Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?



Wilbur Hubbard

On Tue, 3 May 2011 20:18:09 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?



Wilbur Hubbard


Jesus but you are stupid. Or perhaps you didn't read this part in your
magazine. But in an attempt to educate (yes I know pearls before
swine) you I'll tell you what happens.

The expanding gas decreases in both pressure and temperature rapidly
and is cold enough to freeze water. As you rightly note the
temperature in the entire capillary tube, actually an orifice in
practice, is not cold enough to form ice however at the point of
pressure drop it certainly is. Whether the blockage actually takes
place at the beginning of the tube or at the end of the tube is
immaterial, it happens, the tube is blocked, and the symptoms are
certainly familiar to what the O.P. noted.

I'm amazed at your lack of knowledge about refrigeration systems. You
certainly don't have experience with anything more sophisticated then
a kitchen fridge. Certainly nothing as complex as an automobile
air-con which, along with all of the more efficient systems, uses an
expansion valve rather then the rudimentary capillary tube and I might
point out that water in a system with an expansion valve acts exactly
as the O.P. stated.

As a wise man once said, "it is better to remain silent and be thought
a fool then to open one's mouth and prove it."

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point of
expansion."

That was my recent experience on the second of two systems that I
installed on our boat. After encountering symptoms similar to yours,
I ordered a new vacuum pump from Amazon for about $100 (cheaper than a
service call, and I already had a gauge set and can tap). I left the
vacuum pump running for 9 hours, checked to make sure that the system
was holding vacuum, and then recharged. It has been running fine ever
since.

"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause
of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a
system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point
of
expansion."

That was my recent experience on the second of two systems that I
installed on our boat. After encountering symptoms similar to yours,
I ordered a new vacuum pump from Amazon for about $100 (cheaper than a
service call, and I already had a gauge set and can tap). I left the
vacuum pump running for 9 hours, checked to make sure that the system
was holding vacuum, and then recharged. It has been running fine ever
since.

I just ordered the vacuum pump today, from Harbor Freight. $100 plus tax
and
shipping. I don't have the guage set. Way cheaper than a service call and
I
might even be able to rent it out at the marina.




What a dumbass, you are Gogarty. In the process of spending money on a
vacuum pump you will do exactly as I suggested. You will remove the
overcharge of refrigerant and put back the right amount. Sadly, you could
have accomplished the very same thing by the simple expedient of bleeding
off the excess pressure.

So many MORONS, so little time . . .

Wilbur Hubbard

On Wed, 4 May 2011 14:50:16 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Gogarty" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause
of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a
system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point
of
expansion."

That was my recent experience on the second of two systems that I
installed on our boat. After encountering symptoms similar to yours,
I ordered a new vacuum pump from Amazon for about $100 (cheaper than a
service call, and I already had a gauge set and can tap). I left the
vacuum pump running for 9 hours, checked to make sure that the system
was holding vacuum, and then recharged. It has been running fine ever
since.

I just ordered the vacuum pump today, from Harbor Freight. $100 plus tax
and
shipping. I don't have the guage set. Way cheaper than a service call and
I
might even be able to rent it out at the marina.




What a dumbass, you are Gogarty. In the process of spending money on a
vacuum pump you will do exactly as I suggested. You will remove the
overcharge of refrigerant and put back the right amount. Sadly, you could
have accomplished the very same thing by the simple expedient of bleeding
off the excess pressure.

So many MORONS, so little time . . .

Wilbur Hubbard


A nice sashay around the problem that you don't know what you are
talking about.

But you are wrong anyway. Over charging a system doesn't result in a
problem such as the O.P. wrote about.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Wed, 04 May 2011 14:46:54 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

I just ordered the vacuum pump today, from Harbor Freight. $100 plus tax and
shipping. I don't have the guage set. Way cheaper than a service call and I
might even be able to rent it out at the marina.

You really need a gauge set also to properly use the vacuum pump and
recharge the system. The valves on the gauge set allow you to vacuum
both the high and low pressure side at the same time, and then seal
off the high pressure side, purge the low pressure hose and recharge.
It is important to do things in the right sequence to avoid exploding
the recharge can and/or reintroduce moisture to the system. The gauge
set also gives you an indication that the system is fully charged.
Be careful not to overcharge - you can damage the compressor.

On Thu, 05 May 2011 16:16:20 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

Without the mainifold
one just runs the pump for a log time, removes the pump and attaches the R34a
can to the port with an adapter. The adapter has a gauge on it and a trigger
for squirting in the refrigerant. The system would not be running.

Normal practice is to charge the system from the low pressure port
with the compressor running. Before attaching the adapter to the low
pressure port it is a good idea to shoot a small amount of coolant
through the hose to clear out any residual air and moisture.

On Wed, 04 May 2011 10:43:28 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

In article .com,
says...
Duh. WAKE UP. The refrigerant is hot or warm in the orifice in the choke
point. It's still compressed there. Ain't no way ice is going to form there.
Debris blocking it maybe; ice - NO! Only when the refrigerant exits the
choke point and begins to expand does it get cold enough to freeze water.
This happens AFTER the choke point and not at the choke point.

Is everybody on RBC stupid? Are they all Bruce in Bangkok clones or
something?

Here ya be:

"Moisture in a refrigeration system, directly or indirectly, is the cause of
most problems and complaints. First, moisture can cause freeze-up in a system.
Moisture is picked up by the refrigerant and transported through the
refrigerant line in a fine mist, with ice crystals forming at the point of
expansion."


No! No! Can't be true. Why, if that is true then Willie-boy is wrong.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Sat, 14 May 2011 15:48:03 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

I bought a vacuum pump, hoses for R134a refrigerant and a can of same.
Connected the suction-side port to the pump and ran it for about an hour.
Charged the evacuated system with refrigerant and started it. Presto! Now
running like brand new.

Anybody want to rent a vacuum pump and hoses? Needed only one hose, the blue
one, but they come in sets of red, blue and yellow.

Congratulations!

Now you're an expert and can go into business, at least on Usenet.

:-)

Even with the purchase of the vacuum pump and hoses you are still
ahead vs the cost of a service call, and now you know how to fix it
yourself. Since I've got a freezer and two fridges on board, I have
now acquired a full set of "stuff" including a leak detector, vacuum
pump with extra oil, an assortment of can taps, the Nigel Calder
books, and a couple of gauge/hose sets.

See you in the Out Islands with cold beer and frozen fish. :-)

On Sun, 15 May 2011 11:16:57 -0400, Gogarty
wrote:

See you in the Out Islands with cold beer and frozen fish. :-)

I wish. It's Long Island Sound if the weather ever gets right.


We're headed your way, probably in WLIS by mid-June. Right now were a
little further south:

http://www.tinyurl.com/waynebspottrack

:-)