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M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 14:48:08 -0800, Capt. JG wrote:
Come on... Germany eliminated the ghetto.. liquidated it. You would be hard-pressed to find even an extremist zionist to advocate that. I originally used the word "similarities". You introduced the word "comparable". Do I equate Israeli behavior with Nazi behavior? No. Do I think Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is right? No. Israel is a democratic society. As such, it is made of of a multitude of views, including extremist. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 15:35:01 -0600, Dave wrote:
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 13:37:15 -0600, said: Gaza is a prison in which women, children, and other innocent civilians are forced to live. That certainly qualifies as the stupidest statement of the year to date. What's stupid? That there are innocent civilians in Gaza, or that it is a prison? It seems to fit this definition: 1. A place where persons are confined, or restrained of personal liberty; hence, a place or state o? confinement, restraint, or safe custody. [1913 Webster] |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
slide wrote:
Capt. JG wrote: "slide" wrote in message I am NOT defending random tossing of missiles into Israel by these guys. Not even close. I'm only saying that, IMO, US policy isn't looking at the entire picture. I agree... we're not looking at the entire picture. We need to be a relatively unbiased broker if we want to help resolve the conflict. However, your statement that all the people who immigrated to Israel with sponsored by the wealthy is false. I know for a fact that's false, since I have some very unwealthy friends who moved there on their own, struggled for years, and finally became what we would call middle class. There are Palestinian Israelis who own businesses and have money... not as many as there are Jewish Israelis certainly. There are many unbiased brokers but neither side will abide by their decisions or even sit down with them. I can nominate Finland or Norway as two good candidates for neutrality. The problem is (I've spoken to many Israelis here) that the Jews believe themselves to be a special case. They don't see any inconsistency between demanding racial integration for the US or South Africa but refusing it for Israel because it means 'national survival'. That is, in time, the Arab would be more than 50% of the population and out vote the Jew - which they welcome in South Africa but won't stand for at home. Even before then, if the Arab could have members in the Knesset, the Jews would have to deal them in for consideration in policy. Clearly the Jews are utterly unwilling to do that - again national survival. You claim to have some knowledge but seem to be woefully ignorant on this point - more than 10% (14 of 120) of the Knesset members are Arab. The current Minister of Science, Culture, and Sport is Arab, as well as the current Deputy Knesset Speaker. There have been Arabs in the Knesset since the first election in 1949. If I push it, then they throw the German Exterminations in my face which tends to be a discussion stopper. Given that Hamas has vowed to exterminate them, it does seem like a relevant comparison. The Arab is probably as bad in he feels like his home was taken from him by greedy Jews backed by the evil USA & UK. How accurate is that? I can't say but the Arab says they are victims and the Jews say they are the victimizer. By this time both sides have outraged the other so often that either can make a case for exterminating the other. But I've never heard Jews call for Arab extermination. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
In article , Larry wrote:
The whole civil rights movement in the USA was started, funded and run, not by blacks like Martin Luther King, but by JEWS, Communist Jews trying to divide and conquer from within American Society. Zionism and Communism have a long paper trail back into Czarist Russia, where Zionist Jews pulled russia apart promoting Communism to bring Russia under their control.....financial control, just like the good ol' USA. [snip] Well, never mind. Stick your heads back in the sand and let the Zionists kick your stupid asses. You can't live where they live. YOU'RE not good enough. Jesus H Christ! WTF?! Gonna go get me a bucket of sand and stick my head in it, I can't take any more of this! I like Larry, he's told some good tales, and told them well, but this is something else. Justin. -- Justin C, by the sea. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
In article , Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
I don't follow M. East politics much but didn't the Israelis agree to negotiate some sort of peace scheme with the Palestinians? AIUI it fell apart just before Christmas with first wave of missiles from the Palestinians. Justin. -- Justin C, by the sea. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 14:46:18 -0700, slide
wrote: Capt. JG wrote: "slide" wrote in message Uh, the wall, the machine guns, the lack of any representation within the Knesset - those are, if mentioned, just more Antisemitism. Not at all. Those should be up for discussion and should be, must be resolved. The difference is that Larry cries Zionistist plots and spews anti-Jewish statements whenever he pleases. He's got the right to do that, but I have just as much right to call him on it. I'm not Larry & I see no Zoinist plots here. What I do see is a society which excludes due to race or religion and the refusal of the ruling class to even discuss the matter. Following is an interesting statement, from the Israeli point of view. Please note that it dates from the time of the Sharon Government. In less than two years, 720 Jews - equivalent in population terms to 39,600 Americans or 13 September 11s -have been murdered by Arab terrorists. Sort of gives some prospective to the whole problem doesn't it? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 07:36:47 -0700, slide
wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 15:31:13 -0700, slide But there large numbers of Arabs living and working inside Israel. Wasn't one of the big complaints about the "wall" that it was "hard to get to work"? They are essentially green card guest workers brought in to clean the bathrooms of the ruling class Jews. They have no political power. It's like colored guys in the US, 1920's. They were 10% of the population but 0% of the political power structure. Gee, thought they had the presidency? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 18:00:33 -0600, wrote:
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 15:35:01 -0600, Dave wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 13:37:15 -0600, said: Gaza is a prison in which women, children, and other innocent civilians are forced to live. That certainly qualifies as the stupidest statement of the year to date. What's stupid? That there are innocent civilians in Gaza, or that it is a prison? It seems to fit this definition: 1. A place where persons are confined, or restrained of personal liberty; hence, a place or state o? confinement, restraint, or safe custody. [1913 Webster] Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Capt. JG" wrote in
easolutions: Not at all. Those should be up for discussion and should be, must be resolved. The difference is that Larry cries Zionistist plots and spews anti-Jewish statements whenever he pleases. He's got the right to do that, but I have just as much right to call him on it. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Do, or did, your kids go to a public school or a Jewish school? |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 16:50:35 -0500, Marty wrote:
wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 10:05:09 -0800, Capt. JG wrote: I don't believe in Zionist plots, but it's difficult to ignore the similarities between the Gaza strip, and the Warsaw Ghetto. It's easy to find similarities to many things if you look close enough. They are in no way comparable. It's a gross misstatement. Gaza is a terrible place, but it's not a walled in concentration camp. They're not comparable? Open your eyes. They are both walled in, movement of civilians is strictly controlled, food, fuel, medicine, strictly controlled. Gaza is a prison in which women, children, and other innocent civilians are forced to live. No way around it, the oppressed have become the oppressors. Why is it when talking about Gaza, people always seem to forget that it borders two countries? Ask yourself why the Islamic world isn't screaming to the heavens about the Egyptian blockade? Seems some, maybe a lot of Muslims don't want the Palestinians either. Cheers Martin At the time the Arabs initially fled Israel the Saudi Arabia have taken them al in, given them jobs and the whole mess of the Refugee Camps could have been avoided... but they didn't. Some avow that the reason was to keep the Arab - Jewish controversies alive for political reasons and now generations of Arabs have grown up in the Camps, a ready source of zealots to continue the war. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Stephen Trapani wrote in news:Drt7l.28550
: It is also the biggest reason it is our duty to help defend it. Stephen Greece is a democracy. The Czech Republic is a democracy. Taiwan is a democracy. Australia is a democracy, as is New Zealand. Canada is a democracy. Costa Rica is a democracy. Brazil is a democracy, too. Is it "our duty" to defend them all, or just Israel? As far as I know, we don't send billions of dollars on top of the table and more billions of dollars in military aid under the table to Costa Rica or New Zealand or Greece. Why not? Answer - AIPAC infiltration of the US government at the very highest levels.....now topped by one Rahm Emanuel sitting at the right hand of the President of the United States....a dual citizen of the State of Israel and former Israeli soldier. Which flag do you think he salutes FIRST? Why are FOREIGN NATIONALS in the highest level of the US Government in very sensitive, classified positions? It stinks..... |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Justin C wrote:
In article , Larry wrote: The whole civil rights movement in the USA was started, funded and run, not by blacks like Martin Luther King, but by JEWS, Communist Jews trying to divide and conquer from within American Society. Zionism and Communism have a long paper trail back into Czarist Russia, where Zionist Jews pulled russia apart promoting Communism to bring Russia under their control.....financial control, just like the good ol' USA. [snip] Well, never mind. Stick your heads back in the sand and let the Zionists kick your stupid asses. You can't live where they live. YOU'RE not good enough. Jesus H Christ! WTF?! Gonna go get me a bucket of sand and stick my head in it, I can't take any more of this! I like Larry, he's told some good tales, and told them well, but this is something else. Raging paranoia is a good quality in an electrician. Dangerous just about anywhere else. Stephen |
Seminolia hit by Floridian Rockets
TheRealSteve wrote in
: Larry, when you give all of your posessions (property, house, everything else you own) back to the INDIANS who had their land taken away from them so you can own it and you move back to Europe or wherever your forfathers emigrated from, then you may have a single iota of credability on this subject. Until then, you're just blowing smoke signals. Steve Isn't that EXACTLY what the Jews say the Palestinians did to the Jews millenia ago to give them the excuse that the land was already theirs before 1948? |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Larry wrote:
Stephen Trapani wrote in news:Drt7l.28550 : It is also the biggest reason it is our duty to help defend it. Stephen Greece is a democracy. The Czech Republic is a democracy. Taiwan is a democracy. Australia is a democracy, as is New Zealand. Canada is a democracy. Costa Rica is a democracy. Brazil is a democracy, too. Is it "our duty" to defend them all, or just Israel? All of them, of course, if they need it. As far as I know, we don't send billions of dollars on top of the table and more billions of dollars in military aid under the table to Costa Rica or New Zealand or Greece. Why not? Because they are not beset by terrorists on all sides who are trying to "wipe them from the face of the earth?" Except for maybe Taiwan, and we do support them, proportionate to their threat. Answer - AIPAC infiltration of the US government at the very highest levels.....now topped by one Rahm Emanuel sitting at the right hand of the President of the United States....a dual citizen of the State of Israel and former Israeli soldier. Which flag do you think he salutes FIRST? Why are FOREIGN NATIONALS in the highest level of the US Government in very sensitive, classified positions? What if there actually is no boogieman? Can you even imagine that anymore Larry? Stephen |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"jeff" wrote in message
... slide wrote: Capt. JG wrote: "slide" wrote in message I am NOT defending random tossing of missiles into Israel by these guys. Not even close. I'm only saying that, IMO, US policy isn't looking at the entire picture. I agree... we're not looking at the entire picture. We need to be a relatively unbiased broker if we want to help resolve the conflict. However, your statement that all the people who immigrated to Israel with sponsored by the wealthy is false. I know for a fact that's false, since I have some very unwealthy friends who moved there on their own, struggled for years, and finally became what we would call middle class. There are Palestinian Israelis who own businesses and have money... not as many as there are Jewish Israelis certainly. There are many unbiased brokers but neither side will abide by their decisions or even sit down with them. I can nominate Finland or Norway as two good candidates for neutrality. The problem is (I've spoken to many Israelis here) that the Jews believe themselves to be a special case. They don't see any inconsistency between demanding racial integration for the US or South Africa but refusing it for Israel because it means 'national survival'. That is, in time, the Arab would be more than 50% of the population and out vote the Jew - which they welcome in South Africa but won't stand for at home. Even before then, if the Arab could have members in the Knesset, the Jews would have to deal them in for consideration in policy. Clearly the Jews are utterly unwilling to do that - again national survival. You claim to have some knowledge but seem to be woefully ignorant on this point - more than 10% (14 of 120) of the Knesset members are Arab. The current Minister of Science, Culture, and Sport is Arab, as well as the current Deputy Knesset Speaker. There have been Arabs in the Knesset since the first election in 1949. If I push it, then they throw the German Exterminations in my face which tends to be a discussion stopper. Given that Hamas has vowed to exterminate them, it does seem like a relevant comparison. The Arab is probably as bad in he feels like his home was taken from him by greedy Jews backed by the evil USA & UK. How accurate is that? I can't say but the Arab says they are victims and the Jews say they are the victimizer. By this time both sides have outraged the other so often that either can make a case for exterminating the other. But I've never heard Jews call for Arab extermination. Well, there are always the facts. It trips up some people. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
... Larry wrote: Stephen Trapani wrote in news:Drt7l.28550 : It is also the biggest reason it is our duty to help defend it. Stephen Greece is a democracy. The Czech Republic is a democracy. Taiwan is a democracy. Australia is a democracy, as is New Zealand. Canada is a democracy. Costa Rica is a democracy. Brazil is a democracy, too. Is it "our duty" to defend them all, or just Israel? All of them, of course, if they need it. As far as I know, we don't send billions of dollars on top of the table and more billions of dollars in military aid under the table to Costa Rica or New Zealand or Greece. Why not? Because they are not beset by terrorists on all sides who are trying to "wipe them from the face of the earth?" Except for maybe Taiwan, and we do support them, proportionate to their threat. Answer - AIPAC infiltration of the US government at the very highest levels.....now topped by one Rahm Emanuel sitting at the right hand of the President of the United States....a dual citizen of the State of Israel and former Israeli soldier. Which flag do you think he salutes FIRST? Why are FOREIGN NATIONALS in the highest level of the US Government in very sensitive, classified positions? What if there actually is no boogieman? Can you even imagine that anymore Larry? Stephen We only gave $150M to the West Bank and Gaza, double from the previous year. Guess which country is third behind Israel and Egypt... Columbia... home of terrorists. http://www.vaughns-1-pagers.com/poli...oreign-aid.htm -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
wrote in message
t... On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 14:48:08 -0800, Capt. JG wrote: Come on... Germany eliminated the ghetto.. liquidated it. You would be hard-pressed to find even an extremist zionist to advocate that. I originally used the word "similarities". You introduced the word "comparable". Do I equate Israeli behavior with Nazi behavior? No. Do I think Israeli treatment of the Palestinians is right? No. Israel is a democratic society. As such, it is made of of a multitude of views, including extremist. Nope... you said "They're not comparable?" You used that word. First you used "similarities" to which I replied that they weren't comparable. Then you said they were.... Try again.... -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Larry" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: Not at all. Those should be up for discussion and should be, must be resolved. The difference is that Larry cries Zionistist plots and spews anti-Jewish statements whenever he pleases. He's got the right to do that, but I have just as much right to call him on it. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Do, or did, your kids go to a public school or a Jewish school? And the relevance is???? -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Stephen Trapani" wrote in message
... Justin C wrote: In article , Larry wrote: The whole civil rights movement in the USA was started, funded and run, not by blacks like Martin Luther King, but by JEWS, Communist Jews trying to divide and conquer from within American Society. Zionism and Communism have a long paper trail back into Czarist Russia, where Zionist Jews pulled russia apart promoting Communism to bring Russia under their control.....financial control, just like the good ol' USA. [snip] Well, never mind. Stick your heads back in the sand and let the Zionists kick your stupid asses. You can't live where they live. YOU'RE not good enough. Jesus H Christ! WTF?! Gonna go get me a bucket of sand and stick my head in it, I can't take any more of this! I like Larry, he's told some good tales, and told them well, but this is something else. Raging paranoia is a good quality in an electrician. Dangerous just about anywhere else. Stephen I guess he only uses one hand.... -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
slide wrote:
Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 15:31:13 -0700, slide But there large numbers of Arabs living and working inside Israel. Wasn't one of the big complaints about the "wall" that it was "hard to get to work"? They are essentially green card guest workers brought in to clean the bathrooms of the ruling class Jews. They have no political power. It's like colored guys in the US, 1920's. They were 10% of the population but 0% of the political power structure. You're really hung up on this claim there are no Arabs in the Knesset. Why are you ignoring the fact that 11% of the Knesset IS Arab? Or do you think that repeating lies over and over makes them true? |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Justin C wrote:
In article , Bruce In Bangkok wrote: I don't follow M. East politics much but didn't the Israelis agree to negotiate some sort of peace scheme with the Palestinians? AIUI it fell apart just before Christmas with first wave of missiles from the Palestinians. First wave? Never was a ceasefire from Hamas, during the course of the six months of the supposed ceasefire, they launched something like 1800 rockets into Israel. Since Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005, (remember that, they gave the land back, complete with new infrastructure, irrigation systems, roads, water works..etc,,,,since then it's fallen apart, nobody can keep anything more sophisticated than an oil lamp running) the nice Palestinians have launched more than 10,000 rockets at Israel. What other country, with the capability to completely destroy it's attacker would tolerate such? Cheers Martin |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
jeff wrote:
slide wrote: Bruce In Bangkok wrote: On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 15:31:13 -0700, slide But there large numbers of Arabs living and working inside Israel. Wasn't one of the big complaints about the "wall" that it was "hard to get to work"? They are essentially green card guest workers brought in to clean the bathrooms of the ruling class Jews. They have no political power. It's like colored guys in the US, 1920's. They were 10% of the population but 0% of the political power structure. You're really hung up on this claim there are no Arabs in the Knesset. Why are you ignoring the fact that 11% of the Knesset IS Arab? Or do you think that repeating lies over and over makes them true? It's just not cricket to use the facts Jeff! Cheers Martin |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Capt. JG" wrote in news:CuydnQE-
reasolutions: "Larry" wrote in message ... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: Not at all. Those should be up for discussion and should be, must be resolved. The difference is that Larry cries Zionistist plots and spews anti-Jewish statements whenever he pleases. He's got the right to do that, but I have just as much right to call him on it. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Do, or did, your kids go to a public school or a Jewish school? And the relevance is???? Just trying to discover your motives..... |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote:
Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
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M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message ... On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 18:00:33 -0600, wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 15:35:01 -0600, Dave wrote: On Fri, 02 Jan 2009 13:37:15 -0600, said: Gaza is a prison in which women, children, and other innocent civilians are forced to live. That certainly qualifies as the stupidest statement of the year to date. What's stupid? That there are innocent civilians in Gaza, or that it is a prison? It seems to fit this definition: 1. A place where persons are confined, or restrained of personal liberty; hence, a place or state o? confinement, restraint, or safe custody. [1913 Webster] Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) Some Palestinians don't want Israel to exist. Some Israelis don't want Palestine to exist. Both sides are working to wipe the other off the face of the Earth. Innocence is hard to find. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message
... On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 05:08:48 -0600, wrote: On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote: Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? Nope, the voters did that but as the "children" throw stones at Israeli soldiers and otherwise do their best to incite the situation how innocent can one consider them? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I consider the children mostly innocent. They do what most children do... follow their role models' lead. I understand why the adults voted in Hamas; Israel should have, could have, and should do more for the cause of peace, but that does not excuse the indescriminate firing of rockets and the calls for the descruction of Israel by the Hamas leadership. Both need to end. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Larry" wrote in message
... "Capt. JG" wrote in news:CuydnQE- reasolutions: "Larry" wrote in message ... "Capt. JG" wrote in easolutions: Not at all. Those should be up for discussion and should be, must be resolved. The difference is that Larry cries Zionistist plots and spews anti-Jewish statements whenever he pleases. He's got the right to do that, but I have just as much right to call him on it. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com Do, or did, your kids go to a public school or a Jewish school? And the relevance is???? Just trying to discover your motives..... My motives are obvious... it's called peace and acceptance. I don't need to discover your motives. You've made them clear. Did I mention that my father was a 32nd degree Mason, and that I got a call just before 9/11, so I called all my Jewish friends at Kanter/Fitzgerald, but they just ignored me? LOL http://article.nationalreview.com/?q...MwZjE2YzAxMGU= -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
wrote in news:kdedndTN_
et: On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote: Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? Yes. and those United States tanks and jets and helicopters are going to kill a lot of them, now that the invasion of the Gaza Concentration Camp has begun.... .....America now have even more innocent blood on its Zionist hands. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Dave wrote:
On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 09:20:46 -0600, "KLC Lewis" said: Some Palestinians don't want Israel to exist. Some Israelis don't want Palestine to exist. Both sides are working to wipe the other off the face of the Earth. Innocence is hard to find. Well said. Unfortunately truth has little appeal to the simple-minded, who prefer one-dimensional political slogans.. Ironic statement, considering that the false moral equivalence statement above is itself one dimensional. What some people in each society want is irrelevant. Hamas *is* working to wipe Israel off the face of the earth because Hamas considers all free societies evil. In the process they *target* innocent citizens on a regular basis. Israel is trying to wipe this evil religion along with those who will not abandon it off the face of the earth, but are find with Arab neighbors who leave them alone. Israel not only isn't targeting innocent Arabs, they are hampered by their moral superiority of avoiding harm to innocents as Hamas uses their own innocent citizens as human shields, hiding weapons and missile attacks among them. Those who refuse to recognize this stark difference in morality are themselves contributing to the advancement of evil. Stephen |
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On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 13:23:14 -0800, Stephen Trapani
wrote: Dave wrote: On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 09:20:46 -0600, "KLC Lewis" said: Some Palestinians don't want Israel to exist. Some Israelis don't want Palestine to exist. Both sides are working to wipe the other off the face of the Earth. Innocence is hard to find. Well said. Unfortunately truth has little appeal to the simple-minded, who prefer one-dimensional political slogans.. Ironic statement, considering that the false moral equivalence statement above is itself one dimensional. What some people in each society want is irrelevant. Hamas *is* working to wipe Israel off the face of the earth because Hamas considers all free societies evil. In the process they *target* innocent citizens on a regular basis. Israel is trying to wipe this evil religion along with those who will not abandon it off the face of the earth, but are find with Arab neighbors who leave them alone. Israel not only isn't targeting innocent Arabs, they are hampered by their moral superiority of avoiding harm to innocents as Hamas uses their own innocent citizens as human shields, hiding weapons and missile attacks among them. Those who refuse to recognize this stark difference in morality are themselves contributing to the advancement of evil. Stephen That's would be our Dave! |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:44:17 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote: "Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message .. . On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 05:08:48 -0600, wrote: On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote: Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? Nope, the voters did that but as the "children" throw stones at Israeli soldiers and otherwise do their best to incite the situation how innocent can one consider them? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I consider the children mostly innocent. They do what most children do... follow their role models' lead. I understand why the adults voted in Hamas; Israel should have, could have, and should do more for the cause of peace, but that does not excuse the indescriminate firing of rockets and the calls for the descruction of Israel by the Hamas leadership. Both need to end. I wonder whether you would find the "child" who carried a bomb into the restaurant where it exploded killing your wife/child/loved one so innocent as you feel at the moment sitting safely at home watching the T.V. As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. To get an impression of Islamic beliefs understand that it is 1430 in the Islamic calendar. Review Christian history for the mid 1400's A.D. and it will give you a fairly accurate picture. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
: As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. It's not just Islam, it's ALL OF THEM! Every relgion on the planet has a long history of genocide, proving beyond any shadow of a doubt there is no "god" and certainly no "saviour" who's gonna swoop down and save...er, ah....which group of religious murderers?? This superstitious phenomenon of the upper life forms may be the reason life cycles through a few million years then suddenly commits suicide for no apparent reason. There may a limit to how much "intelligence" life can withstand before that "intelligence" becomes its own death sentence, committing itself to self-destruction through the very death machines that big brain has superstitiously invented to terminate its species. 5,500+ humans die each day over religion. How utterly stupid! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkGpO1lQrLY |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message
... On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:44:17 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: "Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message . .. On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 05:08:48 -0600, wrote: On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote: Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? Nope, the voters did that but as the "children" throw stones at Israeli soldiers and otherwise do their best to incite the situation how innocent can one consider them? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I consider the children mostly innocent. They do what most children do... follow their role models' lead. I understand why the adults voted in Hamas; Israel should have, could have, and should do more for the cause of peace, but that does not excuse the indescriminate firing of rockets and the calls for the descruction of Israel by the Hamas leadership. Both need to end. I wonder whether you would find the "child" who carried a bomb into the restaurant where it exploded killing your wife/child/loved one so innocent as you feel at the moment sitting safely at home watching the T.V. As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. To get an impression of Islamic beliefs understand that it is 1430 in the Islamic calendar. Review Christian history for the mid 1400's A.D. and it will give you a fairly accurate picture. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I probably wouldn't but the child would be innocent and would have been used by an adult. Children's brains are not sufficiently developed to guarantee knowing right from wrong. That's why we don't as a rule execute kids. It is difficult, as you say, but it's not impossible. I also believe that most people, without regard to religion, would prefer peace and coexistence to war and death. Islam is not a "violent" religion, any more than Christianity or Judism. -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Larry" wrote in message
... Bruce In Bangkok wrote in : As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. It's not just Islam, it's ALL OF THEM! Every relgion on the planet has a long history of genocide, proving beyond any shadow of a doubt there is no "god" and certainly no "saviour" who's gonna swoop down and save...er, ah....which group of religious murderers?? This superstitious phenomenon of the upper life forms may be the reason life cycles through a few million years then suddenly commits suicide for no apparent reason. There may a limit to how much "intelligence" life can withstand before that "intelligence" becomes its own death sentence, committing itself to self-destruction through the very death machines that big brain has superstitiously invented to terminate its species. 5,500+ humans die each day over religion. How utterly stupid! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkGpO1lQrLY While not perfect, Buddhism does a decent job at restraint... "As the Buddha states in the Brahma Net Sutra: "If a child of Buddha himself kills, or goads someone else to kill, or provides with or suggests means for killing, or praises the act of killing or, on seeing someone commit the act, expresses approval for what that person has done, or kills by way of incantations, or is the cause, occasion, means, or instrument of the act of inducing a death, he will be shut out of the community." -- "j" ganz @@ www.sailnow.com |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message ... On Thu, 01 Jan 2009 01:16:27 -0000, Justin C wrote: In article lutions, Capt. JG wrote: [big snip] that's the perception that's being generated by the Arab run news agencies based in countries where the governments usually don't believe Israel has a right to exist. I don't think you'll find it's the *existence* of Israel that is the problem, it's *where* it exists that is the cause of the trouble. For example, if the Jews had, let's say, Rhode Island, I'm sure the Palestinians and Jordanians would be quite happy but would you? Justin. Certainly, who cares about Rhode Island? Better yet, give 'em Miami as it is much the Jewish homeland as Palestine.. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) They have to grow old and cantankerous in New York before they're allowed to move to South Florida. |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 01:31:54 +0000, Larry wrote:
Bruce In Bangkok wrote in : As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. It's not just Islam, it's ALL OF THEM! Every relgion on the planet has a long history of genocide, proving beyond any shadow of a doubt there is no "god" and certainly no "saviour" who's gonna swoop down and save...er, ah....which group of religious murderers?? This superstitious phenomenon of the upper life forms may be the reason life cycles through a few million years then suddenly commits suicide for no apparent reason. There may a limit to how much "intelligence" life can withstand before that "intelligence" becomes its own death sentence, committing itself to self-destruction through the very death machines that big brain has superstitiously invented to terminate its species. 5,500+ humans die each day over religion. How utterly stupid! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkGpO1lQrLY Of course there is a God. The Jewish God told Moses that Palestine was the Jewish home land and it was O.K. to rape and riot among the indigenous people. Allah told Muhammad to take up arms against all non-believers. The Gods on Olympus looked with favor on the troops attacking Troy. The Christian God certainly has favored some dramatic activities and even today I have the idea that Bush probably believes that he is doing "God's Work" in the middle east. God is, as they say, on the side of the big battalions. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 17:59:29 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote: "Larry" wrote in message .. . Bruce In Bangkok wrote in : As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. It's not just Islam, it's ALL OF THEM! Every relgion on the planet has a long history of genocide, proving beyond any shadow of a doubt there is no "god" and certainly no "saviour" who's gonna swoop down and save...er, ah....which group of religious murderers?? This superstitious phenomenon of the upper life forms may be the reason life cycles through a few million years then suddenly commits suicide for no apparent reason. There may a limit to how much "intelligence" life can withstand before that "intelligence" becomes its own death sentence, committing itself to self-destruction through the very death machines that big brain has superstitiously invented to terminate its species. 5,500+ humans die each day over religion. How utterly stupid! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkGpO1lQrLY While not perfect, Buddhism does a decent job at restraint... "As the Buddha states in the Brahma Net Sutra: "If a child of Buddha himself kills, or goads someone else to kill, or provides with or suggests means for killing, or praises the act of killing or, on seeing someone commit the act, expresses approval for what that person has done, or kills by way of incantations, or is the cause, occasion, means, or instrument of the act of inducing a death, he will be shut out of the community." True that the Buddha taught that life is pain and one must look inward for the answers but some of his adherents seem to interpret the teachings to mean one should fight against evil doers in the secular world. Witness the Monks in Vietnam and Siri Lanka who are/were extremely active politically as well as the Monks in Burma who recently protested the military government's actions. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
M/V "Dignity" RAMMED by Israeli Navy gunboat.
On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 17:53:23 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote: "Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message .. . On Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:44:17 -0800, "Capt. JG" wrote: "Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message ... On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 05:08:48 -0600, wrote: On Sat, 03 Jan 2009 08:12:22 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok wrote: Are they innocent? they elected Hamus an openly terrorist organization who advocate the forcible eradication of Israel. Is that really innocent? Cheers, The children did that? Nope, the voters did that but as the "children" throw stones at Israeli soldiers and otherwise do their best to incite the situation how innocent can one consider them? Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I consider the children mostly innocent. They do what most children do... follow their role models' lead. I understand why the adults voted in Hamas; Israel should have, could have, and should do more for the cause of peace, but that does not excuse the indescriminate firing of rockets and the calls for the descruction of Israel by the Hamas leadership. Both need to end. I wonder whether you would find the "child" who carried a bomb into the restaurant where it exploded killing your wife/child/loved one so innocent as you feel at the moment sitting safely at home watching the T.V. As far as the "cause of peace" it is somewhat difficult to have a peace with folks who hate you, who's religion (and don't think that the Palestinians aren't true believers) teaches them that outsiders, infidels, have no rights and should be eradicated if they don't convert. To get an impression of Islamic beliefs understand that it is 1430 in the Islamic calendar. Review Christian history for the mid 1400's A.D. and it will give you a fairly accurate picture. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) I probably wouldn't but the child would be innocent and would have been used by an adult. Children's brains are not sufficiently developed to guarantee knowing right from wrong. That's why we don't as a rule execute kids. It is difficult, as you say, but it's not impossible. I also believe that most people, without regard to religion, would prefer peace and coexistence to war and death. Islam is not a "violent" religion, any more than Christianity or Judism. I disagree with you. If you believe that Islam is not a violent religion read the Koran. It is full of instructions regarding how non-believers are to be treated. Most of them harshly. The propaganda that Islam is a religion of submission and thus a peaceful religion if just that propaganda. Islam is a religion of submission - submission to the will of God and does not include non-believers inside the magic circle. Cheers, Bruce (bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom) |
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