain / painter junction to
a degree adjustable at the painter end. Once it floats, it implies
that mooring forces are minimalised. Any tangle occurs at the surface.

A kellet can only effect snubbing to one degree, unless it slides
and is adjustable. Once it rests on the bottom, it implies that the
mooring forces are minimalised. There is also a tangle possible, at
the bottom.

A longer float painter can produce a larger and more gentle
anti-snubbing force in either analysis.

Under the most demanding conditions, both a kellet and a float with
a long painter totalling sufficient scope are best, wether at
anchor or mooring weight. A strong nylon painter is preferrable to a
light floating painter, except if the tide and wind conspire, until
the floating painter is wound around the keel root. That is probably
easier to clean up than is a tangle on the bottom.

Perhaps a cart before the horse? A float with a long painter and a
kellet on the painter between the float and the boat? Perhaps a
daisy chain of floats with kellets suspended barely above the
bottom? Perhaps even a clothesline or string, with which to bring
the moored boat's stern within wading distance of the shore, or
floating dock out to the boat? (I draw 2'-10".) I presently can draw
the dinghy out to the mooring using a messenger cable instead of
oars, but the dinghy is too small for that to be really convenient.
Cable ferries are common out here.

We do get some medium sized wakes.

This ties in with a desire to provide isolated bifilar hydro to my
moored boat, perhaps via a mooring raft made of tires on wheels?
That would require a swivel above the float and a strong stainless
steel messenger wire to the shore, such as I presently use to
retrieve the sunken mooring chain after the ice goes out. A two wire
extension cord, isolated, in fresh water, may work out well. How
much current would you expect a similar circuit to draw if the
outlet was dropped in salt water? How dangerous would you expect
such a mishap to be?

I get a feeling that might not be a bad plan, and see that there may
be no tangle, despite wind and tide conspiracies, except I cannot
really trust what such a daisy chain might do under Murphy's
influence. I'm gonna give it a try. Any experiences? Any bets?

Perhaps pennant is a better word?

Terry K


(Steve Smith) writes:


Hi all

Having looked at Chapman's 'Piloting, Seamanship and Small Boat
Handling' (now available in your local library for UK readers), I was
a bit surprised to see recommended that a mooring-type buoy be used
rather than attaching some other flotation to the intact anchor chain
(one more link to go wrong). I think Hinz discusses this in his books
but I haven't managed to get hold of any in the UK.

I know this method of anchoring is for extreme conditions but has
anyone any experience with it or the alternative method of using
weights slid down the rode. I would guess there is a better argument
for avoiding shock loading than there is for anchor dragging and that
the buoy method is better at doing this.
I am assuming all chain here due to chafe resistance.

Regards

Steve

Remove defcv if etc.