The c/b does that, too, as it pivots back nicely. I have a pennant
going fwd to a block then back to a clam cleat under the centre thwart
so I can raise it a little at a time to keep max plane. When you hear
the grating noise, it's time to haul a bit more. Rudder kicks up when
it hits the bottom.


Flying Tadpole wrote:
No, not what I meant. Leeboards will _still_ give you some lateral
plane (also tunnel effects) at the point where you have your c/b all the
way up and there's only 1cm of water under your keel.

That's true. The leeboards are better at the super-shallow sailing. But
they also have twice as much drag.

Not sure if the "tunnel effect" is helpful or hurtful, that kind of
hydrodynamics is very picky.


I have a couple of paddles. They were cheap. They are of marginal use
if you're by yourself. Gotta get some oars which means (re)fitting the
rowlocks. Dunno how I'll go with them, tho, given the restricted range
of movement in the arm. Only one way to find out.


Rowing can be very therapeutic. Remember to take it easy at first,
that's the difficult part. I tend to get all wound up and pull like hell
then suffer later.


Short strokes, Peter, Short strokes. My nymph dinghy only allows 7ft
oars, and it's a real bummer at first to respond to the little strokes
they enforce (hard long strokes tip the dinghy over...

??? Never had that problem.
Another useful technique is to alternate sides, this keeps the stroke
short. It makes the boat waggle from side to side but if you get the
timing right this helps visibility.


How is the CCA pine doing as its own antifoul?



Nothing seems to be living on it.


Now I'm curious. What is "CCA pine?"



Gonna haul this afternoon. I've
decided the bowsprit was a good idea but now there's too much lee helm.
I'll make a new mast base about a foot back and then make a new set of
stays & shrouds to suit. I never did like the existing chainplates
anyway, and I have a huge supply of scrap.

Keep in mind this is going to change the sheeting geometry. A foot is a
lot! You sure you don't want to trial it at a bit less? How far back
have you raked the mast? This will give you a good way to measure how
far back to move the CE.

.... Sometimes I think I took up
boats to finally have a hobby where I'd never run out of things to do,
things to change, things to repair and tools to play with while doing
it. The sailing side is pretty cool, too.


Moderation in all things... don't be like Vito and focus solely on
working on the boat!


You _could_ have rigged unstayed, it would be saner if less weatherly
for such a craft.


Not necessarily less weatherly. The engineering would be a bit more
intense, remember he's flying a bigger headsail.



Might build an elongated Buehler Pogo next, just for fun. Gaff schooner
rig. I have a Yanmar 3HP diesel engine with g/box that needs a boat.


Ah. I retract my previous statement. Nothing wrong with your sanity index.


I guess all is relative

http://www.georgebuehler.com/pogo.html

Looks like a fun boat, but it's a lot heavier than FT2.

FResh Breezes- Doug King

DSK wrote:
The c/b does that, too, as it pivots back nicely. I have a pennant
going fwd to a block then back to a clam cleat under the centre thwart
so I can raise it a little at a time to keep max plane. When you hear
the grating noise, it's time to haul a bit more. Rudder kicks up when
it hits the bottom.



Flying Tadpole wrote:

No, not what I meant. Leeboards will _still_ give you some lateral
plane (also tunnel effects) at the point where you have your c/b all
the way up and there's only 1cm of water under your keel.


That's true. The leeboards are better at the super-shallow sailing. But
they also have twice as much drag.

Yes, but his problem was getting wrecked in the shoals. One
accepts drag as payment if it helps you get out. BTW now is the
time one is supposed to drag Dutch leeboarders out as the prize
example, but it's actually fallacious; leeboards were used as
much because they avoid slotting a hull, and so allow a
potentially stronger hull, as for their shallow sailing
abilities. An entire hull is an advantage if you keep boun\cing
on sand at low tide!


Not sure if the "tunnel effect" is helpful or hurtful, that kind of
hydrodynamics is very picky.

On FLying Tadpole the FIrst, it was hurtful until I got the
leeboards the right distance out and the right toe-in, then it
was helpful...


I have a couple of paddles. They were cheap. They are of marginal use
if you're by yourself. Gotta get some oars which means (re)fitting the
rowlocks. Dunno how I'll go with them, tho, given the restricted range
of movement in the arm. Only one way to find out.



Rowing can be very therapeutic. Remember to take it easy at first,
that's the difficult part. I tend to get all wound up and pull like hell
then suffer later.


Short strokes, Peter, Short strokes. My nymph dinghy only allows 7ft
oars, and it's a real bummer at first to respond to the little strokes
they enforce (hard long strokes tip the dinghy over...


??? Never had that problem.
Another useful technique is to alternate sides, this keeps the stroke
short. It makes the boat waggle from side to side but if you get the
timing right this helps visibility.

It would make my little pram go round'n'round like a coracle...


How is the CCA pine doing as its own antifoul?




Nothing seems to be living on it.



Now I'm curious. What is "CCA pine?"

Apple urgies. Copper Chrome Arsenate pressure-treated softwood.
"PermaPine". Impervious to rot, lethal to borers, white ants,
unfortunate propensity to poison you if used as barbeque fuel,
but also prone to explode when overheated...when it
disintegrates, leaves traces of (you guessed it) copper, chrome
and arsenic. Safe to lean against, not to chew contemplatively.
Sawdust nearly as poisonous as western red cedar.

snip



You _could_ have rigged unstayed, it would be saner if less weatherly
for such a craft.


Not necessarily less weatherly. The engineering would be a bit more
intense, remember he's flying a bigger headsail.

Well, that's a mistake in an unstayed craft. Use a bigger main.
Or dispose of the jib entirely and replace it with the forward
bit of a balanced lug!

Might build an elongated Buehler Pogo next, just for fun. Gaff schooner
rig. I have a Yanmar 3HP diesel engine with g/box that needs a boat.



Ah. I retract my previous statement. Nothing wrong with your sanity
index.


I guess all is relative

There is no relative with a schooner of any sort. It is all
superlative.

http://www.georgebuehler.com/pogo.html

Looks like a fun boat, but it's a lot heavier than FT2.

Yeah, but he doesn't need to be a hyperfit young adult to drive
it, either. FT2 is going to come home from Port Augusta soon,
get stripped back to wood-epoxy, critical things fixed, then sold
as is. Harsh physical reality is I'm unlikely to sail her again
and I need all maintenenace time at present to keep Lady Kate
happy.--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner
http://music.download.com/timfatchen
http://music.download.com/internetopera

That's true. The leeboards are better at the super-shallow sailing.
But they also have twice as much drag.


Flying Tadpole wrote:
Yes, but his problem was getting wrecked in the shoals. One accepts drag
as payment if it helps you get out.

Actually, I was thinking of them dragging the bottom...

... BTW now is the time one is supposed
to drag Dutch leeboarders out as the prize example, but it's actually
fallacious; leeboards were used as much because they avoid slotting a
hull, and so allow a potentially stronger hull, as for their shallow
sailing abilities.

An advantage that has been negated by modern technology.

... An entire hull is an advantage if you keep boun\cing
on sand at low tide!


Yes much better than a partial hull, I'm sure


Not sure if the "tunnel effect" is helpful or hurtful, that kind of
hydrodynamics is very picky.


On FLying Tadpole the FIrst, it was hurtful until I got the leeboards
the right distance out and the right toe-in, then it was helpful...


Toe-in is "tunnel effect"? I thought you mean the pressure change due to
flow between the hull & leeboard.

BTW a centerboard can be set to angle itslef slightly to windward, just
like toe-in with leeboards, bilgeboards, or catamaran foils. This used
to be called a "gybing" board and it's a big help.



??? Never had that problem.
Another useful technique is to alternate sides, this keeps the stroke
short. It makes the boat waggle from side to side but if you get the
timing right this helps visibility.


It would make my little pram go round'n'round like a coracle...


Try shorter strokes.


I guess all is relative


There is no relative with a schooner of any sort. It is all superlative.


I meant relative sanity.

FWIW I agree about schooners. I have only sailed a few but always
admired them tremendously. Here it's commonly said that schooners are an
American rig, even an American invention, but one sees native schooner
types all over the world. I'm sad to hear you're planning on selling
FT2, it has been a pleasure to sail her vicariously.

BTW did I ever send you that picture of the FT2 sistership with the box
cabin?

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

snip
Not sure if the "tunnel effect" is helpful or hurtful, that kind of
hydrodynamics is very picky.



On FLying Tadpole the FIrst, it was hurtful until I got the leeboards
the right distance out and the right toe-in, then it was helpful...


Toe-in is "tunnel effect"? I thought you mean the pressure change due to
flow between the hull & leeboard.


No, the distance I had the leeboards out from the hull was one
thing and their toe-in another (FT1 had leeboards mounted on an
outrigger boom, not directly on the canoe's hull. And the hull
was still widening at the point the boom crossed it, so water
flow faced a constrciting passage, not parallel. A few cm in or
out made a surprisign difference. Then I fiddled with the toe in .)

BTW a centerboard can be set to angle itslef slightly to windward, just
like toe-in with leeboards, bilgeboards, or catamaran foils. This used
to be called a "gybing" board and it's a big help.
snip

FWIW I agree about schooners. I have only sailed a few but always
admired them tremendously. Here it's commonly said that schooners are an
American rig, even an American invention, but one sees native schooner
types all over the world. I'm sad to hear you're planning on selling
FT2, it has been a pleasure to sail her vicariously.

BTW did I ever send you that picture of the FT2 sistership with the box
cabin?

Yes thanks. One day when I finally update the Light Schooner
page I will put it up.

--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
http://www.ace.net.au/schooner
http://music.download.com/timfatchen
http://music.download.com/internetopera

In article , DSK
wrote:

I have a couple of paddles. They were cheap. They are of marginal use
if you're by yourself. Gotta get some oars which means (re)fitting the
rowlocks. Dunno how I'll go with them, tho, given the restricted range
of movement in the arm. Only one way to find out.


Rowing can be very therapeutic. Remember to take it easy at first,
that's the difficult part. I tend to get all wound up and pull like hell
then suffer later.

This boat had rowlocks on it but the wood was all rotten, so when I
stripped it back, they went. Only take me a few hours to replace them.
It's on the job list.

Gonna haul this afternoon. I've
decided the bowsprit was a good idea but now there's too much lee helm.
I'll make a new mast base about a foot back and then make a new set of
stays & shrouds to suit. I never did like the existing chainplates
anyway, and I have a huge supply of scrap.

Keep in mind this is going to change the sheeting geometry. A foot is a
lot! You sure you don't want to trial it at a bit less? How far back
have you raked the mast? This will give you a good way to measure how
far back to move the CE.

It's a PITA. The existing stays were cut to exact length by the PO so
you can't adjust rake without cutting them, adding turnbuckles etc etc.
By the time you do all that, might as well make a new spot to put the
mast too. Moving the mast aft to the fwd thwart is the next good strong
point to feed thrust to the keel; I rebuilt all the woodwork so I know
it'll handle any load likely to be inflicted on it. I might be able to
do less than a foot, haven't really measured it yet. The boat is now
next to the shop ready for work, I hauled it last night on the high
tide. Having a waterfront makes things simple. I built my own beach
launching ramp.

Ah. I retract my previous statement. Nothing wrong with your sanity index.


I guess all is relative

http://www.georgebuehler.com/pogo.html

Looks like a fun boat, but it's a lot heavier than FT2.

Yeah, George says it's a minature displacement sailboat not a dinghy.
Pretty simple to build IMO. I've had the plans for 2-3 years, promised
to build one for my youngest daughter. It won't go fast but it probably
won't drown her either, and you could go fishing from it easily. Nobody
is going to worry overmuch if you run aground, bounce off the odd
oyster covered rock etc etc. Pretty cheap to build too, so if/when you
don't want to play with it any more, you can pass it on to someone else
to play with cheaply or even for free.

PDW