Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

Once again, the IRS might like to have a chat with you. You must show a
profit within five years or the write-offs become retroactively taxable.


NO. Totally incorrect. There is no law nor IRS ruling that says I have to
make a profit. If I can show that I've made a good faith effort to make a
profit, that's all that's required. Suggestion: keep your day job.

You'd be well advised to check that out, John. According to the Uniform
Tax Code of the IRS, you have five years to make a profit, after which
your business is no longer considered a business. Got a good lawyer?

It's just not true Max. They may consider it a hobby, but if I can show that
it's an ongoing business, there's nothing they can do. My father, for
example, had a paper loss for 14 years in a row. Of course, they audited
him, but he won every time. After the third audit, he told them they would
be liable for his expenses, and on the fourth audit, he collected from them.

Very good lawyer actually. Even better CPA. g

Fergeddit. No one can afford Bay Area real estate any longer. g

I can, have, and will.

Did you miss the smiley face, Jon? There are always investments in real
estate everywhere and in all price ranges, but I'm betting you can't
afford the ones that will give your the rate of return you need to offset
the interest on a boat loan.

Don't take that bet. I don't need the money. I have a good strategy for
rates of return, but thanks for your concern. g (Didn't miss it, btw)


Bottom line... the cash flow is much better. Thus, it's a better deal
to finance the boat.

Well, I've left out a lot. I'm sure you can pick it apart if you try.

If you'd simply bought the boat, your cash flow would have been
positive. With your calculations, it couldn't possibly be. Fact: the
interest you pay on a boat loan will always exceed the tax savings
possible by writing off the interest expense.

Huh? That's a negative cash flow of $25K all at once!

Get a job in the real world, Jon. Of course it is. Every time a business
buys something, it's a negative cash flow. Are you claiming that you only
have a positive cash flow? Constantly? Just a few paragraphs ago you
claim that an indefinite net loss is fine with the IRS, but now you're
decrying a negative cash flow. Which is it?

I never claimed that. What I'm saying is that a huge negative of $25K is
dumb if I don't have to do it.


But to cut to the chase, we were talking about boats used for
recreation, not for business. If you can legitimately use yours for
business, more power to ya. Most of us either can't or wish to risk an
audit every other year. The IRS just loves it when folks write-off
boats as a business expense. The old rule was generally thus: the very
rich can write-off very expensive boats, at least in part, as business
expenses, but the rest of us cannot write off our small craft unless we
are in the charter business. If you do what you claim above, you'll
doubtlessly be audited sometime down the road. Hope your documentation
is in order.

You said NEVER buddy. The answer is not never. In addition, there is
nothing wrong with having a deduction as a second home on a boat. You're
required to have sleeping accomodations, a working head, and cooking
facilities. And, that has nothing to do with a commercial venture.

But only the interest on the loan can be written off, not the entire
payment, the dock fee, and the other things you claim to write off.

Of course.. interest on the loan can be written off. A sizeable portion of
the other expenses can be written off as business expenses. I could use the
boat 50% as a vacation home 50% as a business. There's nothing wrong with
that at all.

Sheesh. I'm sure glad you aren't my accountant!

I'll bet yours will be Bubba's roommate at Leavenworth, if its he who's
been advising you.

I like my privacy. A private suite would be more to my liking. g

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

I'm not sure what a saild is, but it could be a deduction if you entertain
customers on it. g

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Scotty" wrote in message
oups.com...
How about if I put my company name on my saild, can I count that as a
deduction?
The cost of a new sail?

SV

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Bzzt. Slightly more than 5%, and it's not a boat loan! My IRA return is
nearly double that. Real Estate (so far) is triple or better.

Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your IRA--according
to MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just barely doing better
than 6% yield. As for real estate, big money can be made in your area,
but only if you invested some time ago. I'm betting that you don't have
the means to invest in anything of substance today, considering that just
about anything bigger than a postage stamp in the Bay Area goes for
megabucks. If you have the means to make those sorts of RE investments,
you have the means to buy your boats for cash. And that's my
point--unless you can get a high rate of return on investments you can
afford--better than the interest on your boat loan (or your home equity
loan, if that makes you feel better)--you're better off paying cash for
the boat. From a strictly financial basis, you're better off not buying a
boat at all.

Well, I agree with your last statement, but I like to sail. It's a curse
really.

You're also making some assumptions that are not valid... e.g., where I
invest in RE.

Let me ask you this, Jon: if your home equity loans are so cheap and your
investments so damn productive, why haven't you maxed out your home equity
and invested it?????

Why do you think I haven't? (A rhetorical question)

Max

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Scotty" wrote in message
oups.com...
How about if I put my company name on my saild, can I count that as a
deduction?
The cost of a new sail?

Sure, Scotty. No problem.

But getting the IRS to go along with it is the trick.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
I'm not sure what a saild is, but it could be a deduction if you entertain
customers on it. g

Right, Scoot. Use that sail as a picnic blanket and serve food on it.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
ups.com...
Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your
IRA--according to
MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just barely doing better
than 6%
yield.


BWAHAHHAHAHAA! Money magazine is some source! We do a lot better than
6% yield. I'm sure Jon does too and he's be nuts to hook you up with
his firm. Getting a good rate is an art. Of course Money Magazine
reports real world stats for real world shmos. When we considered
getting yacht financing we were all set for a rate of 4.99 % over 15
years with 10% down. Now look around and see what the "best" rates are.
That's better than a NEW boat term. You have to know people and make
some friends, but the better rates are out there.

Well, I guess I asked for this. You're smarter than everyone and everything
else. Why not the experts in the financial press, too?

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Bzzt. Slightly more than 5%, and it's not a boat loan! My IRA return is
nearly double that. Real Estate (so far) is triple or better.

Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your IRA--according
to MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just barely doing better
than 6% yield. As for real estate, big money can be made in your area,
but only if you invested some time ago. I'm betting that you don't have
the means to invest in anything of substance today, considering that just
about anything bigger than a postage stamp in the Bay Area goes for
megabucks. If you have the means to make those sorts of RE investments,
you have the means to buy your boats for cash. And that's my
point--unless you can get a high rate of return on investments you can
afford--better than the interest on your boat loan (or your home equity
loan, if that makes you feel better)--you're better off paying cash for
the boat. From a strictly financial basis, you're better off not buying
a boat at all.

Well, I agree with your last statement, but I like to sail. It's a curse
really.

You're also making some assumptions that are not valid... e.g., where I
invest in RE.

Let me ask you this, Jon: if your home equity loans are so cheap and
your investments so damn productive, why haven't you maxed out your home
equity and invested it?????

Why do you think I haven't? (A rhetorical question)

You've already indicated that you haven't by stating that you either have,
or plan to, take a home equity loan to buy your boat.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
I'll bet yours will be Bubba's roommate at Leavenworth, if its he who's
been
advising you.

Bubba did quite well and now owns this Tayana 48 I sail on!

Is your accountant still his "woman," Bubbles?

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

Once again, the IRS might like to have a chat with you. You must show
a profit within five years or the write-offs become retroactively
taxable.


NO. Totally incorrect. There is no law nor IRS ruling that says I have
to make a profit. If I can show that I've made a good faith effort to
make a profit, that's all that's required. Suggestion: keep your day
job.

You'd be well advised to check that out, John. According to the Uniform
Tax Code of the IRS, you have five years to make a profit, after which
your business is no longer considered a business. Got a good lawyer?

It's just not true Max. They may consider it a hobby, but if I can show
that it's an ongoing business, there's nothing they can do. My father, for
example, had a paper loss for 14 years in a row. Of course, they audited
him, but he won every time. After the third audit, he told them they would
be liable for his expenses, and on the fourth audit, he collected from
them.

Oh, I'll bet those audits were a bundle of fun. Sorry to hear that ol' dad
wasn't overly successful. Hope you're doing better. What do you do, by the
way?


Did you miss the smiley face, Jon? There are always investments in real
estate everywhere and in all price ranges, but I'm betting you can't
afford the ones that will give your the rate of return you need to offset
the interest on a boat loan.

Don't take that bet. I don't need the money. I have a good strategy for
rates of return, but thanks for your concern. g (Didn't miss it, btw)

I'd really like to hear about this "strategy."

But only the interest on the loan can be written off, not the entire
payment, the dock fee, and the other things you claim to write off.

Of course.. interest on the loan can be written off. A sizeable portion of
the other expenses can be written off as business expenses. I could use
the boat 50% as a vacation home 50% as a business. There's nothing wrong
with that at all.

Not unless the IRS disagrees.

I'll bet yours will be Bubba's roommate at Leavenworth, if its he who's
been advising you.

I like my privacy. A private suite would be more to my liking. g

I was talking about your accountant, but what the hell, if going to prison
floats your boat, go for it.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Captain Joe Redcloud" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 02:53:17 GMT, "Jeff Coppes"
wrote:

Life is not an asset--it's a necessity for everything else. Without it
you
have no need for anything beyond a grave and some sort of container.

Max


This is so very sad.

And incredibly stupid--this whole inane discussion, that is.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

This is so very sad.

And incredibly stupid--this whole inane discussion, that is.


Only because in the end you were exposed.

RB
35s5
NY

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

It's just not true Max. They may consider it a hobby, but if I can show
that it's an ongoing business, there's nothing they can do. My father,
for example, had a paper loss for 14 years in a row. Of course, they
audited him, but he won every time. After the third audit, he told them
they would be liable for his expenses, and on the fourth audit, he
collected from them.

Oh, I'll bet those audits were a bundle of fun. Sorry to hear that ol'
dad wasn't overly successful. Hope you're doing better. What do you do,
by the way?



They weren't, but sort of became routine for my parents. Again, it's not
profit that's the only thing that counts. Cash Flow is King (not Doug).

Well, pop did ok. He made a ton during WWII. One of the essential
industries, and he and his employees were exempt from the draft. He tried to
enlist, but the guy who was running the military side of the stuff he worked
on found out about it and totally freaked out. He contacted my grandfather,
who was pretty much retired at that point, and read him the riot act. At one
point, he threatened to throw my pop in jail if he tried such foolishness
again. Bizarre really.

Moi? I'm involved in auditing businesses! :-)

Did you miss the smiley face, Jon? There are always investments in real
estate everywhere and in all price ranges, but I'm betting you can't
afford the ones that will give your the rate of return you need to
offset the interest on a boat loan.

Don't take that bet. I don't need the money. I have a good strategy for
rates of return, but thanks for your concern. g (Didn't miss it, btw)

I'd really like to hear about this "strategy."

You and a bunch of IRS agents. g

But only the interest on the loan can be written off, not the entire
payment, the dock fee, and the other things you claim to write off.

Of course.. interest on the loan can be written off. A sizeable portion
of the other expenses can be written off as business expenses. I could
use the boat 50% as a vacation home 50% as a business. There's nothing
wrong with that at all.

Not unless the IRS disagrees.

Correct of course, but that's why we have people who actually sign up to be
a tax attorney.

I'll bet yours will be Bubba's roommate at Leavenworth, if its he who's
been advising you.

I like my privacy. A private suite would be more to my liking. g

I was talking about your accountant, but what the hell, if going to prison
floats your boat, go for it.

I guess if I were doing something illegal and my accountant were a part of
it, we would have adjoining cells. g

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

hahahahahaaa good one!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
k.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
I'm not sure what a saild is, but it could be a deduction if you
entertain customers on it. g

Right, Scoot. Use that sail as a picnic blanket and serve food on it.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Invite them to lunch! I was at a party a few of years ago, mingling,
trolling, whatever. There was a really hot babe that I observed wasn't
getting much attention. This is odd, he thinks... so over I go. She seems
very nice, seems glad that someone is talking to her... and not that I'm a
stranger to foxy women, I will admit to not being the most dashing ... dogs
don't regularly bark and strong men don't weep either, however. Anyway,
we're having a nice conversation, when finally the subject of jobs comes up.
Turns out, she's an IRS auditor. Of course, I was edging away at this
point... my name? Umm... trying to make something up that didn't sound
dorky... then she added that she was involved in Fortune 500 audits... not
small businesses or individs. We continued to have a great time (never dated
in earnest) that evening. At one point, someone came up to me and asked me
if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's hot!, and I mentioned
your name I said. g

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Scotty" wrote in message
oups.com...
How about if I put my company name on my saild, can I count that as a
deduction?
The cost of a new sail?

Sure, Scotty. No problem.

But getting the IRS to go along with it is the trick.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Bzzt. Slightly more than 5%, and it's not a boat loan! My IRA return is
nearly double that. Real Estate (so far) is triple or better.

Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your IRA--according
to MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just barely doing better
than 6% yield. As for real estate, big money can be made in your area,
but only if you invested some time ago. I'm betting that you don't have
the means to invest in anything of substance today, considering that
just about anything bigger than a postage stamp in the Bay Area goes for
megabucks. If you have the means to make those sorts of RE investments,
you have the means to buy your boats for cash. And that's my
point--unless you can get a high rate of return on investments you can
afford--better than the interest on your boat loan (or your home equity
loan, if that makes you feel better)--you're better off paying cash for
the boat. From a strictly financial basis, you're better off not buying
a boat at all.

Well, I agree with your last statement, but I like to sail. It's a curse
really.

You're also making some assumptions that are not valid... e.g., where I
invest in RE.

Let me ask you this, Jon: if your home equity loans are so cheap and
your investments so damn productive, why haven't you maxed out your home
equity and invested it?????

Why do you think I haven't? (A rhetorical question)

You've already indicated that you haven't by stating that you either have,
or plan to, take a home equity loan to buy your boat.

Max

But what if I have more than one house? g

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote:
At one point, someone came up to me and asked me
if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's hot!, and I mentioned
your name I said. g


I guess the IRS is pretty much universally hated down there. My niece is
an auditor for Revenue Canada, she seems to get dates just fine!
Unfortunately she's unwilling to use her position to help old Unle Marty
out, I got audited last year anyway! (In the end Rev. Can. said
everything was fine and I could stop holding my breath).

Cheers
Marty
------------ And now a word from our sponsor ---------------------
For a secure high performance FTP using SSL/TLS encryption
upgrade to SurgeFTP
---- See http://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_surgeftp.htm ----

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Having been audited myself, I can say that I'm not a big fan. Fortunately,
they backed down, but it wasn't a lot of fun. It was right around the time
of the Unibomber, and I got to the point where I could see his point.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
"Capt. JG" wrote:
At one point, someone came up to me and asked me
if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's hot!, and I
mentioned
your name I said. g


I guess the IRS is pretty much universally hated down there. My niece is
an auditor for Revenue Canada, she seems to get dates just fine!
Unfortunately she's unwilling to use her position to help old Unle Marty
out, I got audited last year anyway! (In the end Rev. Can. said
everything was fine and I could stop holding my breath).

Cheers
Marty
------------ And now a word from our sponsor ---------------------
For a secure high performance FTP using SSL/TLS encryption
upgrade to SurgeFTP
---- See http://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_surgeftp.htm ----

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Bzzt. Slightly more than 5%, and it's not a boat loan! My IRA return
is nearly double that. Real Estate (so far) is triple or better.

Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your
IRA--according to MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just
barely doing better than 6% yield. As for real estate, big money can
be made in your area, but only if you invested some time ago. I'm
betting that you don't have the means to invest in anything of
substance today, considering that just about anything bigger than a
postage stamp in the Bay Area goes for megabucks. If you have the
means to make those sorts of RE investments, you have the means to buy
your boats for cash. And that's my point--unless you can get a high
rate of return on investments you can afford--better than the interest
on your boat loan (or your home equity loan, if that makes you feel
better)--you're better off paying cash for the boat. From a strictly
financial basis, you're better off not buying a boat at all.

Well, I agree with your last statement, but I like to sail. It's a curse
really.

You're also making some assumptions that are not valid... e.g., where I
invest in RE.

Let me ask you this, Jon: if your home equity loans are so cheap and
your investments so damn productive, why haven't you maxed out your
home equity and invested it?????

Why do you think I haven't? (A rhetorical question)

You've already indicated that you haven't by stating that you either
have, or plan to, take a home equity loan to buy your boat.

Max

But what if I have more than one house? g

What if the moon is made of green cheese? :-p

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Two weeks ago I got a letter from IRS, they wanted another $1,078
from 2003 returns.
Sheesh!

SV


"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Having been audited myself, I can say that I'm not a big fan.
Fortunately,
they backed down, but it wasn't a lot of fun. It was right
around the time
of the Unibomber, and I got to the point where I could see his
point.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
"Capt. JG" wrote:
At one point, someone came up to me and asked me
if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's hot!,
and I
mentioned
your name I said. g


I guess the IRS is pretty much universally hated down there.
My niece is
an auditor for Revenue Canada, she seems to get dates just
fine!
Unfortunately she's unwilling to use her position to help old
Unle Marty
out, I got audited last year anyway! (In the end Rev. Can.
said
everything was fine and I could stop holding my breath).

Cheers
Marty
------------ And now a word from our
sponsor ---------------------
For a secure high performance FTP using SSL/TLS encryption
upgrade to SurgeFTP
---- See
ttp://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_surgeftp.htm ----

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Martin Baxter" wrote

My niece is
an auditor for Revenue Canada, she seems to get dates just
fine!
fortunately she's willing to use any position .

Oiy!

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

Of course.. interest on the loan can be written off. A sizeable portion
of the other expenses can be written off as business expenses. I could
use the boat 50% as a vacation home 50% as a business. There's nothing
wrong with that at all.

Not unless the IRS disagrees.

Correct of course, but that's why we have people who actually sign up to
be a tax attorney.

Will that same "tax attorney" defend you in a contested audit?

I was talking about your accountant, but what the hell, if going to
prison floats your boat, go for it.

I guess if I were doing something illegal and my accountant were a part of
it, we would have adjoining cells. g

Is he cute? Is he your type? g

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
oups.com...
This is so very sad.

And incredibly stupid--this whole inane discussion, that is.


Only because in the end you were exposed.

Please tell me how I was exposed, Bubbles. Joe's little pseudo-rhetorical
mantra made no sense whatsoever. Then again neither do you.

Never mind.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Invite them to lunch! I was at a party a few of years ago, mingling,
trolling, whatever. There was a really hot babe that I observed wasn't
getting much attention. This is odd, he thinks... so over I go. She seems
very nice, seems glad that someone is talking to her... and not that I'm a
stranger to foxy women, I will admit to not being the most dashing ...
dogs don't regularly bark and strong men don't weep either, however.
Anyway, we're having a nice conversation, when finally the subject of jobs
comes up. Turns out, she's an IRS auditor. Of course, I was edging away at
this point... my name? Umm... trying to make something up that didn't
sound dorky... then she added that she was involved in Fortune 500
audits... not small businesses or individs. We continued to have a great
time (never dated in earnest) that evening. At one point, someone came up
to me and asked me if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's
hot!, and I mentioned your name I said. g

That's my standard line when chatting with any government official,
especially FBI, BATF, or IRS. I generally become obnoxious, denigrating
government service, and finish with a few well-chosen epithets regarding the
individual's parentage. Then I tell them, " . . . and you can take that to
the bank, or my name isn't Jon Ganz."

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Commode Joe " wrote ...
On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 16:46:29 -0500, "Scotty"
wrote:

Two weeks ago I got a letter from IRS, they wanted another
$1,078
from 2003 returns.
Sheesh!

SV


Can't you do ANYTHING right?


Commode Joe Redcloud

Do you believe everything that you read?

SBV

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

Of course.. interest on the loan can be written off. A sizeable portion
of the other expenses can be written off as business expenses. I could
use the boat 50% as a vacation home 50% as a business. There's nothing
wrong with that at all.

Not unless the IRS disagrees.

Correct of course, but that's why we have people who actually sign up to
be a tax attorney.

Will that same "tax attorney" defend you in a contested audit?

I was talking about your accountant, but what the hell, if going to
prison floats your boat, go for it.

I guess if I were doing something illegal and my accountant were a part
of it, we would have adjoining cells. g

Is he cute? Is he your type? g


Yes, and she would.

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

That's a bummer...

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Scotty" wrote in message
...
Two weeks ago I got a letter from IRS, they wanted another $1,078
from 2003 returns.
Sheesh!

SV


"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Having been audited myself, I can say that I'm not a big fan.
Fortunately,
they backed down, but it wasn't a lot of fun. It was right
around the time
of the Unibomber, and I got to the point where I could see his
point.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Martin Baxter" wrote in message
...
"Capt. JG" wrote:
At one point, someone came up to me and asked me
if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's hot!,
and I
mentioned
your name I said. g


I guess the IRS is pretty much universally hated down there.
My niece is
an auditor for Revenue Canada, she seems to get dates just
fine!
Unfortunately she's unwilling to use her position to help old
Unle Marty
out, I got audited last year anyway! (In the end Rev. Can.
said
everything was fine and I could stop holding my breath).

Cheers
Marty
------------ And now a word from our
sponsor ---------------------
For a secure high performance FTP using SSL/TLS encryption
upgrade to SurgeFTP
---- See
ttp://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_surgeftp.htm ----

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Hahahahaaa.... funny, because I do the same thing with your name.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Invite them to lunch! I was at a party a few of years ago, mingling,
trolling, whatever. There was a really hot babe that I observed wasn't
getting much attention. This is odd, he thinks... so over I go. She seems
very nice, seems glad that someone is talking to her... and not that I'm
a stranger to foxy women, I will admit to not being the most dashing ...
dogs don't regularly bark and strong men don't weep either, however.
Anyway, we're having a nice conversation, when finally the subject of
jobs comes up. Turns out, she's an IRS auditor. Of course, I was edging
away at this point... my name? Umm... trying to make something up that
didn't sound dorky... then she added that she was involved in Fortune 500
audits... not small businesses or individs. We continued to have a great
time (never dated in earnest) that evening. At one point, someone came up
to me and asked me if I *knew* who I was talking with... yeah, so, she's
hot!, and I mentioned your name I said. g

That's my standard line when chatting with any government official,
especially FBI, BATF, or IRS. I generally become obnoxious, denigrating
government service, and finish with a few well-chosen epithets regarding
the individual's parentage. Then I tell them, " . . . and you can take
that to the bank, or my name isn't Jon Ganz."

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Usable cheeze or old meat....

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Capt. JG" wrote in message
...
Bzzt. Slightly more than 5%, and it's not a boat loan! My IRA return
is nearly double that. Real Estate (so far) is triple or better.

Please give me the name of the investment firm doing your
IRA--according to MONEY magazine, the best in the country are just
barely doing better than 6% yield. As for real estate, big money can
be made in your area, but only if you invested some time ago. I'm
betting that you don't have the means to invest in anything of
substance today, considering that just about anything bigger than a
postage stamp in the Bay Area goes for megabucks. If you have the
means to make those sorts of RE investments, you have the means to buy
your boats for cash. And that's my point--unless you can get a high
rate of return on investments you can afford--better than the interest
on your boat loan (or your home equity loan, if that makes you feel
better)--you're better off paying cash for the boat. From a strictly
financial basis, you're better off not buying a boat at all.

Well, I agree with your last statement, but I like to sail. It's a
curse really.

You're also making some assumptions that are not valid... e.g., where I
invest in RE.

Let me ask you this, Jon: if your home equity loans are so cheap and
your investments so damn productive, why haven't you maxed out your
home equity and invested it?????

Why do you think I haven't? (A rhetorical question)

You've already indicated that you haven't by stating that you either
have, or plan to, take a home equity loan to buy your boat.

Max

But what if I have more than one house? g

What if the moon is made of green cheese? :-p

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

The Phantom?

http://www.rolls-roycemotorcars.com/

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

OzOne wrote in message ...
On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 22:23:41 GMT, Captain Joe Redcloud
scribbled thusly:

On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 10:51:45 -0800, "Capt. JG"
wrote:

But what if I have more than one house? g

For those who just tuned in... Gayanzy HAD a 20 foot sailboat that he
bought for
$75. There's nothing wrong with that. However, as far as his financial
situation
goes, he SOLD the boat because he couldn't afford the upkeep on a 20 foot
$75
boat. If Gayanzy has even one house, it's the one that he got with the
deluxe
pink barbie dreamhouse kit when he was a much younger faggot.


Commodore Joe Redcloud

There is a tale here of one of Australians wealthiest men who at one
stage while his property portfolio was growing, was unable to afford
new tyres for his Rolls Royce and was boked for bald tyres.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.

I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Our investment on that was only 50K cash. The
property was sold last year for 20 times what we paid, plus a nice tax
benefit for restoring a 90 year old building.


Maxprop wrote:
Uh huh. We're supposed to accept your claim that your gross yield was
$1million? Whatever.


Of course you're supposed to accept without questioning, or
even thinking! See, once you actually consider the
Boobster's claims in the light of any tiny slice of reality,
it falls apart.




Two years ago I bought some land along Lake Michigan for $200K and sold it
this summer for well over two million dollars.

Oh wait, I just made that up. Like you.


Might as well have been 3 mill, then.

Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two
years during which time it not only went up to $90 but
split, while paying a 4% dividend, then I not only sold it
all but shorted twice as much... guess how much that netted?

Real estate speculation of the nature you describe is highly risky and
seldom pays off the way you claim it did. Being in the right place at the
right time is great, if you have a crystal ball or a clairvoyant aunt. More
often the costs involved with such speculation eat the investor alive and
mitigate any possibility of a decent return. For the average person, such a
lofty return on investment is simply not in the stars. For the average
person, the investment opportunities available, whether real estate or
paper, won't return anything near the interest rate paid on a boat loan.


Yep, think about it... why would the bank loan you money at
X% if it was a sure thing they could earn X+% on these
wonderful real estate deals? There are very few REITs paying
over 8.5% nowadays, and there are a few that specialize in
rehab real estate.

DSK

Thank You JEFF!!! ... racing
 

To some extent, that's always true isn't it? Life is a popularity contest.


Maxprop wrote:
Of course. It's not what you know, it's whom.


Or what you know about whom.

Actually, facts are very powerful. You just always have to
remember that facts & logic can be trumped by stupidity &
nepotism; and try to either avoid those situations or only
get into them where you are likley to be favored.


Fortunately I was the fleet scorer for both our Snipe and Laser fleets. I
was approached by a parent on one occasion in an effort to get a kid's
finishing position changed in one race in the junior regionals. It would
have made the difference between second and third overall for his kid. When
I rejected his attempt to "reason" with me, I was offered cash. When I
rejected that, I was threatened. A predictable pattern.


That's really low. That's worse than anything I've heard of,
although I've seen a fair number of scoring errors and/or
inexplicable final placings. If I knew of a sailor who tried
to bribe the scorer, that would be an issue to tell USSA
(and the region) about.

At one point, as a club officer, I handed over a very nice
perpetual trophy to a sailor whom we later found had faked
printed regatta results to show that he had a regional high
point score. Pinhead! He never lived that down and gave up
sailing the very next year. A shame really, because he was a
pretty good sailor.


I suspect similar stories are played and replayed at yacht clubs throughout
the world. I gave up showing horses many years ago when I discovered that
the politics of that particular activity were no different or worse than
those in most other hobbies or sports. I still race, but I've mellowed
enough to find comfort in the knowledge that sailboat racing just ain't
important enough to get upset about. Larry Ellison might disagree.


The thing to do is 1- enjoy it no matter how you place 2-
stay away from entanglements with other boats that will lead
to protests 3- work hard to get so good that you blow
everyone's doors off and there's no question whatever over
your score. If you ever get to 3- it's time to move to a
more competitive class.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"DSK" wrote in message

Maxprop wrote:

Two years ago I bought some land along Lake Michigan for $200K and sold
it this summer for well over two million dollars.

Oh wait, I just made that up. Like you.


Might as well have been 3 mill, then.

On second thought it *was* $3M.


Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two years during
which time it not only went up to $90 but split, while paying a 4%
dividend, then I not only sold it all but shorted twice as much... guess
how much that netted?

Not knowing how many shares you bought it would be difficult. Care to tell
us?

Real estate speculation of the nature you describe is highly risky and
seldom pays off the way you claim it did. Being in the right place at
the right time is great, if you have a crystal ball or a clairvoyant
aunt. More often the costs involved with such speculation eat the
investor alive and mitigate any possibility of a decent return. For the
average person, such a lofty return on investment is simply not in the
stars. For the average person, the investment opportunities available,
whether real estate or paper, won't return anything near the interest
rate paid on a boat loan.


Yep, think about it... why would the bank loan you money at X% if it was a
sure thing they could earn X+% on these wonderful real estate deals? There
are very few REITs paying over 8.5% nowadays, and there are a few that
specialize in rehab real estate.

Well, you must be wrong, Doug. Capt. Bubbles and Mr. Ganz are both
realizing monster profits from straight RE investments. Bubbles is, no
doubt, the RE rehab king of NYC. And those stupid banks just don't get it,
do they.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!! ... racing
 

"DSK" wrote in message
. ..
To some extent, that's always true isn't it? Life is a popularity
contest.


Maxprop wrote:
Of course. It's not what you know, it's whom.


Or what you know about whom.

Actually, facts are very powerful. You just always have to remember that
facts & logic can be trumped by stupidity & nepotism; and try to either
avoid those situations or only get into them where you are likley to be
favored.

By the time you discover you're knee deep in a good old boy system, it's
usually too late. But the old adage, "fool me once, shame on you; fool me
twice, shame on me" is applicable.

Fortunately I was the fleet scorer for both our Snipe and Laser fleets.
I was approached by a parent on one occasion in an effort to get a kid's
finishing position changed in one race in the junior regionals. It would
have made the difference between second and third overall for his kid.
When I rejected his attempt to "reason" with me, I was offered cash.
When I rejected that, I was threatened. A predictable pattern.

That's really low. That's worse than anything I've heard of, although I've
seen a fair number of scoring errors and/or inexplicable final placings.
If I knew of a sailor who tried to bribe the scorer, that would be an
issue to tell USSA (and the region) about.

That's not quite as simple as it sounds. I reported the incident to SCIRA
(it was the Snipe Junior Regionals), to the Executive Secretary, a man named
'Buzz' at the time, and he promised to take some action on the issue, which
of course never happened. It was always my suspicion that the kid's old
man, who was very well-connected in a great many circles, probably
threatened Buzz as well, or perhaps Buzz took the bribe. I was asked the
following year to step down from the job of Snipe fleet scorer, which was my
first experience of just how whistle-blowers are regarded in our modern
society.


At one point, as a club officer, I handed over a very nice perpetual
trophy to a sailor whom we later found had faked printed regatta results
to show that he had a regional high point score. Pinhead! He never lived
that down and gave up sailing the very next year. A shame really, because
he was a pretty good sailor.

I never relied on fleet competitors to provide us with regatta results. Oh
sure, I listened the following weekend while they boasted or complained
about their finishes, but took the results from the SCIRA monthly magazine
as gospel. Today we'd simply get the results from the class website.

I suspect similar stories are played and replayed at yacht clubs
throughout the world. I gave up showing horses many years ago when I
discovered that the politics of that particular activity were no
different or worse than those in most other hobbies or sports. I still
race, but I've mellowed enough to find comfort in the knowledge that
sailboat racing just ain't important enough to get upset about. Larry
Ellison might disagree.

The thing to do is 1- enjoy it no matter how you place 2- stay away from
entanglements with other boats that will lead to protests 3- work hard to
get so good that you blow everyone's doors off and there's no question
whatever over your score. If you ever get to 3- it's time to move to a
more competitive class.

Good advice. When rounding marks in a crowd when I have the inside line, I
generally stand up at the helm position and point at individual boats
telling each if they have rights or not w/r/t me. It ****es some folks off,
but it has been 100% effective in preventing BS and protests. One sailor
approached me after a race and said, "You sure take your sailing seriously,
doncha?" I responded, "Not really. I do, however, take nonsense
seriously."

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Wow Max you must be psychotic. I mean psychic.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
ink.net...

"DSK" wrote in message

Maxprop wrote:

Two years ago I bought some land along Lake Michigan for $200K and sold
it this summer for well over two million dollars.

Oh wait, I just made that up. Like you.


Might as well have been 3 mill, then.

On second thought it *was* $3M.


Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two years during
which time it not only went up to $90 but split, while paying a 4%
dividend, then I not only sold it all but shorted twice as much... guess
how much that netted?

Not knowing how many shares you bought it would be difficult. Care to
tell us?

Real estate speculation of the nature you describe is highly risky and
seldom pays off the way you claim it did. Being in the right place at
the right time is great, if you have a crystal ball or a clairvoyant
aunt. More often the costs involved with such speculation eat the
investor alive and mitigate any possibility of a decent return. For the
average person, such a lofty return on investment is simply not in the
stars. For the average person, the investment opportunities available,
whether real estate or paper, won't return anything near the interest
rate paid on a boat loan.


Yep, think about it... why would the bank loan you money at X% if it was
a sure thing they could earn X+% on these wonderful real estate deals?
There are very few REITs paying over 8.5% nowadays, and there are a few
that specialize in rehab real estate.

Well, you must be wrong, Doug. Capt. Bubbles and Mr. Ganz are both
realizing monster profits from straight RE investments. Bubbles is, no
doubt, the RE rehab king of NYC. And those stupid banks just don't get
it, do they.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Might as well have been 3 mill, then.


Maxprop wrote:
On second thought it *was* $3M.


Careful, the IRS is listening!



Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two years during
which time it not only went up to $90 but split, while paying a 4%
dividend, then I not only sold it all but shorted twice as much... guess
how much that netted?


Not knowing how many shares you bought it would be difficult. Care to tell
us?


Of course not, but it was more than you made or I wouldn't
have mentioned it.

Bubbles already knows how much anyway.


stars. For the average person, the investment opportunities available,
whether real estate or paper, won't return anything near the interest
rate paid on a boat loan.


Yep, think about it... why would the bank loan you money at X% if it was a
sure thing they could earn X+% on these wonderful real estate deals? There
are very few REITs paying over 8.5% nowadays, and there are a few that
specialize in rehab real estate.


Well, you must be wrong, Doug. Capt. Bubbles and Mr. Ganz are both
realizing monster profits from straight RE investments. Bubbles is, no
doubt, the RE rehab king of NYC. And those stupid banks just don't get it,
do they.


That's why bank stock is such a terrible investment ;)

DSK

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

FREE: NEW Internet Marketing Campaign to MAXIMIZE YOUR EXPOSER. For
other marketing business Automatic replies strategies Call Paul
Runninghorse Vigil 303-284-0636 or send email:
Web Site: http://www.capitalvigilfundingdept.com
I am cash buyer of real estate properties and privately held mortgage
notes.

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Might as well have been 3 mill, then.


Maxprop wrote:
On second thought it *was* $3M.


Careful, the IRS is listening!



Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two years during
which time it not only went up to $90 but split, while paying a 4%
dividend, then I not only sold it all but shorted twice as much... guess
how much that netted?


Not knowing how many shares you bought it would be difficult. Care to
tell us?


Of course not, but it was more than you made or I wouldn't have mentioned
it.

More than $4M I made on the sale of my waterfront RE?? P'shaw.

Max

Thank You JEFF!!!
 

Is your middle name Yoda?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Maxprop" wrote in message
nk.net...

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Might as well have been 3 mill, then.


Maxprop wrote:
On second thought it *was* $3M.


Careful, the IRS is listening!



Shucks I bought IBM stock at $35 a share, kept it for two years during
which time it not only went up to $90 but split, while paying a 4%
dividend, then I not only sold it all but shorted twice as much... guess
how much that netted?


Not knowing how many shares you bought it would be difficult. Care to
tell us?


Of course not, but it was more than you made or I wouldn't have mentioned
it.

More than $4M I made on the sale of my waterfront RE?? P'shaw.

Max