On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 03:13:42 +0000, Larry wrote:

Bruce In Bangkok wrote in
:

They don't want any lay-abouts so in order to get a resident permit
you need to lodge 800,000 baht in a Thai bank.



Wow....$US23K is kinda steep! I might have to work! Not good.

If you want to work you will have to either work for an established
Thai company or establish your own company..... and then pay taxes.

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 02:05:19 -0600, (Geoff Miller)
wrote:



For years I've noticed that yachts for sale which are
in very good shape are often described as being in
"Bristol" condition. Why "Bristol?"

Does the English city of Bristol have some significance
in yachting with implications of a vessel's being in
first-class condition? If so, what's the story behind
that?



Geoff

It is actually "Ship shape and Bristol fashion". there seem to be a
number of explanations for the term but it certainly has been in use
for more then a hundred years as it is mentioned in "Two Years Before
the Mast", printed in 1840. The meaning apparently has always meant in
top notch condition. (and I don't know where that term originated :-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

"Two Years Before the Mast"
What a great book. Haven't heard the title mentioned in a long time.

"mmc" wrote in message
g.com...

It is actually "Ship shape and Bristol fashion". there seem to be a
number of explanations for the term but it certainly has been in use
for more then a hundred years as it is mentioned in "Two Years Before
the Mast", printed in 1840. The meaning apparently has always meant in
top notch condition. (and I don't know where that term originated :-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

"Two Years Before the Mast"
What a great book. Haven't heard the title mentioned in a long time.
I reread it earlier this year and it is a most interesting account of life
aboard ship around the 1830's and a good picture of Southern California in
those days..
Interesting how they went across to the west coast of USA and stayed there
for two years while they steadily filled the hold with hides, compressing
them down with levers until sometimes the pressure would lift a ships deck
up off its beams. I presume they were buffalo hides so no wonder there are
not so many of these animals left. I doubt there were enough people there
in those days to eat all the carcasses so they must have all been wasted.
And then there is the bit about a shipmate who fell off the ice covered
yardarms while running towards Cape Horn and they had no option but to sail
on while his cries faded away astern...
I wonder if it is still in print. My copy came from a s/h bookshop and was
inscribed as a Christmas present to someone in December 1900.

In article ,
(Geoff Miller) wrote:

For years I've noticed that yachts for sale which are
in very good shape are often described as being in
"Bristol" condition. Why "Bristol?"

If perchance you meant "Bristol fashion" , take a look at:

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/shipsh...ristol_fashion

or it's equivalent:

http://tinyurl.com/99wu3d

You'll find the basis for this phrase which means "Tidily tied down and
secure".

ron

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:14:44 +0100, "Edgar"
wrote:


"mmc" wrote in message
ng.com...

It is actually "Ship shape and Bristol fashion". there seem to be a
number of explanations for the term but it certainly has been in use
for more then a hundred years as it is mentioned in "Two Years Before
the Mast", printed in 1840. The meaning apparently has always meant in
top notch condition. (and I don't know where that term originated :-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

"Two Years Before the Mast"
What a great book. Haven't heard the title mentioned in a long time.
I reread it earlier this year and it is a most interesting account of life
aboard ship around the 1830's and a good picture of Southern California in
those days..
Interesting how they went across to the west coast of USA and stayed there
for two years while they steadily filled the hold with hides, compressing
them down with levers until sometimes the pressure would lift a ships deck
up off its beams. I presume they were buffalo hides so no wonder there are
not so many of these animals left. I doubt there were enough people there
in those days to eat all the carcasses so they must have all been wasted.
And then there is the bit about a shipmate who fell off the ice covered
yardarms while running towards Cape Horn and they had no option but to sail
on while his cries faded away astern...
I wonder if it is still in print. My copy came from a s/h bookshop and was
inscribed as a Christmas present to someone in December 1900.


It's been years since I read the book but I have the idea that these
were cattle hides. Isn't there something in the book about being
anchored near some ranch and the ranch hands throwing dried hides down
a cliff so the crew could load them aboard?
Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 07:12:56 +0700, Bruce In Bangkok
wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:14:44 +0100, "Edgar"
wrote:


"mmc" wrote in message
ing.com...

It is actually "Ship shape and Bristol fashion". there seem to be a
number of explanations for the term but it certainly has been in use
for more then a hundred years as it is mentioned in "Two Years Before
the Mast", printed in 1840. The meaning apparently has always meant in
top notch condition. (and I don't know where that term originated :-)

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)

"Two Years Before the Mast"
What a great book. Haven't heard the title mentioned in a long time.
I reread it earlier this year and it is a most interesting account of life
aboard ship around the 1830's and a good picture of Southern California in
those days..
Interesting how they went across to the west coast of USA and stayed there
for two years while they steadily filled the hold with hides, compressing
them down with levers until sometimes the pressure would lift a ships deck
up off its beams. I presume they were buffalo hides so no wonder there are
not so many of these animals left. I doubt there were enough people there
in those days to eat all the carcasses so they must have all been wasted.
And then there is the bit about a shipmate who fell off the ice covered
yardarms while running towards Cape Horn and they had no option but to sail
on while his cries faded away astern...
I wonder if it is still in print. My copy came from a s/h bookshop and was
inscribed as a Christmas present to someone in December 1900.


It's been years since I read the book but I have the idea that these
were cattle hides. Isn't there something in the book about being
anchored near some ranch and the ranch hands throwing dried hides down
a cliff so the crew could load them aboard?
Cheers,

I believe you're correct. I think the buffalo were mostly wiped out
by "sportsmen" on shooting sprees.
If you keep American history in view as you read TYBTM, it becomes
more than a sea journal. For example the Alamo fell during Dana's
voyage. The Plains Indians were the lords of much west of the
Mississippi, St Joseph, Missouri was a trading post and the Pony
Express was years in the future. etc., etc.
I marveled more at the sea tale when I paused and put some of the
other history in place with Dana's world.
California was more remote to Americans than Europe was then.
Hey, maybe it still is! (-:

--Vic

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 19:01:31 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

I believe you're correct. I think the buffalo were mostly wiped out
by "sportsmen" on shooting sprees.

Of course not. It was market hunting for the hides. This with the
connivance of the gov who wanted to force the indians to eat gov beef
on a reservation. They killed all but 500, but now there are about 600
000, many in private herds. I guess they have to harvest them with
guns. Too big and mean to walk up a ramp into a truck.

Casady

"Bruce In Bangkok" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:14:44 +0100, "Edgar"
wrote:
"Two Years Before the Mast"
What a great book. Haven't heard the title mentioned in a long time.
I reread it earlier this year and it is a most interesting account of life
aboard ship around the 1830's and a good picture of Southern California in
those days..
Interesting how they went across to the west coast of USA and stayed there
for two years while they steadily filled the hold with hides, compressing
them down with levers until sometimes the pressure would lift a ships deck
up off its beams. I presume they were buffalo hides so no wonder there are
not so many of these animals left. I doubt there were enough people there
in those days to eat all the carcasses so they must have all been wasted.
And then there is the bit about a shipmate who fell off the ice covered
yardarms while running towards Cape Horn and they had no option but to
sail
on while his cries faded away astern...
I wonder if it is still in print. My copy came from a s/h bookshop and was
inscribed as a Christmas present to someone in December 1900.


It's been years since I read the book but I have the idea that these
were cattle hides. Isn't there something in the book about being
anchored near some ranch and the ranch hands throwing dried hides down
a cliff so the crew could load them aboard?
Cheers,


I have dipped again into my book and think you may be right as when at San
Pedro loading hides it is mentioned that there is a large cattle ranch
somewhat inland. And yes they did throw them down a cliff and because the
rough stony beach quickly wore out their valuable shoes, they carried the
hides on their heads down to the ships boat while barefoot.
However he also says that the number of hides was becoming less as the years
progressed, which is not surprising since one single ship was loaded with no
less than forty thousand hides and a smaller ship carried only thirty
thousand.
I came across some gems too:-
"The Californians are an idle, thriftless people, and can make nothing for
themselves"
"San Diego (he told me) was a small snug place, having very little trade,
but decidedly the best harbour on the coast, being completely landlocked,
and the water as smooth as a duckpond"

I think it is time I reread the whole book.

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 15:11:17 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 19:01:31 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

I believe you're correct. I think the buffalo were mostly wiped out
by "sportsmen" on shooting sprees.

Of course not. It was market hunting for the hides. This with the
connivance of the gov who wanted to force the indians to eat gov beef
on a reservation. They killed all but 500, but now there are about 600
000, many in private herds. I guess they have to harvest them with
guns. Too big and mean to walk up a ramp into a truck.

Didn't know there was a big market for those hides.
'Course I wasn't there (-:
I do recall reading accounts of buffalo being shot from train windows
and Buffalo Bill shooting some hundreds in a day, in which cases the
buffalo were left to rot where they fell.
But maybe that was exaggerated by the "bleeding heart" crowd.
When I'm in the mood I'll look it up.
Seems fencing the range, cattlemen, and farmers would have had a big
effect too.

--Vic

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 15:11:17 GMT, (Richard
Casady) wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 19:01:31 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

I believe you're correct. I think the buffalo were mostly wiped out
by "sportsmen" on shooting sprees.

Of course not. It was market hunting for the hides. This with the
connivance of the gov who wanted to force the indians to eat gov beef
on a reservation. They killed all but 500, but now there are about 600
000, many in private herds. I guess they have to harvest them with
guns. Too big and mean to walk up a ramp into a truck.

Casady


I don't believe that you are correct about the government. I suspect
that the aim was to totally destroy the Indian's source of food,
clothing and shelter, olden time strategic warfare - destroy the
enemy's capability to wage war... As far as the reservations went, I
think that the government would been far happier to see the Indians
just disappear. At least I've read no contemporary writing that seemed
to say the Indians were anything but a "problem".

I read somewhere that all the present day buffalo (bison) in the US
are descended from several Canadian buffalo imported into the U.S.,
what, 50 years ago?

Cheers,

Bruce
(bruceinbangkokatgmaildotcom)