Dear Group,

Please allow me to express my opinion of the fanatic care and feeding of trim
wood on sailboats.

1) Those who spend time, effort and dollars on so-called 'brightwork' are more
interested in showing than going. DSK is a good example of this stupidity with
his bragging about all the time his wife spends on the varnishing. Please note
that this maintenance time is down-time.

2) If the wood is functional, such as the spreaders on Joe's fine, blue-water,
steel vessel, then, by all means, do take care of this functional wood in any
manner which preserves it the best. If you like the way several coats of varnish
looks and don't mind the extra work then use varnish. On the other hand, if you
are more interested in longevity and protection without the constant work then
use a quality enamel paint to cover and seal the wood.

3) Teak trim on a sailboat is just that - trim. It is unnecessary and just makes it so
you need to spend more time maintaining and less time sailing (or motoring as in
the case of DSK). Fools like Doug would rather walk up and down a dock and
criticize the brightwork on other boats and compare it to theirs than spend time
actually using their boats for the intended purpose which is NOT a constant,
futile, never-ending cycle of brightwork maintenance. Even allowing his wife
to do the brightwork when Doug states he would rather paint the wood shows
he is no man.

4) Real sailors replace all wood trim with plastic or they prepare the wood carefully
one time and then paint it with a quality paint (or they remove it). If the painted
wood is in an area where it can wear (such as foot traffic, line chafe, etc.),
then the wood should be protected with steel. (Joe is smarter than most of you,
face it!)
Please check out how I painted and protected the two pieces of teak that remained
on the deck of my fine vessel. Click on the following link and scroll down toward
the middle where a photo of the companionway hatch is shown (sstrim.jpg) and you'll
note the teak is painted white (with Petit Easypoxy) and protected from foot traffic
by a polished stainless steel strake. http://captneal.homestead.com/littleperfections.html

5) I have tossed the constantly-rotting, teak, cockpit locker covers and replaced them with
maintenance-free plastic. http://captneal.homestead.com/bristol.html
I will replace the teak-faced, plywood, companionway washboards with the same white
plastic (Star Board) as soon as they rot out more and become unserviceable.

I will never spend one more dollar or one more minute of my sailing time varnishing exterior
wood. It is a never-ending waste of time and money. People who spend any time, whatsoever,
doing their "brightwork" are not sailors but pretenders who show off their brightwork
because they cannot show-off their sailing skills because they don't have the time to develop
any. I find people who have their priorities all wrong like this totally boring and disgusting.
They impress me about as much as some conceited, fat fool wearing a bunch of heavy, gold
chains around his neck and they share similar personality traits - all show and no go!

I hope this helps put things in the proper perspective.


Respectfully,
Capt. Neal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do
than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor.
Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover. -- Mark Twain






"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message news:w%iXd.9210$ZO2.3913@edtnps84...
Since it's approaching... well okay it's at least a month and a half away
for some of us... time to consider what approach to use on the vessel's
wood trim this year, I thought I would start the annual ASA wood treatment
thread.

There are those who use Varnish, those who use Cetol, those who use Tung Oil
and some of you that use your own secret recipe.

What is your preferred method and how do you apply the finish?

To start of... I have used varnish, and wasn't convinced that the work to
produce such luster was worth the effort of application for one season of
duration. I've even tried cetol and was not impressed with the results on
both occasions. For years I simply used Teak Oil or Tung Oil and kept a kit
aboard for touch ups as required. It's easy to apply and clean up is no
problem. The woodwork shows a nice colour and retains it's texture. Last
season I applied teak oil and let it dry before applying a coat of clear
Behr deck waterproofing, UV inhibitor sealant. It seemed to work since I
had no reason to reapply further teak oil all season. Yet this year I
noticed some greying of the teak... so here I go again. What should I use
this year? Should I just give up and try another Varnish or let the teak go
grey?

CM

Crap'n Neal® wrote:
Please allow me to express my opinion of the fanatic care and feeding of
trim wood on sailboats.

1) Those who spend time, effort and dollars on so-called 'brightwork'
are more
interested in showing than going.

That may sometimes be the case. However it is also true that first, they
have the good taste to own a good-looking boat.

... DSK is a good example of this
stupidity with
his bragging about all the time his wife spends on the varnishing.
Please note
that this maintenance time is down-time.

Actually, one can varnish perfectly well underway, or anchored in a nice
cove.


3) Teak trim on a sailboat is just that - trim. It is unnecessary

Handrails and hatch slides are unnecessary?


5) I have tossed the constantly-rotting, teak,

Actually teak is *very* resistant to rot. In fact under normal
conditions and given even half-competent care, it will never rot.

If yours were rotting then where does that leave you?


.. I will replace the
teak-faced, plywood, companionway washboards with the same white
plastic (Star Board) as soon as they rot out more and become unserviceable.

You can buy the same plastic stuff at Home Depot for less than half the
cost.


I will never spend one more dollar or one more minute of my sailing
time varnishing exterior
wood.

Since you don't ever spend any time sailing, that's easy for you to say.

DSK

Well now; Woodwork,

That is an APT word for it Wood Work! Plenty of work!

This old man has been the whole route, more than once or twice. I
haven't YET decided what is best. The best looking I think is the well
sanded teak. Sanded in stages down in grit size until the teak has the
look of polish and then the multi layers of Varnish. When just done
beautiful when aged; Ugly.

I've just now, at the present time, just returned to teak oil, without
any hardener. Pure teak oil. A lot of care. Frequent care but the
easiest of all care. Can be done under way while on auto pilot. Can be
done half ass or not. Can start and stop without a problem. BUT!!! It
has to be done often and has to be done.

The interior of my boat is teak, as the pictures show. I use the apply
and rub down and finish with a hand rub. I'm to old for that **** now.

I do the floor with oil applied with a long handle brush. When the floor
stops taking oil I use the same brush on bulkheads, lockers and shelves.
I hand finish with a paper towel soaked with oil.

Do the same with paper towel on hand holds, Hatch slides and main hatch
doors.

I do kind of agree, right now with Neal. The boat is for sailing
pleasure but good looking trim does increase that pleasure.
It is different when moored in a marina than when you're hanging on a
hook. Comparisons are made

Ole Thom




http://community.webtv.net/tassail/ThomsPage

"DSK" wrote in message

Actually, one can varnish perfectly well underway, or anchored in a nice
cove.

The Pardeys were proof-positive of this. They did brightwork and woodwork
jobs as a means of acquiring funds underway, and considered their boat a
sales tool. So they kept Serrafin and Taleisin in bristol condition
constantly, which often meant doing maintenance underway or in quiet
anchorages. AFAIK they still do.

Max

"Maxprop" opined:


The Pardeys were proof-positive of this. They did brightwork and woodwork
jobs as a means of acquiring funds underway, and considered their boat a
sales tool. So they kept Serrafin and Taleisin in bristol condition
constantly, which often meant doing maintenance underway or in quiet
anchorages. AFAIK they still do.


If your idea of cruising is doing brightwork in quiet anchorages then you are
as lame as the Pardeys. I sure do enjoy hearing power tools and generators
and smelling varinis fumes so some putz can do useless cosmetic work on his
boat. Yes siree, that's what quiet anchorages are all about. Uhuh!

I would much rather do some snorkeling, fishing, beach combing, exploring
and sailing or even just sitting in my cockpit sipping a cold beer while breathing
the fresh air, enjoying the peace and quiet and noting I have the time to do
it because I'm not a slave to brightwork. . . But, then again, I am not an
'all show but no go' type like you. I value the basics in life. I'm a man and
a sailor. You and the over-the-hill Pardeys are show-boaters who have their
priorities wrong.

CN - a go-boater, not some lame show-boater.

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message

"Maxprop" opined:


The Pardeys were proof-positive of this. They did brightwork and
woodwork jobs as a means of acquiring funds underway, and considered
their boat a sales tool. So they kept Serrafin and Taleisin in bristol
condition constantly, which often meant doing maintenance underway or in
quiet anchorages. AFAIK they still do.


If your idea of cruising is doing brightwork in quiet anchorages then you
are
as lame as the Pardeys. I sure do enjoy hearing power tools and
generators
and smelling varinis fumes so some putz can do useless cosmetic work on
his boat. Yes siree, that's what quiet anchorages are all about. Uhuh!

I would much rather do some snorkeling, fishing, beach combing, exploring
and sailing or even just sitting in my cockpit sipping a cold beer while
breathing
the fresh air, enjoying the peace and quiet and noting I have the time to
do it because I'm not a slave to brightwork. . . But, then again, I am
not an 'all show but no go' type like you. I value the basics in life. I'm
a man and a sailor. You and the over-the-hill Pardeys are show-boaters who
have their
priorities wrong.
CN - a go-boater, not some lame show-boater.

In other words, you are a lazy slob with no pride in his boat. Okay, I can
appreciate that, considering the "boat" you own.

Max

On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 13:53:44 -0500, Capt. Neal®
wrote this crap:

Dear Group,

Please allow me to express my opinion of the fanatic care and feeding of trim
wood on sailboats.

1) Those who spend time, effort and dollars on so-called 'brightwork' are more
interested in showing than going. DSK is a good example of this stupidity with
his bragging about all the time his wife spends on the varnishing. Please note
that this maintenance time is down-time.


DSK is lying again, as usual.





Pathetic Earthlings! No one can save you now!

ALl in all, a lovely testimony from who's boat was so cheap the manufacturer
cut corners by using plastic trim and moldings rather than teak to trim it
out...But what can we expect from someone who would re-upholster in such a
lubberly color as mauve?

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message
...
Dear Group,

Please allow me to express my opinion of the fanatic care and feeding of
trim wood on sailboats.

1) Those who spend time, effort and dollars on so-called 'brightwork' are
more
interested in showing than going. DSK is a good example of this
stupidity with
his bragging about all the time his wife spends on the varnishing.
Please note
that this maintenance time is down-time.

2) If the wood is functional, such as the spreaders on Joe's fine,
blue-water, steel vessel, then, by all means, do take care of this
functional wood in any
manner which preserves it the best. If you like the way several coats
of varnish
looks and don't mind the extra work then use varnish. On the other
hand, if you
are more interested in longevity and protection without the constant
work then
use a quality enamel paint to cover and seal the wood.
3) Teak trim on a sailboat is just that - trim. It is unnecessary and just
makes it so
you need to spend more time maintaining and less time sailing (or
motoring as in the case of DSK). Fools like Doug would rather walk up and
down a dock and criticize the brightwork on other boats and compare it to
theirs than spend time
actually using their boats for the intended purpose which is NOT a
constant, futile, never-ending cycle of brightwork maintenance. Even
allowing his wife
to do the brightwork when Doug states he would rather paint the wood
shows
he is no man.
4) Real sailors replace all wood trim with plastic or they prepare the
wood carefully
one time and then paint it with a quality paint (or they remove it).
If the painted wood is in an area where it can wear (such as foot
traffic, line chafe, etc.), then the wood should be protected with steel.
(Joe is smarter than most of you, face it!) Please check out how I painted
and protected the two pieces of teak that remained on the deck of my fine
vessel. Click on the following link and scroll down toward the middle
where a photo of the companionway hatch is shown (sstrim.jpg) and you'll
note the teak is painted white (with Petit Easypoxy) and protected from
foot traffic by a polished stainless steel strake.
http://captneal.homestead.com/littleperfections.html

5) I have tossed the constantly-rotting, teak, cockpit locker covers and
replaced them with maintenance-free plastic.
http://captneal.homestead.com/bristol.html I will replace the
teak-faced, plywood, companionway washboards with the same white plastic
(Star Board) as soon as they rot out more and become unserviceable.

I will never spend one more dollar or one more minute of my sailing
time varnishing exterior
wood. It is a never-ending waste of time and money. People who spend
any time, whatsoever,
doing their "brightwork" are not sailors but pretenders who show off
their brightwork because they cannot show-off their sailing skills because
they don't have the time to develop any. I find people who have their
priorities all wrong like this totally boring and disgusting.
They impress me about as much as some conceited, fat fool wearing a
bunch of heavy, gold chains around his neck and they share similar
personality traits - all show and no go!
I hope this helps put things in the proper perspective.


Respectfully,
Capt. Neal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you
didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail
away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore.
Dream. Discover. -- Mark Twain






"Capt. Mooron" wrote in message
news:w%iXd.9210$ZO2.3913@edtnps84...
Since it's approaching... well okay it's at least a month and a half away
for some of us... time to consider what approach to use on the vessel's
wood trim this year, I thought I would start the annual ASA wood
treatment thread.

There are those who use Varnish, those who use Cetol, those who use Tung
Oil and some of you that use your own secret recipe.

What is your preferred method and how do you apply the finish?

To start of... I have used varnish, and wasn't convinced that the work to
produce such luster was worth the effort of application for one season of
duration. I've even tried cetol and was not impressed with the results
on both occasions. For years I simply used Teak Oil or Tung Oil and kept
a kit aboard for touch ups as required. It's easy to apply and clean up
is no problem. The woodwork shows a nice colour and retains it's texture.
Last season I applied teak oil and let it dry before applying a coat of
clear Behr deck waterproofing, UV inhibitor sealant. It seemed to work
since I had no reason to reapply further teak oil all season. Yet this
year I noticed some greying of the teak... so here I go again. What
should I use this year? Should I just give up and try another Varnish or
let the teak go grey?

CM

"Capt. Neal®" wrote in message


Dear Group,

Please allow me to express my opinion of the fanatic care and feeding of
trim wood on sailboats.

1) Those who spend time, effort and dollars on so-called 'brightwork' are
more
interested in showing than going. DSK is a good example of this
stupidity with
his bragging about all the time his wife spends on the varnishing.
Please note
that this maintenance time is down-time.

So I suppose you consider Lin and Larry Pardey to be stupid for the
continued effort they make to keep their boat in bristol condition,
including frequent brightwork refinishing? You're not fit to eat off the
bilge sole of their boat. They voyaged their earlier 24' boat farther in
one year than you claim to have sailed that 27' bargain-basement Clorox
bottle during your lifetime.

2) If the wood is functional, such as the spreaders on Joe's fine,
blue-water, steel vessel, then, by all means, do take care of this
functional wood in any
manner which preserves it the best. If you like the way several coats
of varnish
looks and don't mind the extra work then use varnish. On the other
hand, if you
are more interested in longevity and protection without the constant
work then
use a quality enamel paint to cover and seal the wood.

Terrible advice. Mahogany isn't teak, and it rots along with the best of
potentially rotting woods. If a load-bearing mahogany or spruce structure,
such as a spar or spreader or tiller, one should NOT hide it under an opaque
coating. Varnish is the ONLY answer for mahogany in order to be able to see
the condition of the wood. No finish is foolproof--wood can and will rot
underneath paint or any other coating. Go back to making love to your
rubber doll, Neal, and leave boat maintenance to those who know something
about it.

3) Teak trim on a sailboat is just that - trim. It is unnecessary and just
makes it so
you need to spend more time maintaining and less time sailing (or
motoring as in the case of DSK). Fools like Doug would rather walk up and
down a dock and criticize the brightwork on other boats and compare it to
theirs than spend time
actually using their boats for the intended purpose which is NOT a
constant, futile, never-ending cycle of brightwork maintenance. Even
allowing his wife
to do the brightwork when Doug states he would rather paint the wood
shows
he is no man.

Well, no one would ever accuse you of being even remotely interested in
having a nice looking boat. Do you paint that cedar bucket?


4) Real sailors replace all wood trim with plastic or they prepare the
wood carefully
one time and then paint it with a quality paint (or they remove it).
If the painted wood is in an area where it can wear (such as foot
traffic, line chafe, etc.), then the wood should be protected with steel.
(Joe is smarter than most of you, face it!)

So, the Pardeys aren't real sailors? Or Olin Stephens? Or L. Frances
Herreshoff? Or hundreds of others with similar credentials? How amusing
for someone with a homely plastic bleach bottle boat to be pronouncing
discredit over those whose sailing credentials are among the ultimate of the
genera.

snip


I will never spend one more dollar or one more minute of my sailing time
varnishing exterior
wood. It is a never-ending waste of time and money. People who spend
any time, whatsoever,
doing their "brightwork" are not sailors but pretenders who show off
their brightwork because they cannot show-off their sailing skills because
they don't have the time to develop any. I find people who have their
priorities all wrong like this totally boring and disgusting.
They impress me about as much as some conceited, fat fool wearing a
bunch of heavy, gold chains around his neck and they share similar
personality traits - all show and no go!
I hope this helps put things in the proper perspective.

*Perverted* is not spelled "p-r-o-p-e-r," Neal.

Max