As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...

I have decided against some, distance/condition/price/ .. many reasons.

Thanks to all of you, I have been able to walk on .. and that is hard when
the boat looks free.

But as I spoke to a selling boat owner the other day, he in Florida, the
other coast
in Florida .. I got thinking .. it is a few hours drive across Florida, and
...

So I stumbled as I started asking relevant questions..
hull/deck/hardware/life lines.. on and on.

Later, I thought about this.. there should be a list, a check off list..
this way once the intro
is over .. "hello, I am calling about your boat for sale " .. I would go
down the list ..

"tell me about the hull, what is the condition, painted or original gelcoat,
below water line, on an on.

Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?

On Dec 20, 7:03*am, "Janet O'Leary"
wrote:
As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...

I have decided against some, distance/condition/price/ .. many reasons.

Thanks to all of you, I have been able to walk on .. and that is hard when
the boat looks free.

But as I spoke to a selling boat owner the other day, he in Florida, the
other coast
in Florida .. I got thinking .. it is a few hours drive across Florida, and
..

So I stumbled as I started asking relevant questions..
hull/deck/hardware/life lines.. on and on.

Later, I thought about this.. there should be a list, a check off list..
this way once the intro
is over .. "hello, I am calling about your boat for sale " .. *I would go
down the list ..

"tell me about the hull, what is the condition, painted or original gelcoat,
below water line, on an on.

Does anyone have a list of questions? * A boat buyers list?

the bloody boat is like an hour away. its not like florida is that
wide.
go look at it the phone is not gonna get the answers you want.

Janet O'Leary wrote:

As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...

I have decided against some, distance/condition/price/ .. many reasons.

Thanks to all of you, I have been able to walk on .. and that is hard when
the boat looks free.

But as I spoke to a selling boat owner the other day, he in Florida, the
other coast
in Florida .. I got thinking .. it is a few hours drive across Florida, and
..

So I stumbled as I started asking relevant questions..
hull/deck/hardware/life lines.. on and on.

Later, I thought about this.. there should be a list, a check off list..
this way once the intro
is over .. "hello, I am calling about your boat for sale " .. I would go
down the list ..

"tell me about the hull, what is the condition, painted or original gelcoat,
below water line, on an on.

Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?



Top thing on my hit parade...

Are there any rust stains on the deck hardware?

Stainless steel CAN rust.

And it's generally a sign of long term water exposure - like you would
find with water in a cored deck.

Wet core in the deck is a serious and expensive proposition to repair.

One I'd recommend avoiding....


Richard

"Janet O'Leary" wrote in message
...
As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...

I have decided against some, distance/condition/price/ .. many reasons.

Thanks to all of you, I have been able to walk on .. and that is hard when
the boat looks free.

But as I spoke to a selling boat owner the other day, he in Florida, the
other coast
in Florida .. I got thinking .. it is a few hours drive across Florida,
and ..

So I stumbled as I started asking relevant questions..
hull/deck/hardware/life lines.. on and on.

Anybody selling a decent boat these days should have it available for view
on the Internet. There should be several pages to view and a dozen or more
photos showing it inside and out. It should list specs and equipment.
Personally, I wouldn't bother looking at a boat that an owner is so ashamed
of he doesn't create a for-sale website around her.

The only way to check out a boat is in person. Asking a bunch of questions
on the phone will be of little use. Silly females think a telephone is the
answer for everything.

At least if you choose potential boats from web pages you will have a pretty
good idea of what you're looking at. And take that stupid phone out of your
ear, girl.

Ixnay on the listsay!

Wilbur Hubbard

On Dec 20, 7:03*am, "Janet O'Leary"
wrote:
As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...

Does anyone have a list of questions? * A boat buyers list?


Search here a couple years back for the 495,000 word essay titled: How
I Bought a Boat. Authored by Skip.
What unfolds is an unbelivable dialogue betwenen Skip and those who
guided him with their advice. Heck, I bet Skip would even send you
his Excel data base that went so far as to quantify a "satisfaction
index" of over 200 boats.... many in Flordia.

Bob

Bob wrote:

On Dec 20, 7:03 am, "Janet O'Leary"
wrote:

As I have looked at boats, and also called about boats...


Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?



Search here a couple years back for the 495,000 word essay titled: How
I Bought a Boat. Authored by Skip.
What unfolds is an unbelivable dialogue betwenen Skip and those who
guided him with their advice. Heck, I bet Skip would even send you
his Excel data base that went so far as to quantify a "satisfaction
index" of over 200 boats.... many in Flordia.

Bob



I couldn't find Skip's.

Closest thing was...

http://www.usual-suspects-sailing.co...purchase-4.htm

"Janet O'Leary" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?

What To Look For In a Used Boat

By Dennis Fria

Copyright 1998, Used With Permission

from TELLTALES Magazine, May 1998

Editorial & Advertising Sales Office:

228-B Marina Bay Drive,

Kemah, Texas 77565



The Exterior

a.. how well did the previous owners take care of her.
b.. cosmetics always indicate how well a vessel has been cared for.
c.. overall appearance.
d.. Cleanliness.
e.. Moss growing on anything on the North side indicates she's not been
looked at for a while. You'll find it on the canvas, or on lines that have
been lying dormant for a while. While it may grow fairly rapidly on coiled
lines on deck, if it's not been washed recently you'll see moss.


Pick up those coiled lines. If there's a dirty mark beneath then you know
the boat hasn't been washed. If the boat isn't washed regularly, salt
attacks everything. Especially the metal surfaces.



Look at the stanchions. Are they rusted? Are the bases rusted? Look at the
standing rigging. Is it rusted? All of this deterioration can be avoided
with care. And that's exactly what we're looking for. Indications of care.



Unprotected aluminum parts will pit rapidly. If they've been washed and
treated regularly they'll look nice. Maybe not new, but severely pitted
aluminum is a dead give-away.



Next, look at the life-lines. Badly discolored and cracked lifelines
indicate neglect. Also, look at the terminals. If you see rust, they've not
been taken care of. Look at the pelican hook and see if it secures properly.



Examine the bow-roller. What condition are the rollers in? Is the stainless
polished or rusted? Look at where the anchor stock rests. Is it on the deck?
If so, has it worn the deck? What shape is the anchor and chain in? Look at
the thimble in the rode. They need to be replaced regularly.



Look at the gel-coat. It needs to be waxed at least annually. If left to
weather it will never come back to bright again. Even compounding won't
bring it back. If the topsides are severely chalked the boat may need to be
painted, or be happy with a dull finish.



Look at the woods on deck. Most boats now use teak exclusively. If it's
varnished, and looks good, then you know the boat has been well cared for.
Honey Teak is the latest finish, and it's great! A fresh coat of anything
indicates the owner cared for this vessel.



Look for Teak neglect.. It doesn't have to be varnished or Cetol'd, but
simply cared for. Some folks like oil. If it's been freshly oiled and looks
good, that's good. Oil finishes take a lot of time. Anyone who puts that
much care into a boat has certainly put a lot of other care into her.



The worst case is neglected wood, or wood that has been repeatedly scrubbed
in an attempt to make it look fresh. Using a teak cleaner (which is usually
an acid product) and a brush will rapidly eat all of the teak off a boat.
The result of scrubbing with any brush and a teak cleaner is the "raised
grain" look. Actually it's more appropriately called "subtracted grain". The
cleaner softens the soft grain, and the scrub brush removes it.



Raised grain teak requires a lot of work to get it back to a pleasing
appearance. All of the top grain that's left must be sanded down to the
level of whatever is left. Then it must be either varnished or Cetol'd



If you like the oiled look, after sanding back to smooth, clean with a 3M
pad and mild soap. Then oil.



Look at the canvas. Unless polyester thread was used in the stitching, the
canvas will come apart. Look for deteriorated seams.



Look at the top of the Bimini. If the boom has been allowed to rub than it
will be worn through. Booms must be kept off the top by tightening the
topping lift.



Walk around the deck. Feel for soft, springy areas, which would indicate
decay in the core. This can usually be found around fittings such as
stanchions. People on docks always want to help, and inevitably grab and
push on the stanchions. This will loosen their seal at the fittings and
allow water penetration. If you suspect core decay, tap the area with a
closed pocket knife or other similar object. You'll hear the difference
between good spots and bad. Core repairs can be extremely expensive.



Examine the hull sides for damage. Discolored areas in the gelcoat indicate
damage that has been repaired. If you suspect it, look inside to see how it
has been repaired.



Look at the bow pulpit and make sure it is straight. If bent, then it has
probably contacted the dock or a piling.



What condition is the Lexan in the hatches? If they've been covered, they'll
probably be in acceptable condition. If left to weather you'll see
noticeable degradation of the plastic. Are the frames in good shape? Are
they plastic or metal? What shape are the frames in?



Look at the exhaust through-hull. If it's a diesel, is there black soot on
the hull? Feel it. If it's oily better talk to the mechanic about that!



Look at the compass. The plastic should be crystal clear. If not, it's been
left exposed to UV's. Make sure there are no bubbles in the liquid. If there
are, it's leaking and needs to be replaced.



Turn the wheel or tiller and notice how the rudder swings. Worn bushings
will feel loose. There should be no play at all in either a wheel or a
tiller steered boat.



look at the standing rigging. Carefully examine the terminals. Swaged
fittings eventually must be replaced. Water wicking down the cable and into
the swages will deteriorate the fitting, and the result is cracking. Examine
with a magnifying glass for hairline fractures. A surveyor may use more
sophisticated methods to examine better, but a magnifier may very well pick
up cracks.



Look at the wire rigging. Is it kinked anywhere? If there are plastic guards
on it lift them up. I never recommend using plastic rigging covers as it
holds in the salt and prevents proper flushing when washed with fresh water.
Another not-so-great idea is the clamp-on cleats used to tie off flag
halyards. The clamps may damage the wires if tightened too much, and again,
salt is retained underneath, encouraging rust.



Look at the running rigging. Is it chafed? Many sheet stoppers damage
halyards and they subsequently need replacing regularly. Lines that are
stopped with cam-cleats will likely be damaged where they are held by the
teeth.



Dock lines should be in good condition. No frayed ends. Again, we're looking
for an indication of care or neglect. Someone who really likes their boat
and cares how it looks won't allow a frayed line on a boat.



Are white fenders blackened with creosote and mildew? Are they inflated
properly. Flat fenders do no good!



Turn winches with your hands. Winches need to be lubricated at least
annually, and preferably semi-annually. If the boat is raced a lot, they
must be serviced quarterly. Winches that have been neglected will not turn
easily. Stick your finger into the handle socket and see if you can turn it.
If they're 2-speed winches, turn both ways. If they've been kept up you
should be able to turn both ways, though it may be difficult. Inner pawls
that are rusted in place from neglect may not actuate properly, and the
result is a free spinning winch.



Look at the mast base. A deck stepped mast will show serious signs of
deterioration if neglected. If it's painted, look for bubbles. Bubbles
indicate degradation of the metal.



If the mast is keel stepped, examine where it goes through the deck. On deck
look at the boot. See if it's sealing properly. Later, inside, look for
leaks on the overhead trim and headliner.



Look up at the foredeck light and the steaming light. What condition is the
fixture in. How about spreader lights? Turn them on. If they work, good. If
not, the fixture may need replacing, or the wiring, or both.



Interior

First look at the companionway hatch. Does it slide evenly? Is it worn
unevenly?

Examine the hatch-boards. How is the finish? Are they loose in their track,
or are they wedged in?



Climb down the ladder and notice the smell. Does it smell musty? If so
suspect mildew. Or maybe you smell diesel fuel. Better look for leaks in the
lines or tanks. If you smell gasoline, leave! Don't buy this boat!



Start with the galley. Look around the stove. Is it greasy? If it gimbals,
move it and look underneath and in back. Food products left there encourage
roach infestations. Look for what looks like little mouse poop. If you see
it, it's roach feces. Better look for roach bait, next! I'll bet you find
that, too.



If it's a propane stove, is there a sniffer and solenoid? If so, test it.
You'll also need to examine the placement and condition of the tank and its
lines.



An alcohol stove needs to be examined for clean burner orifices. Ask for a
demonstration of its ability to light. Don't do this yourself, as they are
known for flare-ups.



Look in the ice box. If it has been kept clean, it'll smell clean. If dirty,
it may also have mildew. If it is a refrigerator unit check for operation.
Turn it on and then locate the compressor and condenser and listen to it
operate. Later check for cooling.



Go to the electric panel and turn on the fresh water pump. It will
pressurize in a second or two at the most. If it takes longer, something's
wrong. Leave it on. If you hear it operate again and no water is running
then there are leaks in the system.



Turn on the fresh water. How does it smell? How does it look?



Look at the condition of the sink. Rusty? Look beneath. If the drain leaks
you'll see it. Is there a seacock attached to the through-hull? There should
be.



Look in the pantry lockers and examine for evidence of roach infestation.
Food stored in boxes or cellophane bags are roach diners. All food must be
kept in sealable containers.



Look under the Nav desk. If it's neat, that's good. If it's cluttered it's
another indication of care or the lack thereof.



Look at the electrical panel. If modifications have been made, and they
frequently are, you'll see plastic tape labels. You'll need to look behind
to see if the wiring is neatly done. While there look at the wiring
terminals. If corroded, you'll certainly have problems. It's amazing how
many boats leak in the electrical panel area! Suspect major electrical
problems.



look at the upholstery. Is it tailored, or does it look home-done? Examine
the zippers. Plastic or metal?



Look in the head. Does the toilet pump leak? Operate it and see if it does.
Smell the flush water. If it smells putrid than the boat has been sitting
for a while. Are the fasteners at the base rusted?



If there's a shower, where does it drain? Is there a curtain? Check the
shower sump. Stale water left in it smells very sour. Is there a float
switch on the sump-pump? Operate it.



Run the water in the head, both at the sink and the shower.



Move to the V-berth and look under the cushions. Look in all the lockers. If
there's access to the anchor locker from the V-berth, look in it and see if
water drains appropriately. What shape is the anchor line in?



Do the drawers openly smoothly? Look at the overhead and examine for mildew.
Look for mildew on the teak joinerwork. Oiling interior teak invites mildew.



Pull up the floorboards and carefully inspect the bilge. Is there water in
it? Most bilges will have some water. See if the bilge pump operates. Lift
the float switch to cycle it. Smell the water. If there's diesel or oil in
it there's trouble. If the keel is fastened with keel-bolts, look at them.
What is their condition? Is there wiring in the bilge? If so, is it secure
or loose?



Look at the port lights. Do they leak? Are they plastic? Metal is better,
but some plastic ports may be acceptable. Open them and see how they work.
This will tell you if they are quality or junk. Look at the gaskets. If
they're hard they'll need replacing. Look for localized discoloration
indicating leaks.



Turn on the lights and check for operation. Don't forget to try the VHF,
stereo, and any cabin fans.



Look at the engine. See if there's coolant in the pan beneath. Look for oil
leaks. A grimy engine is a good indication of neglect. A rusted engine
indicates there are problems with the salt water cooling system. How is the
paint job? Pull the dipstick and look at the level. Diesel oil will always
be black, even if fresh. You might want to take a sample of the oil to a
testing facility. There they can analyze the contents in the oil and give
you a good indication of the condition of the engine. This simple test
usually costs less than $50.



Check the batteries for water. If dry, you'll know they need replacing. How
many batteries are there, and how big are they? Are they secure?



Look at the stuffing box and prop shaft. If it's leaking it'll be a black
awful mess. This could be the source of the water in the bilge. Stuffing
boxes should drip once every 10-15 seconds while the shaft is turning. If it
drips at rest the packing needs to be replaced.



See if you can see the gland at the rudder stock. It is also a stuffing box
and should not be leaking.



Tug on the steering cables of a wheel-steered boat. Are they loose?



If it's a gasoline engine, you must have a good bilge blower. Turn it on.
Some diesel installations may also have a blower.



Lastly, look inside lockers near bulkheads and see if you can examine how
the bulkheads are attached. Frequently the laminations of the plywood where
they are glassed to the hull will separate leaving the bulkhead loose. Under
no circumstance should you consider purchasing a boat with loose bulkheads.



Examine carefully the attachment of the chain-plates. This is often the
weakest point in a poorly designed rig. A well designed vessel should be
able to be lifted by any single chainplate. Will this vessel stand up to
that kind of scrutiny? Are they leaking where they come through the deck?



You are looking for is abuse, neglect, damage, and inoperable systems or
components. A careful examination will turn up many deficiencies. Hardly any
vessel will stand up to meticulous scrutiny. A cared-for vessel, on the
other hand will appear clean and neat, and any alterations or repairs will
be orderly and professional in appearance.



Your job, then, before getting to the contract stage and the expense of a
haul-out and survey, is to ferret out as much as possible so that you'll be
sure that this is the boat you'll trust your life and your family's lives
to.

"jlrogers±³©" wrote in message
...

"Janet O'Leary" wrote in message
...
Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?

What To Look For In a Used Boat

By Dennis Fria

Copyright 1998, Used With Permission

from TELLTALES Magazine, May 1998

Editorial & Advertising Sales Office:

228-B Marina Bay Drive,

Kemah, Texas 77565



The Exterior

a.. how well did the previous owners take care of her.
b.. cosmetics always indicate how well a vessel has been cared for.
c.. overall appearance.
d.. Cleanliness.
e.. Moss growing on anything on the North side indicates she's not been
looked at for a while. You'll find it on the canvas, or on lines that have
been lying dormant for a while. While it may grow fairly rapidly on coiled
lines on deck, if it's not been washed recently you'll see moss.


Pick up those coiled lines. If there's a dirty mark beneath then you know
the boat hasn't been washed. If the boat isn't washed regularly, salt
attacks everything. Especially the metal surfaces.



Look at the stanchions. Are they rusted? Are the bases rusted? Look at the
standing rigging. Is it rusted? All of this deterioration can be avoided
with care. And that's exactly what we're looking for. Indications of care.



Unprotected aluminum parts will pit rapidly. If they've been washed and
treated regularly they'll look nice. Maybe not new, but severely pitted
aluminum is a dead give-away.



Next, look at the life-lines. Badly discolored and cracked lifelines
indicate neglect. Also, look at the terminals. If you see rust, they've
not been taken care of. Look at the pelican hook and see if it secures
properly.



Examine the bow-roller. What condition are the rollers in? Is the
stainless polished or rusted? Look at where the anchor stock rests. Is it
on the deck? If so, has it worn the deck? What shape is the anchor and
chain in? Look at the thimble in the rode. They need to be replaced
regularly.



Look at the gel-coat. It needs to be waxed at least annually. If left to
weather it will never come back to bright again. Even compounding won't
bring it back. If the topsides are severely chalked the boat may need to
be painted, or be happy with a dull finish.



Look at the woods on deck. Most boats now use teak exclusively. If it's
varnished, and looks good, then you know the boat has been well cared for.
Honey Teak is the latest finish, and it's great! A fresh coat of anything
indicates the owner cared for this vessel.



Look for Teak neglect.. It doesn't have to be varnished or Cetol'd, but
simply cared for. Some folks like oil. If it's been freshly oiled and
looks good, that's good. Oil finishes take a lot of time. Anyone who puts
that much care into a boat has certainly put a lot of other care into her.



The worst case is neglected wood, or wood that has been repeatedly
scrubbed in an attempt to make it look fresh. Using a teak cleaner (which
is usually an acid product) and a brush will rapidly eat all of the teak
off a boat. The result of scrubbing with any brush and a teak cleaner is
the "raised grain" look. Actually it's more appropriately called
"subtracted grain". The cleaner softens the soft grain, and the scrub
brush removes it.



Raised grain teak requires a lot of work to get it back to a pleasing
appearance. All of the top grain that's left must be sanded down to the
level of whatever is left. Then it must be either varnished or Cetol'd



If you like the oiled look, after sanding back to smooth, clean with a 3M
pad and mild soap. Then oil.



Look at the canvas. Unless polyester thread was used in the stitching, the
canvas will come apart. Look for deteriorated seams.



Look at the top of the Bimini. If the boom has been allowed to rub than it
will be worn through. Booms must be kept off the top by tightening the
topping lift.



Walk around the deck. Feel for soft, springy areas, which would indicate
decay in the core. This can usually be found around fittings such as
stanchions. People on docks always want to help, and inevitably grab and
push on the stanchions. This will loosen their seal at the fittings and
allow water penetration. If you suspect core decay, tap the area with a
closed pocket knife or other similar object. You'll hear the difference
between good spots and bad. Core repairs can be extremely expensive.



Examine the hull sides for damage. Discolored areas in the gelcoat
indicate damage that has been repaired. If you suspect it, look inside to
see how it has been repaired.



Look at the bow pulpit and make sure it is straight. If bent, then it has
probably contacted the dock or a piling.



What condition is the Lexan in the hatches? If they've been covered,
they'll probably be in acceptable condition. If left to weather you'll see
noticeable degradation of the plastic. Are the frames in good shape? Are
they plastic or metal? What shape are the frames in?



Look at the exhaust through-hull. If it's a diesel, is there black soot on
the hull? Feel it. If it's oily better talk to the mechanic about that!



Look at the compass. The plastic should be crystal clear. If not, it's
been left exposed to UV's. Make sure there are no bubbles in the liquid.
If there are, it's leaking and needs to be replaced.



Turn the wheel or tiller and notice how the rudder swings. Worn bushings
will feel loose. There should be no play at all in either a wheel or a
tiller steered boat.



look at the standing rigging. Carefully examine the terminals. Swaged
fittings eventually must be replaced. Water wicking down the cable and
into the swages will deteriorate the fitting, and the result is cracking.
Examine with a magnifying glass for hairline fractures. A surveyor may use
more sophisticated methods to examine better, but a magnifier may very
well pick up cracks.



Look at the wire rigging. Is it kinked anywhere? If there are plastic
guards on it lift them up. I never recommend using plastic rigging covers
as it holds in the salt and prevents proper flushing when washed with
fresh water. Another not-so-great idea is the clamp-on cleats used to tie
off flag halyards. The clamps may damage the wires if tightened too much,
and again, salt is retained underneath, encouraging rust.



Look at the running rigging. Is it chafed? Many sheet stoppers damage
halyards and they subsequently need replacing regularly. Lines that are
stopped with cam-cleats will likely be damaged where they are held by the
teeth.



Dock lines should be in good condition. No frayed ends. Again, we're
looking for an indication of care or neglect. Someone who really likes
their boat and cares how it looks won't allow a frayed line on a boat.



Are white fenders blackened with creosote and mildew? Are they inflated
properly. Flat fenders do no good!



Turn winches with your hands. Winches need to be lubricated at least
annually, and preferably semi-annually. If the boat is raced a lot, they
must be serviced quarterly. Winches that have been neglected will not turn
easily. Stick your finger into the handle socket and see if you can turn
it. If they're 2-speed winches, turn both ways. If they've been kept up
you should be able to turn both ways, though it may be difficult. Inner
pawls that are rusted in place from neglect may not actuate properly, and
the result is a free spinning winch.



Look at the mast base. A deck stepped mast will show serious signs of
deterioration if neglected. If it's painted, look for bubbles. Bubbles
indicate degradation of the metal.



If the mast is keel stepped, examine where it goes through the deck. On
deck look at the boot. See if it's sealing properly. Later, inside, look
for leaks on the overhead trim and headliner.



Look up at the foredeck light and the steaming light. What condition is
the fixture in. How about spreader lights? Turn them on. If they work,
good. If not, the fixture may need replacing, or the wiring, or both.



Interior

First look at the companionway hatch. Does it slide evenly? Is it worn
unevenly?

Examine the hatch-boards. How is the finish? Are they loose in their
track, or are they wedged in?



Climb down the ladder and notice the smell. Does it smell musty? If so
suspect mildew. Or maybe you smell diesel fuel. Better look for leaks in
the lines or tanks. If you smell gasoline, leave! Don't buy this boat!



Start with the galley. Look around the stove. Is it greasy? If it gimbals,
move it and look underneath and in back. Food products left there
encourage roach infestations. Look for what looks like little mouse poop.
If you see it, it's roach feces. Better look for roach bait, next! I'll
bet you find that, too.



If it's a propane stove, is there a sniffer and solenoid? If so, test it.
You'll also need to examine the placement and condition of the tank and
its lines.



An alcohol stove needs to be examined for clean burner orifices. Ask for a
demonstration of its ability to light. Don't do this yourself, as they are
known for flare-ups.



Look in the ice box. If it has been kept clean, it'll smell clean. If
dirty, it may also have mildew. If it is a refrigerator unit check for
operation. Turn it on and then locate the compressor and condenser and
listen to it operate. Later check for cooling.



Go to the electric panel and turn on the fresh water pump. It will
pressurize in a second or two at the most. If it takes longer, something's
wrong. Leave it on. If you hear it operate again and no water is running
then there are leaks in the system.



Turn on the fresh water. How does it smell? How does it look?



Look at the condition of the sink. Rusty? Look beneath. If the drain leaks
you'll see it. Is there a seacock attached to the through-hull? There
should be.



Look in the pantry lockers and examine for evidence of roach infestation.
Food stored in boxes or cellophane bags are roach diners. All food must be
kept in sealable containers.



Look under the Nav desk. If it's neat, that's good. If it's cluttered it's
another indication of care or the lack thereof.



Look at the electrical panel. If modifications have been made, and they
frequently are, you'll see plastic tape labels. You'll need to look behind
to see if the wiring is neatly done. While there look at the wiring
terminals. If corroded, you'll certainly have problems. It's amazing how
many boats leak in the electrical panel area! Suspect major electrical
problems.



look at the upholstery. Is it tailored, or does it look home-done? Examine
the zippers. Plastic or metal?



Look in the head. Does the toilet pump leak? Operate it and see if it
does. Smell the flush water. If it smells putrid than the boat has been
sitting for a while. Are the fasteners at the base rusted?



If there's a shower, where does it drain? Is there a curtain? Check the
shower sump. Stale water left in it smells very sour. Is there a float
switch on the sump-pump? Operate it.



Run the water in the head, both at the sink and the shower.



Move to the V-berth and look under the cushions. Look in all the lockers.
If there's access to the anchor locker from the V-berth, look in it and
see if water drains appropriately. What shape is the anchor line in?



Do the drawers openly smoothly? Look at the overhead and examine for
mildew. Look for mildew on the teak joinerwork. Oiling interior teak
invites mildew.



Pull up the floorboards and carefully inspect the bilge. Is there water in
it? Most bilges will have some water. See if the bilge pump operates. Lift
the float switch to cycle it. Smell the water. If there's diesel or oil in
it there's trouble. If the keel is fastened with keel-bolts, look at them.
What is their condition? Is there wiring in the bilge? If so, is it secure
or loose?



Look at the port lights. Do they leak? Are they plastic? Metal is better,
but some plastic ports may be acceptable. Open them and see how they work.
This will tell you if they are quality or junk. Look at the gaskets. If
they're hard they'll need replacing. Look for localized discoloration
indicating leaks.



Turn on the lights and check for operation. Don't forget to try the VHF,
stereo, and any cabin fans.



Look at the engine. See if there's coolant in the pan beneath. Look for
oil leaks. A grimy engine is a good indication of neglect. A rusted engine
indicates there are problems with the salt water cooling system. How is
the paint job? Pull the dipstick and look at the level. Diesel oil will
always be black, even if fresh. You might want to take a sample of the oil
to a testing facility. There they can analyze the contents in the oil and
give you a good indication of the condition of the engine. This simple
test usually costs less than $50.



Check the batteries for water. If dry, you'll know they need replacing.
How many batteries are there, and how big are they? Are they secure?



Look at the stuffing box and prop shaft. If it's leaking it'll be a black
awful mess. This could be the source of the water in the bilge. Stuffing
boxes should drip once every 10-15 seconds while the shaft is turning. If
it drips at rest the packing needs to be replaced.



See if you can see the gland at the rudder stock. It is also a stuffing
box and should not be leaking.



Tug on the steering cables of a wheel-steered boat. Are they loose?



If it's a gasoline engine, you must have a good bilge blower. Turn it on.
Some diesel installations may also have a blower.



Lastly, look inside lockers near bulkheads and see if you can examine how
the bulkheads are attached. Frequently the laminations of the plywood
where they are glassed to the hull will separate leaving the bulkhead
loose. Under no circumstance should you consider purchasing a boat with
loose bulkheads.



Examine carefully the attachment of the chain-plates. This is often the
weakest point in a poorly designed rig. A well designed vessel should be
able to be lifted by any single chainplate. Will this vessel stand up to
that kind of scrutiny? Are they leaking where they come through the deck?



You are looking for is abuse, neglect, damage, and inoperable systems or
components. A careful examination will turn up many deficiencies. Hardly
any vessel will stand up to meticulous scrutiny. A cared-for vessel, on
the other hand will appear clean and neat, and any alterations or repairs
will be orderly and professional in appearance.



Your job, then, before getting to the contract stage and the expense of a
haul-out and survey, is to ferret out as much as possible so that you'll
be sure that this is the boat you'll trust your life and your family's
lives to.


Thank you,, all very good info..

I will print to use..

As for Hubbard,, its not a women thing to use the phone.. remember, it was
invented
by a man..

Just a step saver..

Seems that most folks will tell when asked, but not necessarily tell on the
phone.
Such as .. "has your boat ever been badly damaged".. on owner told me all
about a hurricane and how his boat got loose, etc. The boat is probably
better
than new but it did give pause.

"Janet O'Leary" wrote in
:

Later, I thought about this.. there should be a list, a check off
list.. this way once the intro
is over .. "hello, I am calling about your boat for sale " .. I would
go down the list ..

"tell me about the hull, what is the condition, painted or original
gelcoat, below water line, on an on.

Does anyone have a list of questions? A boat buyers list?


They'll lie through their teeth. It's why there are so many marine
surveyors searching for the TRUTH about its condition. With thousands
of dollars at stake if the lies overcome the skepticism, surveyors are
the answer. You can usually bargain down the price, once you confront
the seller with the findings, far further than the surveyor cost
you.....or you can simply pay the surveyor and walk away.



You wouldn't buy a mansion on the phone, sight unseen. Neither should
you buy a boat that way. A big bargain boat that's free or nearly free
simply creates a HUGE FINANCIAL LOAD on you to prevent it becoming a
sunken wreck leaking diesel into the water....costing you more than a
brand new yacht at the best dock in the harbor. Check out how much it
costs to clean the marsh to the satisfaction of the authorities when
that rotten diesel tank leaks 5 gallons at anchor and the bilge pump
dutifully pumps it overboard...or the boat simply sinks. OUCH!




You go buy a piece of plastic junk that's anchored out because it's
simply not worth a dock fee. It drags its anchor or gets loose in the
middle of the storm and rams the new 108' Italian motoryacht belonging
to the law firm of Diaphram, Foam and Condom, LLC from Ft Lauderdale,
NY, Paris, Abu Dhabi and Tokyo...the most expensive piece of plastic in
5000 miles. Wait until your piece of junk holes his hull as the current
drags it down the hull and the wind bashes it into the side.

Your children will be paying that debt until 2485.



There are very good reasons they are giving away a really nice looking
boat.....besides they are losing $580/month in dock fees every month
it's still sitting on some marina dock.

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"Janet O'Leary" wrote in
:


You go buy a piece of plastic junk that's anchored out because it's
simply not worth a dock fee. It drags its anchor or gets loose in the
middle of the storm and rams the new 108' Italian motoryacht belonging
to the law firm of Diaphram, Foam and Condom, LLC from Ft Lauderdale,
NY, Paris, Abu Dhabi and Tokyo...the most expensive piece of plastic in
5000 miles. Wait until your piece of junk holes his hull as the current
drags it down the hull and the wind bashes it into the side.

Your children will be paying that debt until 2485.


Legally, I don't know that children can be saddled with a judgment based
upon their parents' actions.