On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

In article .com,
says...
Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point of
expansion."


No! No! Can't be true. Why, if that is true then Willie-boy is wrong.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 04 May 2011 20:21:55 -0400, Wayne B
wrote:

On Wed, 4 May 2011 19:21:38 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

She said she even took the software off her computer
because of the attacks and 'chest-thumping' which she could not abide.

That's odd since "she" is still posting on rec.boats under a different
name.


Bi-polar disorder?
Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 4 May 2011 17:10:35 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article .com,
llid says...
"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article .com,
llid says...
Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form
there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze
water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the
cause
of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a
system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point
of
expansion."




Ah HAH! The point of expansion - EXACTLY! The refrigerant only begins to
expand AFTER the choke point. Up to the choke point, the compressed
refrigerant is actually warm.

Not in an overcharged system.

EXACT-****ING-LY. If you were capable of reading with comprehension you
would have read my saying exactly THAT. I said to bleed some excess pressure
from your system and enjoy a working system even if you refuse to acknowlege
my excellent advice, PUTZ!

Nope Willie, like a lot of things you read but you didn't understand.
The chap you quoted has it right, the temperature drop takes place AT
the point of expansion, not someplace after the orifice.

You must have a rather odd edition of a basic physics manual - the
temperature drop occurs somewhere downstream of the orifice.....

Nope Willie, you got it wrong and all the ducking and diving that you
do isn't going to prove that it right.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 4 May 2011 14:50:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause
of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a
system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point
of
expansion."

That was my recent experience on the second of two systems that I
installed on our boat. After encountering symptoms similar to yours,
I ordered a new vacuum pump from Amazon for about $100 (cheaper than a
service call, and I already had a gauge set and can tap). I left the
vacuum pump running for 9 hours, checked to make sure that the system
was holding vacuum, and then recharged. It has been running fine ever
since.

I just ordered the vacuum pump today, from Harbor Freight. $100 plus tax
and
shipping. I don't have the guage set. Way cheaper than a service call and
I
might even be able to rent it out at the marina.




What a dumbass, you are Gogarty. In the process of spending money on a
vacuum pump you will do exactly as I suggested. You will remove the
overcharge of refrigerant and put back the right amount. Sadly, you could
have accomplished the very same thing by the simple expedient of bleeding
off the excess pressure.

So many MORONS, so little time . . .

Wilbur Hubbard


A nice sashay around the problem that you don't know what you are
talking about.

But you are wrong anyway. Over charging a system doesn't result in a
problem such as the O.P. wrote about.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 4 May 2011 12:29:23 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article .com,
llid says...
Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form
there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause
of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a
system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point of
expansion."




Ah HAH! The point of expansion - EXACTLY! The refrigerant only begins to
expand AFTER the choke point. Up to the choke point, the compressed
refrigerant is actually warm. After it gets past the choke point it can then
expand and become cold as it expands. If you look at the evaporator you will
see a couple of interesting things. The large diameter copper tubing from
the compressor chokes down to a spiral of very small diameter copper tubing
(choke point) which spirals around the larger copper tube. The whole
freaking thing has warm refrigerant inside...

Willie-boy it is a crying shame that you don't know anything about
refrigeration systems, or physics for that matter. The temperature of
a gas decreases at the point the pressure drops. Not at some point
downstream of the orifice (not "check point, you fool) and water
freezing and blocking the system at that point is a common problem in
refrigeration systems.

Only AFTER the choke point where the refrigerant can begin to expand does
the evaporator get cold.

Once again, you don't know what you are talking about. The temperature
decrease is AT the orifice, not downstream of it.


Willy-boy you are not only demonstrating your ignorance of fridge
systems but you are demonstrating just how big a fool you are.

You voiced your opinion about osmosis - Wrong. Next you try to recover
your credibility by talking about fridge systems - Wrong again.

I wonder whether you will ever be right.


snip
Wilbur Hubbard

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 4 May 2011 20:46:55 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Wayne B" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 4 May 2011 19:21:38 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

She said she even took the software off her computer
because of the attacks and 'chest-thumping' which she could not abide.

That's odd since "she" is still posting on rec.boats under a different
name.




Endeplume??? How do you know they are the same person? Jessica was a
conservative voice and deplume is a rabid asshole liberal. Their headers are
suspiciously similar, down to the news client and hushmail and even time
zone but there are lots of people out there on the left coast. The same
person would sound the same, have the same tone, etc.

Or Willie is deluded once again.
Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Thu, 05 May 2011 16:16:20 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Without the mainifold
one just runs the pump for a log time, removes the pump and attaches the R34a
can to the port with an adapter. The adapter has a gauge on it and a trigger
for squirting in the refrigerant. The system would not be running.

Normal practice is to charge the system from the low pressure port
with the compressor running. Before attaching the adapter to the low
pressure port it is a good idea to shoot a small amount of coolant
through the hose to clear out any residual air and moisture.

On Sat, 14 May 2011 15:48:03 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

I bought a vacuum pump, hoses for R134a refrigerant and a can of same.
Connected the suction-side port to the pump and ran it for about an hour.
Charged the evacuated system with refrigerant and started it. Presto! Now
running like brand new.

Anybody want to rent a vacuum pump and hoses? Needed only one hose, the blue
one, but they come in sets of red, blue and yellow.

Congratulations!

Now you're an expert and can go into business, at least on Usenet.

:-)

Even with the purchase of the vacuum pump and hoses you are still
ahead vs the cost of a service call, and now you know how to fix it
yourself. Since I've got a freezer and two fridges on board, I have
now acquired a full set of "stuff" including a leak detector, vacuum
pump with extra oil, an assortment of can taps, the Nigel Calder
books, and a couple of gauge/hose sets.

See you in the Out Islands with cold beer and frozen fish. :-)

On Sat, 14 May 2011 15:48:03 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Wilbur, eat your heart out -- if you have one.

In the face of comments from many far better informed about refrigerators you
continued to insist that the problem with my fridge was overcharging. Given
the manner in which the machine was operating, the consensus diagnosis was
water vapor causing ice at the orifice and blocking refrigerant flow. The
machine would run perfectly for about ten minutes then stop cooling while the
compressor got hot and the pressure-side line to the condenser got cold.

I bought a vacuum pump, hoses for R134a refrigerant and a can of same.
Connected the suction-side port to the pump and ran it for about an hour.
Charged the evacuated system with refrigerant and started it. Presto! Now
running like brand new.

Anybody want to rent a vacuum pump and hoses? Needed only one hose, the blue
one, but they come in sets of red, blue and yellow.


And yet another pebble added to the pile of proof that Willy-boy knows
not of what he speaks.

Cheers,

Bruce

"Bruce" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 14 May 2011 15:48:03 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Wilbur, eat your heart out -- if you have one.

In the face of comments from many far better informed about refrigerators
you
continued to insist that the problem with my fridge was overcharging.
Given
the manner in which the machine was operating, the consensus diagnosis was
water vapor causing ice at the orifice and blocking refrigerant flow. The
machine would run perfectly for about ten minutes then stop cooling while
the
compressor got hot and the pressure-side line to the condenser got cold.

I bought a vacuum pump, hoses for R134a refrigerant and a can of same.
Connected the suction-side port to the pump and ran it for about an hour.
Charged the evacuated system with refrigerant and started it. Presto! Now
running like brand new.

Anybody want to rent a vacuum pump and hoses? Needed only one hose, the
blue
one, but they come in sets of red, blue and yellow.


And yet another pebble added to the pile of proof that Willy-boy knows
not of what he speaks.



He, in effect, did just what I recommended he should. But, instead of simply
letting some of the extra refrigerant out, he vacuumed it out and then added
the correct amount back.

Sounds like proof that I was correct, Mr. Know-it-all.

Wilbur Hubbard